As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored. I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture. -- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8: His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs: 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused. 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused. 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH. 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well. 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused. 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 -- William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Dear William, this is a good investigation. Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR? -- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Dear colleagues, I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org. Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'. For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion. On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a
first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely
and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net :
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members
add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <
hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>,
of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used
false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
-- Andrei Kushnireuski Alfa Telecom s.r.o. REGID: cz.alfatelecom nic-hdl: AK1065-RIPE phone: +420226020360
Hello all, When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud. May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but.... RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not. On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a
first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely
and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net :
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members
add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <
hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: > x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>,
of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
> > > Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... > > LIR is nl.outsideheaven > > I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. > His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. > The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. > > 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > >
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
-- Andrei Kushnireuski Alfa Telecom s.r.o. REGID: cz.alfatelecom nic-hdl: AK1065-RIPE phone: +420226020360
-- Alexandr Gurbo
Dude, as-block: AS35840 - AS36863 descr: ARIN ASN block why RIPE would have to audit ARIN block? I'm not saying that Lu is bad, but I don't like the idea that everybody goes: hey, he has been on meetings, hands off. when you see some psycho on TV who has been working in public and their neighbors will tell you, - he was a good guy, but in the end, he ate children :D The fact that he has so much resources and visits meetings can be a good and a bad thing, he knows the system inside out. Might be that he likes IT, might be that he's abusing it. I'm not going to bash my head against the keyboard to prove something, RIPE got this. :) On 22/11/13 08:49, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud.
May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but....
RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not.
On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused. 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of
allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: the largest total provider? prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been
escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster < hostmaster@ripe.net>: > Dear William, > > All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that > demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by > members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. > > If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the > RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then > start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same > counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a > bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take > lightly. > > Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which > the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 > September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: > http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... > Kind regards, > > Andrea Cima > Registration Services Manager > RIPE NCC > > > On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>,
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net : lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
>> >> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >> >> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >> >> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >>
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RIPE NCC doesn't audit ASNs but LIRs =) Looks like this is misunderstanding/misspelling from Alexandr's side. AS35916 is assigned by ARIN and it is used by US based webhosting/colocation provider from Los Angeles. If I understand correctly the initial issue is a usage of huge amount of IPv4 outside RIPE Region and It's a reason for audit. On 22 Nov 2013, at 10:55, Jānis Jaunošāns <jj@streamnetworks.lv> wrote:
Dude, as-block: AS35840 - AS36863 descr: ARIN ASN block
why RIPE would have to audit ARIN block?
I'm not saying that Lu is bad, but I don't like the idea that everybody goes: hey, he has been on meetings, hands off. when you see some psycho on TV who has been working in public and their neighbors will tell you, - he was a good guy, but in the end, he ate children :D
The fact that he has so much resources and visits meetings can be a good and a bad thing, he knows the system inside out. Might be that he likes IT, might be that he's abusing it. I'm not going to bash my head against the keyboard to prove something, RIPE got this. :)
On 22/11/13 08:49, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud.
May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but....
RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not.
On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused. 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of
allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: the largest total provider? prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been
escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove
> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster < hostmaster@ripe.net>: >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>,
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net : lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
>>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>>
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-- Andrei Kushnireuski Alfa Telecom s.r.o. REGID: cz.alfatelecom nic-hdl: AK1065-RIPE phone: +420226020360
-- Tālrunis: +371 67788888
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
Hello all, Yes, the right to speak - start audit for LIR(s). LIR who received blocks from RIPE NCC and allow announce in ARIN region from AS35916. Andrei, thanks for correcting. Is this all allocated blocks in use? Why they announced in ARIN region? Maybe Mr. Lu explain and we will not have more question. We are live in the region served by RIPE NCC. This is our resources that given to other regions. What allocations led to the exhaustion of resources in our region. As a result, we can't get more ip address. I think this isn't normal. On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 11:21:04 +0100 Andrei Kushnireuski <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
RIPE NCC doesn't audit ASNs but LIRs =)
Looks like this is misunderstanding/misspelling from Alexandr's side.
AS35916 is assigned by ARIN and it is used by US based webhosting/colocation provider from Los Angeles.
If I understand correctly the initial issue is a usage of huge amount of IPv4 outside RIPE Region and It's a reason for audit.
On 22 Nov 2013, at 10:55, Jānis Jaunošāns <jj@streamnetworks.lv> wrote:
Dude, as-block: AS35840 - AS36863 descr: ARIN ASN block
why RIPE would have to audit ARIN block?
I'm not saying that Lu is bad, but I don't like the idea that everybody goes: hey, he has been on meetings, hands off. when you see some psycho on TV who has been working in public and their neighbors will tell you, - he was a good guy, but in the end, he ate children :D
The fact that he has so much resources and visits meetings can be a good and a bad thing, he knows the system inside out. Might be that he likes IT, might be that he's abusing it. I'm not going to bash my head against the keyboard to prove something, RIPE got this. :)
On 22/11/13 08:49, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud.
May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but....
RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not.
On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused. 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: > Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> > Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR > Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ > An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> > > Dear Andrew, > > And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... > Sorry, but this is not really any better now: > > This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total > allocations in the entire RIPE region? > > How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? > Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? > How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? > This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > Hauptplatz 3/3 > 8010 Graz > Austria > Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 > Firmenbuch: FN 308697t > > phone: +43 316 827 500 > fax: +43 316 827 500 777 > http://www.edis.at > > This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. > > Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: > >> Dear William, >> >> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >> >> Kind regards >> >> Andrew de la Haye >> Chief Operations Officer >> RIPE NCC >> >> Singel 258 >> 1016 AB Amsterdam >> the Netherlands >> andrew@ripe.net >> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >> fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net : > Dear William, > > As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior > Management. > > They will come back to you ASAP. > > Best regards, > Andrea Cima > > RIPE NCC > > > On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> Dear Andrea, >> >> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >> >> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster < hostmaster@ripe.net>: >>> Dear William, >>> >>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>> >>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>> lightly. >>> >>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Andrea Cima >>> Registration Services Manager >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> >>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>> >>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>> >>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>> >>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> >>>>
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Really, this needs to move off-list. There is clearly a personal vendetta here, and it's getting tiresome for the rest of us. Even if IPs are reclaimed from an LIR as a result of an audit, what difference is it going to make? It's not as if RIPE will start allocating from them again... If you believe there's fraud being carried out, report it to the law enforcement agencies - nothing said on this list can fix it. IPv4 is over. Move on. Focus on deploying IPv6. Simon On Fri Nov 22, 2013 at 11:49:06AM +0000, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
Yes, the right to speak - start audit for LIR(s). LIR who received blocks from RIPE NCC and allow announce in ARIN region from AS35916. Andrei, thanks for correcting.
Is this all allocated blocks in use? Why they announced in ARIN region? Maybe Mr. Lu explain and we will not have more question.
We are live in the region served by RIPE NCC. This is our resources that given to other regions. What allocations led to the exhaustion of resources in our region. As a result, we can't get more ip address. I think this isn't normal.
On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 11:21:04 +0100 Andrei Kushnireuski <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
RIPE NCC doesn't audit ASNs but LIRs =)
Looks like this is misunderstanding/misspelling from Alexandr's side.
AS35916 is assigned by ARIN and it is used by US based webhosting/colocation provider from Los Angeles.
If I understand correctly the initial issue is a usage of huge amount of IPv4 outside RIPE Region and It's a reason for audit.
On 22 Nov 2013, at 10:55, J??nis Jauno????ns <jj@streamnetworks.lv> wrote:
Dude, as-block: AS35840 - AS36863 descr: ARIN ASN block
why RIPE would have to audit ARIN block?
I'm not saying that Lu is bad, but I don't like the idea that everybody goes: hey, he has been on meetings, hands off. when you see some psycho on TV who has been working in public and their neighbors will tell you, - he was a good guy, but in the end, he ate children :D
The fact that he has so much resources and visits meetings can be a good and a bad thing, he knows the system inside out. Might be that he likes IT, might be that he's abusing it. I'm not going to bash my head against the keyboard to prove something, RIPE got this. :)
On 22/11/13 08:49, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud.
May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but....
RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not.
On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
Dear William, this is a good investigation.
Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR?
-- Kind regards, sergey myasoedov
You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM:
> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i > make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what > you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. > This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and > the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and > without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE > after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some > associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? > I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
> -- > Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands > which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com > Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most > space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). > A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive > amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs > This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) > Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. > The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation > infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT???.), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs > A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. > Seems unused. > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the > timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one???), announced on OVH.
> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs > Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. > List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): > 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs > 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 > 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 > 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 > --
> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) > william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net > EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC > Maribor, Slovenia
> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: >> Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> >> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR >> Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >> An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> >> >> Dear Andrew, >> >> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... >> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >> >> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total >> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >> >> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? >> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? >> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> Hauptplatz 3/3 >> 8010 Graz >> Austria >> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >> >> phone: +43 316 827 500 >> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >> http://www.edis.at >> >> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. >> >> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: >> >>> Dear William, >>> >>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >>> >>> Kind regards >>> >>> Andrew de la Haye >>> Chief Operations Officer >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> Singel 258 >>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>> the Netherlands >>> andrew@ripe.net >>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net > : >> Dear William, >> >> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior >> Management. >> >> They will come back to you ASAP. >> >> Best regards, >> Andrea Cima >> >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> Dear Andrea, >>> >>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster < hostmaster@ripe.net>: >>>> Dear William, >>>> >>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>>> >>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>> lightly. >>>> >>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>> Kind regards, >>>> >>>> Andrea Cima >>>> Registration Services Manager >>>> RIPE NCC >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>>> >>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>> >>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>> >>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> >>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> >>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>> William Weber >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>> NOC >>>>> >>>>>
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-- Simon Lockhart | Tel: +44 1275 793 400 | Si fractum Technical Director | Mob: +44 7789 913304 | non sit, noli Cablecom Networking Ltd | WWW: www.cablecomnetworking.co.uk | id reficere Unit 3-5 Windmill Business Park, Windmill Road, Kenn. BS21 6SR. UK
+1 And please do not reply to his RHETORICAL questions. Thomas On 22 Nov 2013, at 12:26, Simon Lockhart <s.lockhart@cablecomnetworking.co.uk> wrote:
Really, this needs to move off-list. There is clearly a personal vendetta here, and it's getting tiresome for the rest of us.
Even if IPs are reclaimed from an LIR as a result of an audit, what difference is it going to make? It's not as if RIPE will start allocating from them again...
If you believe there's fraud being carried out, report it to the law enforcement agencies - nothing said on this list can fix it.
IPv4 is over. Move on. Focus on deploying IPv6.
Simon
On Fri Nov 22, 2013 at 11:49:06AM +0000, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
Yes, the right to speak - start audit for LIR(s). LIR who received blocks from RIPE NCC and allow announce in ARIN region from AS35916. Andrei, thanks for correcting.
Is this all allocated blocks in use? Why they announced in ARIN region? Maybe Mr. Lu explain and we will not have more question.
We are live in the region served by RIPE NCC. This is our resources that given to other regions. What allocations led to the exhaustion of resources in our region. As a result, we can't get more ip address. I think this isn't normal.
On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 11:21:04 +0100 Andrei Kushnireuski <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
RIPE NCC doesn't audit ASNs but LIRs =)
Looks like this is misunderstanding/misspelling from Alexandr's side.
AS35916 is assigned by ARIN and it is used by US based webhosting/colocation provider from Los Angeles.
If I understand correctly the initial issue is a usage of huge amount of IPv4 outside RIPE Region and It's a reason for audit.
On 22 Nov 2013, at 10:55, J??nis Jauno????ns <jj@streamnetworks.lv> wrote:
Dude, as-block: AS35840 - AS36863 descr: ARIN ASN block
why RIPE would have to audit ARIN block?
I'm not saying that Lu is bad, but I don't like the idea that everybody goes: hey, he has been on meetings, hands off. when you see some psycho on TV who has been working in public and their neighbors will tell you, - he was a good guy, but in the end, he ate children :D
The fact that he has so much resources and visits meetings can be a good and a bad thing, he knows the system inside out. Might be that he likes IT, might be that he's abusing it. I'm not going to bash my head against the keyboard to prove something, RIPE got this. :)
On 22/11/13 08:49, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
Hello all,
When was last audit for AS35916? Such allocations are similar to fraud.
May be Mr. Lu open and active person, and active present at the meetings, but....
RIPE NCC stuff, to clarify incident please start audit for AS35916 and announce results to us. Don't provide to us private information about business client. Provide information on the allocated blocks. They are used for their intended purpose or not.
On Thu, 21 Nov 2013 15:47:40 +0100 Andrei <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear colleagues,
I think you're right. This LIR is a little bit strange and looks like it was registered specially for illegal purposses or IPv4 cybersquatting but I couldn't see any IPs usage for mailing by senderbase.org.
Unfortunately, this is 'normal' practice from RIPE NCC staff to reject abuses. I have sent several abuses for Spamhaus SBL listed (DROP) ranges with request for investigation but there was a single reply 'if this assignment was made it means it 100% valid for RIPE NCC'.
For me, LIR audit is a single solution at this situaion.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, sergey myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> wrote:
> Dear William, > this is a good investigation. > > Have the RIPE NCC performed the 'audit' procedure of suspicious LIR? > > > -- > Kind regards, > sergey myasoedov > > > You wrote Thursday, November 21, 2013, 3:05:40 PM: > >> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to > reply to me i >> make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i > don't care what >> you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps > to get others involved. >> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was > ignored. > >> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, > no replies and >> the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was > again useless and >> without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form > to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) > >> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent > my mail to RIPE >> after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few > calls to some >> associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? >> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own > picture. > >> -- >> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in > the Netherlands >> which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling > to a /8: > >> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - > http://outsideheaven.com >> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as > far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. > >> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs > AS now most >> space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). >> A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet > massive >> amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or > his companies at all RIRs: > >> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus > (Seychelles) >> Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to > OutsideHeaven. >> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of > "CloudInnovation >> infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT???.), most IPs are > not announced at all and seem unused. > > >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the > RIPE region. >> Seems unused. >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was > allocated, exactly the >> timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one???), > announced on OVH. > >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced > by OVH on France, unused as well. > > >> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused. > >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. >> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): >> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 >> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 >> -- > > > >> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) >> william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | > http://as57169.net >> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC >> Maribor, Slovenia > > >> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: >>> Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> >>> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR >>> Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >>> An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> >>> >>> Dear Andrew, >>> >>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys > buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this > mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't > unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the > same... >>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >>> >>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from > you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 > in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of > the largest total >>> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >>> >>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles > while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never > contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? >>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream > provider? >>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> Hauptplatz 3/3 >>> 8010 Graz >>> Austria >>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >>> >>> phone: +43 316 827 500 >>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >>> http://www.edis.at >>> >>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is > solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may > contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the > intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, > distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly > prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify > us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. >>> >>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: >>> >>>> Dear William, >>>> >>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been > escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration > Services Department. >>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we > implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, > neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at > meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our > website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a > first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due > diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. > Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously > evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy > compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by > two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely > and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >>>> >>>> Kind regards >>>> >>>> Andrew de la Haye >>>> Chief Operations Officer >>>> RIPE NCC >>>> >>>> Singel 258 >>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>>> the Netherlands >>>> andrew@ripe.net >>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445 > >> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net >> : >>> Dear William, >>> >>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior >>> Management. >>> >>> They will come back to you ASAP. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Andrea Cima >>> >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> >>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>> Dear Andrea, >>>> >>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase > of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world > dictators state all the time about bribery... >>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members > add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove > lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - > Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the > accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest > allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to > an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough > 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you > think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE > mailing list to ALL members. >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> >>>> >>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster < > hostmaster@ripe.net>: >>>>> Dear William, >>>>> >>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>>>> >>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>>> lightly. >>>>> >>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>>> > http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>>> Kind regards, >>>>> >>>>> Andrea Cima >>>>> Registration Services Manager >>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, > li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>>> >>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>>> >>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used > false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the > most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified > with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the > usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for > example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from > AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very > questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> >>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the > last /8? >>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the > last /8? >>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the > last /8? >>>>>> >>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>>> William Weber >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>>> NOC >>>>>> >>>>>> > > > > > > ---- > If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss > mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the > general page: > https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view > > Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From > here, you can add or remove addresses.
-- Andrei Kushnireuski Alfa Telecom s.r.o. REGID: cz.alfatelecom nic-hdl: AK1065-RIPE phone: +420226020360
-- T??lrunis: +371 67788888
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
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-- Alexandr Gurbo
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-- Simon Lockhart | Tel: +44 1275 793 400 | Si fractum Technical Director | Mob: +44 7789 913304 | non sit, noli Cablecom Networking Ltd | WWW: www.cablecomnetworking.co.uk | id reficere Unit 3-5 Windmill Business Park, Windmill Road, Kenn. BS21 6SR. UK
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There is clearly a personal vendetta here, and it's getting tiresome for the rest of us.
Tiresome in what way? The RIPE mailing list is always empty (the last discussion before was from 22nd October, the last one before that on 8th April according to my client) and even this has just a small number of replies considering the receivers. I actually find this discussion and replies very amusing, in special the very different opinions throughout the LIRs (yet in my count most sided with and not against me in most points). It gives me some insight in some LIRs (and data for comparisons based on opinion, LIR size and allocated space as well as service provided, this is absolutely great data for profiling and storage) and possible alliances or more networking for the future. (and before someone asks, metadata or knowledge usage to profile companies or persons and try to predict or analyze future/past is not illegal in any way and protected by the guaranteed business freedom in the EU) This is also not personal in any way, the LIR could be at.telekom or the German government for all i care (In fact, one EU government is the next on my list), it matters exactly zero if sigint and humint sources show up possible (or clear) misusage or violation of RIPE policies .
IPv4 is over. Move on. Focus on deploying IPv6.
One of my companies uses *only* native IPv6 and a NAT64 (along with DNS64) gateway for IPv4 access which NATs currently 100 customers per external IPv4 which can be varied up to 2500 per IPv4 stable and without port limitations (unless v4 filesharing is used or large ranges of ports are allocated by the client). I think this is already a *very* good deployment. Please also don't think i don't have an eye on v6 - I already monitor larger than /29 v6 allocations given out by RIPE automatically (like some for years unused large /27s allocated to at.upc and nl.upc, ex. 2a04:2400::/27 (upc.ro)) and assignments in large allocations (larger than /48 and not sub-allocated, /32 and larger not sub-allocated) semi-manually.
Even if IPs are reclaimed from an LIR as a result of an audit, what difference is it going to make? It's not as if RIPE will start allocating from them again...
That can be changed - It just needs a redesign of the policy and votes for it, woho, democracy.
+1 And please do not reply to his RHETORICAL questions.
Thomas
I can reply to whatever i want with what i want at any point in time i want and so can anyone else that may wants - This is freed Europe, not Cuba. -- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh william@edisglobal.com | william@edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria Am 22.11.2013 um 13:26 schrieb Simon Lockhart <s.lockhart@cablecomnetworking.co.uk>:
If you believe there's fraud being carried out, report it to the law enforcement agencies - nothing said on this list can fix it.
IPv4 is over. Move on. Focus on deploying IPv6.
Simon
On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 03:49:06PM +0400, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
We are live in the region served by RIPE NCC. This is our resources that given to other regions. What allocations led to the exhaustion of resources in our region. As a result, we can't get more ip address. I think this isn't normal.
1) It's called ther *Inter*net. Not RIPEnet, ARINnet, APNICnet, AfriNICnet or LACNICnet. There are many reasons for advertising space outside the region where one's HQ is. 2) As some Norwegian once told me: "When the cribbage is empty, the horses bite each other" sncr, Sascha Luck
Sascha Luck, You are really believe, that so large ip addresses Mr Lu used in so small period of time??? Wake up! This is only large blocks as said topic starter. 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 Try it for yourself to explore for example block 5.224.0.0/15. Traces, announces, netnames, etc,... I see only country code changed in different subnets from this block: GB, SE, SG, ... It looks like the resources in reserve. On Fri, 22 Nov 2013 12:32:02 +0000 Sascha Luck <lists-ripe@c4inet.net> wrote:
On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 03:49:06PM +0400, Alexandr Gurbo wrote:
We are live in the region served by RIPE NCC. This is our resources that given to other regions. What allocations led to the exhaustion of resources in our region. As a result, we can't get more ip address. I think this isn't normal.
1) It's called ther *Inter*net. Not RIPEnet, ARINnet, APNICnet, AfriNICnet or LACNICnet. There are many reasons for advertising space outside the region where one's HQ is.
2) As some Norwegian once told me: "When the cribbage is empty, the horses bite each other"
sncr, Sascha Luck
-- Alexandr Gurbo
On 22/11/2013, at 13.47, Alexandr Gurbo <a.gurbo@severen.net> wrote:
Sascha Luck,
You are really believe, that so large ip addresses Mr Lu used in so small period of time??? Wake up!
This is only large blocks as said topic starter. 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
Try it for yourself to explore for example block 5.224.0.0/15. Traces, announces, netnames, etc,... I see only country code changed in different subnets from this block: GB, SE, SG, ... It looks like the resources in reserve.
I did a quick look using asused, and it seem there are whois records - they are very generic and by /24, and the sum is: Detail of allocation(s) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Range Database Allocation a s s i g n e d % No. free total ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 31.201.0.0/16 31.201.0.0 - 31.201.255.255 0.0% 0 65536 65536 37.222.0.0/15 37.222.0.0 - 37.223.255.255 100.0% 131072 0 131072 46.136.0.0/16 46.136.0.0 - 46.136.255.255 100.0% 65536 0 65536 5.132.0.0/16 5.132.0.0 - 5.132.255.255 75.4% 49408 16128 65536 5.224.0.0/15 5.224.0.0 - 5.225.255.255 100.0% 131072 0 131072 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I have no reason to believe currently that RIPE would treat Mr H.Lu any different from the rest, so I guess there is supporting evidence from the processing of those requests. I would like this matter to go back to RIPE, which due to this thread would be quite arrogant if NOT performing an audit. So perform an audit, and process this like any other reported ticket. I can confirm Mr H. Lu was at RIPE65 in Amsterdam, and we did talk a bit during the social and he is "available" for talking. Full-disclosure, I have not done business with him or know him more than this. and FWIW below are some show routes from our active core router. I gather: The networks ARE being announced on the internet, and I receive them from multiple providers such as AS1299 Telia, AS174 Cogent so if this is a fraudulent network it at least has ISP's providing connectivity. hlk@MX-CPH-01> show route 31.201.0.0/16 table i.inet.0 i.inet.0: 468863 destinations, 1373449 routes (467423 active, 15 holddown, 468196 hidden) + = Active Route, - = Last Active, * = Both 31.201.0.0/16 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:16, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I > to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:18:54, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I > to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 31.201.128.0/17 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:16, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I > to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:18:54, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I > to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 hlk@MX-CPH-01> show route 37.222.0.0/15 table i.inet.0 i.inet.0: 468848 destinations, 1373598 routes (467422 active, 1 holddown, 468190 hidden) + = Active Route, - = Last Active, * = Both 37.222.0.0/15 *[BGP/170] 11w0d 05:19:12, localpref 150, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 16276 I > to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 [BGP/170] 2d 13:19:35, MED 774040, localpref 110 AS path: 174 16276 I > to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 37.222.128.0/17 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:34, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I > to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:19:12, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I > to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 I did check the others, and you can perform your own investigations using RIPEstat? Best regards Henrik -- Henrik Lund Kramshøj, Follower of the Great Way of Unix internet samurai cand.scient CISSP hlk@kramse.org hlk@solidonetworks.com +45 2026 6000 http://solidonetworks.com/ Network Security is a business enabler
Dear all, In response to the mails regarding complaints to the RIPE NCC about LIRs, I'd like to clarify the situation and explain our procedures. The RIPE NCC has a clear and documented procedure for auditing its members and for handling reports relating to violations of RIPE Policy and RIPE NCC procedures. This procedure was developed in close consultation with the RIPE community. We adhere to our official reporting procedure and use a standard report form, which makes it easy for the reporter to make a complaint and for the RIPE NCC to handle the report. Any subsequent actions must remain confidential and are solely between the RIPE NCC and the party subject to investigation. The results of any investigation are not made public to the reporting party or to the RIPE NCC membership as a whole. The reporting procedure, as well as a link to the report form, is available at: http://www.ripe.net/contact/reporting-procedure Finally, I would like to assure members that the RIPE NCC adheres strictly to RIPE Policy in all its actions. A related RIPE Policy Proposal 2013-01, "Openness About Policy Violations", was today withdrawn from the Policy Development Process (PDP) by the proposers. A link to proposal itself as well as the proposers' reason for withdrawal are available at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/anti-abuse-wg/2013-November/002528.ht... I hope this clarifies matters, but if you have further questions please don't hesitate to contact me. Regards, Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC On Nov 22, 2013, at 2:39 PM, Henrik Kramshøj Solido NOC abuse <noc@solido.net> wrote:
On 22/11/2013, at 13.47, Alexandr Gurbo <a.gurbo@severen.net> wrote:
Sascha Luck,
You are really believe, that so large ip addresses Mr Lu used in so small period of time??? Wake up!
This is only large blocks as said topic starter. 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
Try it for yourself to explore for example block 5.224.0.0/15. Traces, announces, netnames, etc,... I see only country code changed in different subnets from this block: GB, SE, SG, ... It looks like the resources in reserve.
I did a quick look using asused, and it seem there are whois records - they are very generic and by /24, and the sum is:
Detail of allocation(s) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Range Database Allocation a s s i g n e d % No. free total ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 31.201.0.0/16 31.201.0.0 - 31.201.255.255 0.0% 0 65536 65536 37.222.0.0/15 37.222.0.0 - 37.223.255.255 100.0% 131072 0 131072 46.136.0.0/16 46.136.0.0 - 46.136.255.255 100.0% 65536 0 65536 5.132.0.0/16 5.132.0.0 - 5.132.255.255 75.4% 49408 16128 65536 5.224.0.0/15 5.224.0.0 - 5.225.255.255 100.0% 131072 0 131072 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have no reason to believe currently that RIPE would treat Mr H.Lu any different from the rest, so I guess there is supporting evidence from the processing of those requests. I would like this matter to go back to RIPE, which due to this thread would be quite arrogant if NOT performing an audit. So perform an audit, and process this like any other reported ticket.
I can confirm Mr H. Lu was at RIPE65 in Amsterdam, and we did talk a bit during the social and he is "available" for talking. Full-disclosure, I have not done business with him or know him more than this.
and FWIW below are some show routes from our active core router.
I gather: The networks ARE being announced on the internet, and I receive them from multiple providers such as AS1299 Telia, AS174 Cogent so if this is a fraudulent network it at least has ISP's providing connectivity.
hlk@MX-CPH-01> show route 31.201.0.0/16 table i.inet.0
i.inet.0: 468863 destinations, 1373449 routes (467423 active, 15 holddown, 468196 hidden) + = Active Route, - = Last Active, * = Both
31.201.0.0/16 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:16, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I
to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:18:54, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 31.201.128.0/17 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:16, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:18:54, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35
hlk@MX-CPH-01> show route 37.222.0.0/15 table i.inet.0
i.inet.0: 468848 destinations, 1373598 routes (467422 active, 1 holddown, 468190 hidden) + = Active Route, - = Last Active, * = Both
37.222.0.0/15 *[BGP/170] 11w0d 05:19:12, localpref 150, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 16276 I
to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35 [BGP/170] 2d 13:19:35, MED 774040, localpref 110 AS path: 174 16276 I to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 37.222.128.0/17 *[BGP/170] 2d 13:19:34, MED 912080, localpref 110 AS path: 174 35916 35916 I to 149.6.136.29 via xe-0/1/1.0 [BGP/170] 11w0d 05:19:12, localpref 110, from 94.126.183.247 AS path: 1299 3561 35916 I to 94.126.176.27 via ae2.35
I did check the others, and you can perform your own investigations using RIPEstat?
Best regards
Henrik
-- Henrik Lund Kramshøj, Follower of the Great Way of Unix internet samurai cand.scient CISSP hlk@kramse.org hlk@solidonetworks.com +45 2026 6000 http://solidonetworks.com/ Network Security is a business enabler
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Hi Andrew,
Finally, I would like to assure members that the RIPE NCC adheres strictly to RIPE Policy in all its actions. A related RIPE Policy Proposal 2013-01, "Openness About Policy Violations", was today withdrawn from the Policy Development Process (PDP) by the proposers. A link to proposal itself as well as the proposers' reason for withdrawal are available at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/anti-abuse-wg/2013-November/002528.ht...
It was interesting to see this discussion here, at the same time that that policy proposal was withdrawn because of lack of interest/support from the community. If people here now think publishing more data on abuse report handling is a good idea after all then they should submit a new policy proposal for that. They can re-use as much text from 2013-01 as they like. Cheers, Sander
Hi: What a surprise morning. I think it was talking about me and my company. To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC. Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally. I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly. Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public. And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more. At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them. Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support. Let me know if you still have more questions. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hi. I don't take a part in RIPE discussion very often but I'm sure there are no idiots =) $ traceroute 5.224.0.0 traceroute to 5.224.0.0 (5.224.0.0), 64 hops max, 52 byte packets ..... 10 te-4-1.car3.washington1.level3.net (4.79.168.201) 117.929 ms 119.218 ms 134.044 ms 11 vlan80.csw3.washington1.level3.net (4.69.149.190) 181.396 ms 178.800 ms 180.226 ms 12 ae-81-81.ebr1.washington1.level3.net (4.69.134.137) 182.706 ms 180.381 ms 182.938 ms 13 ae-4-4.ebr3.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.132.81) 181.113 ms 180.834 ms 182.469 ms 14 ae-73-73.csw2.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.137.38) 178.890 ms ae-83-83.csw3.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.137.42) 196.093 ms ae-93-93.csw4.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.137.46) 181.275 ms 15 ae-1-60.edge5.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.144.11) 186.188 ms ae-4-90.edge5.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.144.203) 179.428 ms ae-1-60.edge5.losangeles1.level3.net (4.69.144.11) 182.402 ms 16 multacom.edge5.losangeles1.level3.net (205.129.5.54) 197.450 ms 187.771 ms 229.313 ms 17 tge53-13.cr5.lax.multacom.com (208.64.231.86) 186.746 ms 274.893 ms 190.544 ms 18 * * * 19 * * * Range is announced outside RIPE region and this is serious RIPE NCC policy violation and it's serious reason to start LIR audit =) Have a nice day. On 21 Nov 2013, at 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> wrote:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
Good Afternoon (in Europe) Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members. For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN. Administration - [ inAsset Networks ] El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hi We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English. we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process, To inasset network: I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: > x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) > > > Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... > > LIR is nl.outsideheaven > > I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. > His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. > The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. > > 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC
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Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
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Mr. Lu, The best interests of RIPE NCC members are clearly expressed in its Policies. You and/or your organization (or any other, for this matter) must comply with them. If not, you are subject to a LIR Audit. Administration - [ inAsset Networks ] El 21/11/2013, a las 16:44, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
> > Dear William, > > All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that > demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by > members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. > > If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the > RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then > start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same > counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a > bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take > lightly. > > Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which > the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 > September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: > http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... > > Kind regards, > > Andrea Cima > Registration Services Manager > RIPE NCC > > > On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >> >> >> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >> >> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >> >> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >> >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >>
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Hi Sure, we as member of Ripe NCC of course obey community's policy.
we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members
However, this sentence sounds to me that you but not the policy going to decided what is the best interest of members. Sorry for misinterpretation. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:53, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Mr. Lu,
The best interests of RIPE NCC members are clearly expressed in its Policies.
You and/or your organization (or any other, for this matter) must comply with them. If not, you are subject to a LIR Audit.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:44, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. > > Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. > > It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>> >>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >
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And just for anyone in the list would be interested. As an active participating member of internet community at large, I am in almost every ICANN, Ripe, Afrinic, Lacnic meeting, if you'd like to talk to me personally please just drop me an Email and I would be happy to share some personal stories I have and answer any questions that are not confidential. Have a nice weekend. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:53, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Mr. Lu,
The best interests of RIPE NCC members are clearly expressed in its Policies.
You and/or your organization (or any other, for this matter) must comply with them. If not, you are subject to a LIR Audit.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:44, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. > > Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. > > It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>> >>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >
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Dear William, As discussed over several mails, the RIPE NCC has followed the policies and procedures outlined by the RIPE community and available on our website. The RIPE NCC carefully developed and documented its procedures to ensure transparency, fairness and consistency in the run-up to the last /8 of IPv4 address space. More details on those procedures are available at: http://www.ripe.net/internet-coordination/ipv4-exhaustion/reaching-the-last-... Your escalation of this matter has risen through the different RIPE NCC management layers to ensure due diligence. Regarding the usage of Internet number resources in other regions: The RIPE NCC allocates/assigns address space to organisations that have a need in the RIPE NCC service region. The address space must be originated from the RIPE NCC service region. In addition to this there can be announcements from other regions due to the diverse nature of businesses. The RIPE community has not installed any specific policies to track, measure or restrict the usage of Internet number resources. Such discussions have taken place among the RIPE community but also in other regions such as ARIN: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/address-policy-wg/2012-May/thread.htm... (Any-cast or uni-cast solutions) https://www.arin.net/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_32/webcast/2013-6.mov If you would like to propose a policy to the RIPE community that would address any of the issues you are concerned with, the RIPE NCC Policy Development Office (PDO) can support you in explaining the process to be followed. RIPE Policy Development: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/policies Please let me know if you would like me to put you in touch with the RIPE NCC PDO. Kind regards, Andrew de la Haye On Nov 21, 2013, at 4:53 PM, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Mr. Lu,
The best interests of RIPE NCC members are clearly expressed in its Policies.
You and/or your organization (or any other, for this matter) must comply with them. If not, you are subject to a LIR Audit.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:44, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. > > Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. > > It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>> >>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >
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Hello together, So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored? I was in fact AT YOUR ADDRESS in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)? The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system. You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police. Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore. I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak. Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me. This is also a note: The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent. -- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
> > Dear William, > > All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that > demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by > members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. > > If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the > RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then > start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same > counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a > bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take > lightly. > > Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which > the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 > September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: > http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... > > Kind regards, > > Andrea Cima > Registration Services Manager > RIPE NCC > > > On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >> >> >> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >> >> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >> >> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >> >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >>
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Hey,
am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue
going on here?
I mean come on, this guy has the bigger one, i am jalous too, but as
part of the RIPE NCC i think i really should trust the persons working
for the NCC.
For my understanding with every new allocation (and he has a lot..)
there is an Audit going on.
Ok, he is announcing part of the networks outside the RIPE Area, but for
my understanding that is ok as long as the company and the core network
is based in Europe. Or did i missed something.
Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
> Hello together,
>
> So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my
> previous contact tries ignored?
>
> I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I
> would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is
> unclear described.
>
> >I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
> personally and my private company as well
> I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data
> was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria
> - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near
> the expected.
> Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish
>> our private income data in the public space without supporting
>> evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my
>> lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to
>> write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and
>> community's support.
>
> I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be
> applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that
> Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
>
> The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make,
> even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also
> not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
>
> You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and
> once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much
> about Europe.
> The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the
> Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish
> police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong
> authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am
> being followed by the Austrian police.
>
> Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no
> one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
>
> I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian
> government does not like me they still send me invitations to
> broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
>
> Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies
> with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should
> explain himself, not me.
>
> This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or
> statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR
> i represent.*
>
>
> --
> William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR:
> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
>
>
>
>
> Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
>
>> Hi
>>
>> We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
>>
>> we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally
>> involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
>>
>> To inasset network:
>>
>> I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe
>> member" and justifying other member's IP usage?
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Lu
>>
>> On 2013-11-21, at ??12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]"
>> <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Good Afternoon (in Europe)
>>>
>>> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC
>>> takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in
>>> the best interest of its members.
>>>
>>> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space
>>> in ARIN.
>>>
>>> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
>>>
>>> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
>>>
>>>> Hi:
>>>>
>>>> What a surprise morning.
>>>>
>>>> I think it was talking about me and my company.
>>>>
>>>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our application
>>>> took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about
>>>> us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being
>>>> justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I
>>>> would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
>>>>
>>>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in
>>>> past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing
>>>> me personally.
>>>>
>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain
>>>> legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few
>>>> companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not
>>>> feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
>>>>
>>>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not
>>>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are
>>>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of
>>>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has
>>>> rights to getting into confidential area of member's business,
>>>> otherwise I believe every member would have to publish
>>>> every detail about their business to the public.
>>>>
>>>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as
>>>> it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you.
>>>> Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
>>>>
>>>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and
>>>> Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have
>>>> some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please
>>>> contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in
>>>> the matter with them.
>>>>
>>>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer,
>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate
>>>> publish our private income data in the public space without
>>>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law,
>>>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I
>>>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate
>>>> member's understanding and community's support.
>>>>
>>>> Let me know if you still have more questions.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>> Lu
>>>>
>>>> On 2013-11-21, at ??11:05, William Weber
>>>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com
>>>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one
>>>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them
>>>>> before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't
>>>>> reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others
>>>>> involved.
>>>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was
>>>>> ignored.
>>>>>
>>>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up
>>>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now
>>>>> the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest
>>>>> (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report
>>>>> LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i
>>>>> sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took
>>>>> 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't
>>>>> that proof enough for an evaluation?
>>>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make
>>>>> your own picture.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a
>>>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have
>>>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
>>>>>
>>>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" -
>>>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/>
>>>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and
>>>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
>>>>>
>>>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on
>>>>> OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based
>>>>> ISP Multacom (AS35916).
>>>>>
>>>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are
>>>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him
>>>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
>>>>>
>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles
>>>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows
>>>>> the connection to OutsideHeaven.
>>>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the
>>>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries
>>>>> set (AD, SD, YT....), most IPs are not announced at all and seem
>>>>> unused.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside
>>>>> of the RIPE region.
>>>>> Seems unused.
>>>>>
>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was
>>>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used
>>>>> in to get a new one...), announced on OVH.
>>>>>
>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?)
>>>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands,
>>>>> unused.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>
>>>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
>>>>>
>>>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him):
>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
>>>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others)
>>>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> |
>>>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at
>>>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/>
>>>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC
>>>>> Maribor, Slovenia
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
>>>>>
>>>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>>
>>>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR*
>>>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ
>>>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know
>>>>>> guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same
>>>>>> LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also,
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so
>>>>>> what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far
>>>>>> from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports
>>>>>> filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole
>>>>>> trader status and has one of the largest total
>>>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los
>>>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly
>>>>>> /24 on an ARIN ASN?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and
>>>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at
>>>>>> add-alloc?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his
>>>>>> upstream provider?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3
>>>>>> 8010 Graz
>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511
>>>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
>>>>>>
>>>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500
>>>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777
>>>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>> and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is
>>>>>> addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are
>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
>>>>>> of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited.
>>>>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>>>>>> us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from
>>>>>> your computer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net
>>>>>> <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket
>>>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE
>>>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space,
>>>>>>> we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to
>>>>>>> ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community
>>>>>>> at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List,
>>>>>>> and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
>>>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on
>>>>>>> a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed
>>>>>>> due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource
>>>>>>> Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or
>>>>>>> more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services
>>>>>>> Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy
>>>>>>> Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC
>>>>>>> Senior Managers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process
>>>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were
>>>>>>> entirely justified.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Andrew de la Haye
>>>>>>> Chief Operations Officer
>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Singel 258
>>>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam
>>>>>>> the Netherlands
>>>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>
>>>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444
>>>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior
>>>>>> Management.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They will come back to you ASAP.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>> Dear Andrea,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist
>>>>>>> at all?
>>>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a
>>>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse
>>>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE
>>>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely
>>>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if
>>>>>>> i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation
>>>>>>> to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a
>>>>>>> system to verify it himself.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
>>>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is
>>>>>>> reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes,
>>>>>>> i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE,
>>>>>>> please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will
>>>>>>> do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL
>>>>>>> members.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and
>>>>>>>> documentation that
>>>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information
>>>>>>>> provided by
>>>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information
>>>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then
>>>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same
>>>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a
>>>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take
>>>>>>>> lightly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on
>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14
>>>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
>>>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825.html
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>> Registration Services Manager
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and
>>>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing
>>>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have
>>>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or
>>>>>>>>> bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no
>>>>>>>>> trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and
>>>>>>>>> Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the
>>>>>>>>> usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
>>>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are
>>>>>>>>> for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but
>>>>>>>>> originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely.
>>>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are
>>>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and board
>>>>>>>>> decision.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>> ----
>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>> the general page:
>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>
>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>> ----
>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>> the general page:
>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>
>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>
>>> ----
>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>> general page:
>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>
>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>> ----
>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>> general page:
>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>
>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>
>
>
> ----
> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>
> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
--
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Christian Hoffmann
Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter
----
sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG (haftungsbeschränkt)
Winterhuder Weg 29
DE-22085 Hamburg
Tel.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 0
Fax.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 9
-
vetretungsberechtigter Gesellschafter:
Christian Hoffmann
USt-IdNr.: DE282309913
Registergericht: Hamburg HRB 121712
--
[ Ein Geschäft, das nur Geld einbringt, ist ein schlechtes Geschäft. ]
+1
--
Daniel Ponticello
Direttore Tecnico e CEO
REDDER Telco
T: 0444 1783651 | F: 0444 1783652 | daniel.ponticello@redder.it
www.redder.it
Il 21/11/2013 17:21, Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG] ha
scritto:
> Hey,
>
> am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue
> going on here?
> I mean come on, this guy has the bigger one, i am jalous too, but as
> part of the RIPE NCC i think i really should trust the persons working
> for the NCC.
> For my understanding with every new allocation (and he has a lot..)
> there is an Audit going on.
>
> Ok, he is announcing part of the networks outside the RIPE Area, but for
> my understanding that is ok as long as the company and the core network
> is based in Europe. Or did i missed something.
>
>
>
> Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
>> Hello together,
>>
>> So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my
>> previous contact tries ignored?
>>
>> I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I
>> would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is
>> unclear described.
>>
>> >I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>> personally and my private company as well
>> I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data
>> was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria
>> - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near
>> the expected.
>> Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish
>>> our private income data in the public space without supporting
>>> evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my
>>> lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to
>>> write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and
>>> community's support.
>>
>> I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be
>> applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that
>> Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
>>
>> The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make,
>> even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also
>> not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
>>
>> You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and
>> once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much
>> about Europe.
>> The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the
>> Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish
>> police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong
>> authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am
>> being followed by the Austrian police.
>>
>> Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no
>> one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
>>
>> I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian
>> government does not like me they still send me invitations to
>> broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
>>
>> Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies
>> with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should
>> explain himself, not me.
>>
>> This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or
>> statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR
>> i represent.*
>>
>>
>> --
>> William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR:
>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
>>>
>>> we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally
>>> involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
>>>
>>> To inasset network:
>>>
>>> I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe
>>> member" and justifying other member's IP usage?
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Lu
>>>
>>> On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]"
>>> <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good Afternoon (in Europe)
>>>>
>>>> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC
>>>> takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in
>>>> the best interest of its members.
>>>>
>>>> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space
>>>> in ARIN.
>>>>
>>>> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
>>>>
>>>> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>
>>>>> What a surprise morning.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think it was talking about me and my company.
>>>>>
>>>>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our application
>>>>> took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about
>>>>> us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being
>>>>> justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I
>>>>> would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
>>>>>
>>>>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in
>>>>> past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing
>>>>> me personally.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>>>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain
>>>>> legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few
>>>>> companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not
>>>>> feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
>>>>>
>>>>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not
>>>>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are
>>>>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of
>>>>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has
>>>>> rights to getting into confidential area of member's business,
>>>>> otherwise I believe every member would have to publish
>>>>> every detail about their business to the public.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as
>>>>> it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you.
>>>>> Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
>>>>>
>>>>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and
>>>>> Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have
>>>>> some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please
>>>>> contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in
>>>>> the matter with them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer,
>>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate
>>>>> publish our private income data in the public space without
>>>>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law,
>>>>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I
>>>>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate
>>>>> member's understanding and community's support.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you still have more questions.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Lu
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber
>>>>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com
>>>>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one
>>>>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them
>>>>>> before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't
>>>>>> reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others
>>>>>> involved.
>>>>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was
>>>>>> ignored.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up
>>>>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now
>>>>>> the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest
>>>>>> (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report
>>>>>> LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i
>>>>>> sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took
>>>>>> 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't
>>>>>> that proof enough for an evaluation?
>>>>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make
>>>>>> your own picture.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a
>>>>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have
>>>>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" -
>>>>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/>
>>>>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and
>>>>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on
>>>>>> OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based
>>>>>> ISP Multacom (AS35916).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are
>>>>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him
>>>>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles
>>>>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows
>>>>>> the connection to OutsideHeaven.
>>>>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the
>>>>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries
>>>>>> set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside
>>>>>> of the RIPE region.
>>>>>> Seems unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was
>>>>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used
>>>>>> in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?)
>>>>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands,
>>>>>> unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him):
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
>>>>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others)
>>>>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> |
>>>>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at
>>>>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/>
>>>>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC
>>>>>> Maribor, Slovenia
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>>
>>>>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR*
>>>>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ
>>>>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know
>>>>>>> guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same
>>>>>>> LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also,
>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so
>>>>>>> what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far
>>>>>>> from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports
>>>>>>> filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole
>>>>>>> trader status and has one of the largest total
>>>>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los
>>>>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly
>>>>>>> /24 on an ARIN ASN?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and
>>>>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at
>>>>>>> add-alloc?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his
>>>>>>> upstream provider?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3
>>>>>>> 8010 Graz
>>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511
>>>>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500
>>>>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777
>>>>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is
>>>>>>> addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are
>>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
>>>>>>> of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited.
>>>>>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>>>>>>> us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from
>>>>>>> your computer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net
>>>>>>> <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket
>>>>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE
>>>>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space,
>>>>>>>> we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to
>>>>>>>> ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community
>>>>>>>> at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List,
>>>>>>>> and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
>>>>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on
>>>>>>>> a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed
>>>>>>>> due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource
>>>>>>>> Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or
>>>>>>>> more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services
>>>>>>>> Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy
>>>>>>>> Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>> Senior Managers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process
>>>>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were
>>>>>>>> entirely justified.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrew de la Haye
>>>>>>>> Chief Operations Officer
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Singel 258
>>>>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam
>>>>>>>> the Netherlands
>>>>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>
>>>>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444
>>>>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior
>>>>>>> Management.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They will come back to you ASAP.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>> Dear Andrea,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist
>>>>>>>> at all?
>>>>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a
>>>>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse
>>>>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE
>>>>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely
>>>>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if
>>>>>>>> i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation
>>>>>>>> to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a
>>>>>>>> system to verify it himself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
>>>>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is
>>>>>>>> reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes,
>>>>>>>> i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE,
>>>>>>>> please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will
>>>>>>>> do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL
>>>>>>>> members.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and
>>>>>>>>> documentation that
>>>>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information
>>>>>>>>> provided by
>>>>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information
>>>>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then
>>>>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same
>>>>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a
>>>>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take
>>>>>>>>> lightly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14
>>>>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
>>>>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>>> Registration Services Manager
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and
>>>>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing
>>>>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have
>>>>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or
>>>>>>>>>> bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no
>>>>>>>>>> trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and
>>>>>>>>>> Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the
>>>>>>>>>> usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
>>>>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are
>>>>>>>>>> for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but
>>>>>>>>>> originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely.
>>>>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are
>>>>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and board
>>>>>>>>>> decision.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----
>>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>>> the general page:
>>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>> ----
>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>> the general page:
>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>
>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>
>>>> ----
>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>>> general page:
>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>
>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>> ----
>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>> general page:
>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>
>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----
>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>
>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>
> --
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> Christian Hoffmann
> Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter
> ----
> sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG (haftungsbeschränkt)
> Winterhuder Weg 29
> DE-22085 Hamburg
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 0
> Fax.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 9
> -
> vetretungsberechtigter Gesellschafter:
> Christian Hoffmann
>
> USt-IdNr.: DE282309913
> Registergericht: Hamburg HRB 121712
>
> --
>
> [ Ein Geschäft, das nur Geld einbringt, ist ein schlechtes Geschäft. ]
>
>
>
> ----
> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>
> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>
I. Vv. vv. vvi. V. Vv vivvvv v Hugh ibc A CXxxxxx cxxxx c ax xzcax a Cca c xac. Xc. Xzcax a cxxxx xxxa cxxx. xac. Accor XZ . Cxxxx. Cxx
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 4:26 PM, Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und
mehr UG] <c.hoffmann@hostingundmehr.com> wrote:
> Hey,
> am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue
> going on here?
> I mean come on, this guy has the bigger one, i am jalous too, but as
> part of the RIPE NCC i think i really should trust the persons working
> for the NCC.
> For my understanding with every new allocation (and he has a lot..)
> there is an Audit going on.
> Ok, he is announcing part of the networks outside the RIPE Area, but for
> my understanding that is ok as long as the company and the core network
> is based in Europe. Or did i missed something.
> Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
>> Hello together,
>>
>> So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my
>> previous contact tries ignored?
>>
>> I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I
>> would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is
>> unclear described.
>>
>> >I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>> personally and my private company as well
>> I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data
>> was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria
>> - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near
>> the expected.
>> Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish
>>> our private income data in the public space without supporting
>>> evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my
>>> lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to
>>> write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and
>>> community's support.
>>
>> I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be
>> applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that
>> Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
>>
>> The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make,
>> even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also
>> not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
>>
>> You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and
>> once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much
>> about Europe.
>> The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the
>> Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish
>> police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong
>> authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am
>> being followed by the Austrian police.
>>
>> Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no
>> one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
>>
>> I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian
>> government does not like me they still send me invitations to
>> broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
>>
>> Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies
>> with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should
>> explain himself, not me.
>>
>> This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or
>> statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR
>> i represent.*
>>
>>
>> --
>> William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR:
>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
>>>
>>> we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally
>>> involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
>>>
>>> To inasset network:
>>>
>>> I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe
>>> member" and justifying other member's IP usage?
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Lu
>>>
>>> On 2013-11-21, at ??12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]"
>>> <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good Afternoon (in Europe)
>>>>
>>>> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC
>>>> takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in
>>>> the best interest of its members.
>>>>
>>>> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space
>>>> in ARIN.
>>>>
>>>> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
>>>>
>>>> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>
>>>>> What a surprise morning.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think it was talking about me and my company.
>>>>>
>>>>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our application
>>>>> took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about
>>>>> us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being
>>>>> justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I
>>>>> would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
>>>>>
>>>>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in
>>>>> past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing
>>>>> me personally.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>>>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain
>>>>> legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few
>>>>> companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not
>>>>> feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
>>>>>
>>>>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not
>>>>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are
>>>>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of
>>>>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has
>>>>> rights to getting into confidential area of member's business,
>>>>> otherwise I believe every member would have to publish
>>>>> every detail about their business to the public.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as
>>>>> it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you.
>>>>> Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
>>>>>
>>>>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and
>>>>> Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have
>>>>> some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please
>>>>> contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in
>>>>> the matter with them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer,
>>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate
>>>>> publish our private income data in the public space without
>>>>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law,
>>>>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I
>>>>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate
>>>>> member's understanding and community's support.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you still have more questions.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Lu
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2013-11-21, at ??11:05, William Weber
>>>>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com
>>>>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one
>>>>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them
>>>>>> before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't
>>>>>> reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others
>>>>>> involved.
>>>>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was
>>>>>> ignored.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up
>>>>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now
>>>>>> the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest
>>>>>> (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report
>>>>>> LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i
>>>>>> sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took
>>>>>> 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't
>>>>>> that proof enough for an evaluation?
>>>>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make
>>>>>> your own picture.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a
>>>>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have
>>>>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" -
>>>>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/>
>>>>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and
>>>>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on
>>>>>> OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based
>>>>>> ISP Multacom (AS35916).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are
>>>>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him
>>>>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles
>>>>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows
>>>>>> the connection to OutsideHeaven.
>>>>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the
>>>>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries
>>>>>> set (AD, SD, YT....), most IPs are not announced at all and seem
>>>>>> unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside
>>>>>> of the RIPE region.
>>>>>> Seems unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was
>>>>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used
>>>>>> in to get a new one...), announced on OVH.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?)
>>>>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands,
>>>>>> unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him):
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
>>>>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others)
>>>>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> |
>>>>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at
>>>>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/>
>>>>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC
>>>>>> Maribor, Slovenia
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>>
>>>>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR*
>>>>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ
>>>>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know
>>>>>>> guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same
>>>>>>> LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also,
>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so
>>>>>>> what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far
>>>>>>> from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports
>>>>>>> filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole
>>>>>>> trader status and has one of the largest total
>>>>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los
>>>>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly
>>>>>>> /24 on an ARIN ASN?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and
>>>>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at
>>>>>>> add-alloc?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his
>>>>>>> upstream provider?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3
>>>>>>> 8010 Graz
>>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511
>>>>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500
>>>>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777
>>>>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is
>>>>>>> addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are
>>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
>>>>>>> of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited.
>>>>>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>>>>>>> us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from
>>>>>>> your computer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net
>>>>>>> <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket
>>>>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE
>>>>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space,
>>>>>>>> we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to
>>>>>>>> ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community
>>>>>>>> at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List,
>>>>>>>> and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
>>>>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on
>>>>>>>> a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed
>>>>>>>> due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource
>>>>>>>> Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or
>>>>>>>> more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services
>>>>>>>> Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy
>>>>>>>> Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>> Senior Managers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process
>>>>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were
>>>>>>>> entirely justified.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrew de la Haye
>>>>>>>> Chief Operations Officer
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Singel 258
>>>>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam
>>>>>>>> the Netherlands
>>>>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>
>>>>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444
>>>>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior
>>>>>>> Management.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They will come back to you ASAP.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>> Dear Andrea,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist
>>>>>>>> at all?
>>>>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a
>>>>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse
>>>>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE
>>>>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely
>>>>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if
>>>>>>>> i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation
>>>>>>>> to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a
>>>>>>>> system to verify it himself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
>>>>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is
>>>>>>>> reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes,
>>>>>>>> i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE,
>>>>>>>> please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will
>>>>>>>> do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL
>>>>>>>> members.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and
>>>>>>>>> documentation that
>>>>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information
>>>>>>>>> provided by
>>>>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information
>>>>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then
>>>>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same
>>>>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a
>>>>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take
>>>>>>>>> lightly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14
>>>>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
>>>>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>>> Registration Services Manager
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and
>>>>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing
>>>>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have
>>>>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or
>>>>>>>>>> bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no
>>>>>>>>>> trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and
>>>>>>>>>> Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the
>>>>>>>>>> usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
>>>>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are
>>>>>>>>>> for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but
>>>>>>>>>> originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely.
>>>>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are
>>>>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and board
>>>>>>>>>> decision.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----
>>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>>> the general page:
>>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>> ----
>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>> the general page:
>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>
>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>
>>>> ----
>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>>> general page:
>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>
>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>> ----
>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>> general page:
>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>
>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----
>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>
>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
> --
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> Christian Hoffmann
> Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter
> ----
> sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG (haftungsbeschränkt)
> Winterhuder Weg 29
> DE-22085 Hamburg
> Tel.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 0
> Fax.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 9
> -
> vetretungsberechtigter Gesellschafter:
> Christian Hoffmann
> USt-IdNr.: DE282309913
> Registergericht: Hamburg HRB 121712
> --
> [ Ein Geschäft, das nur Geld einbringt, ist ein schlechtes Geschäft. ]
--
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On 21/11/2013 16:36, Michael Kennedy wrote:
I. Vv. vv. vvi. V. Vv vivvvv v Hugh ibc A CXxxxxx cxxxx c ax xzcax a Cca c xac. Xc. Xzcax a cxxxx xxxa cxxx. xac. Accor XZ . Cxxxx. Cxx
Cat! Step away from Michael's keyboard and we can negotiate terms. Nick
+1. This looks clearly personal. Especially those half-anonymous
complains ("Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]") look strange to me
(no offense). And William, thank you for sharing all the details about
your personal life (Who is more evil?) - but probably most people here
do not find it interesting (just an assumption).
"Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]", William, did you two somehow
organize to get together today to start this? I dont need an answer.
Focus on facts please and keep the noise low. Thank you.
The Management.
Am 21.11.2013 17:21, schrieb Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und mehr
UG]:
> Hey,
>
> am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue
> going on here?
> I mean come on, this guy has the bigger one, i am jalous too, but as
> part of the RIPE NCC i think i really should trust the persons working
> for the NCC.
> For my understanding with every new allocation (and he has a lot..)
> there is an Audit going on.
>
> Ok, he is announcing part of the networks outside the RIPE Area, but for
> my understanding that is ok as long as the company and the core network
> is based in Europe. Or did i missed something.
>
>
>
> Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
>> Hello together,
>>
>> So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my
>> previous contact tries ignored?
>>
>> I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I
>> would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is
>> unclear described.
>>
>> >I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>> personally and my private company as well
>> I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data
>> was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria
>> - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near
>> the expected.
>> Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish
>>> our private income data in the public space without supporting
>>> evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my
>>> lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to
>>> write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and
>>> community's support.
>>
>> I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be
>> applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that
>> Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
>>
>> The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make,
>> even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also
>> not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
>>
>> You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and
>> once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much
>> about Europe.
>> The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the
>> Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish
>> police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong
>> authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am
>> being followed by the Austrian police.
>>
>> Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no
>> one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
>>
>> I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian
>> government does not like me they still send me invitations to
>> broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
>>
>> Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies
>> with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should
>> explain himself, not me.
>>
>> This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or
>> statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR
>> i represent.*
>>
>>
>> --
>> William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR:
>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
>>>
>>> we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally
>>> involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
>>>
>>> To inasset network:
>>>
>>> I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe
>>> member" and justifying other member's IP usage?
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Lu
>>>
>>> On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]"
>>> <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good Afternoon (in Europe)
>>>>
>>>> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC
>>>> takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in
>>>> the best interest of its members.
>>>>
>>>> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space
>>>> in ARIN.
>>>>
>>>> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
>>>>
>>>> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>
>>>>> What a surprise morning.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think it was talking about me and my company.
>>>>>
>>>>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our application
>>>>> took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about
>>>>> us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being
>>>>> justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I
>>>>> would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
>>>>>
>>>>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in
>>>>> past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing
>>>>> me personally.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>>>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain
>>>>> legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few
>>>>> companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not
>>>>> feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
>>>>>
>>>>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not
>>>>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are
>>>>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of
>>>>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has
>>>>> rights to getting into confidential area of member's business,
>>>>> otherwise I believe every member would have to publish
>>>>> every detail about their business to the public.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as
>>>>> it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you.
>>>>> Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
>>>>>
>>>>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and
>>>>> Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have
>>>>> some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please
>>>>> contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in
>>>>> the matter with them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer,
>>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate
>>>>> publish our private income data in the public space without
>>>>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law,
>>>>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I
>>>>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate
>>>>> member's understanding and community's support.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you still have more questions.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>> Lu
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber
>>>>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com
>>>>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one
>>>>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them
>>>>>> before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't
>>>>>> reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others
>>>>>> involved.
>>>>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was
>>>>>> ignored.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up
>>>>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now
>>>>>> the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest
>>>>>> (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report
>>>>>> LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i
>>>>>> sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took
>>>>>> 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't
>>>>>> that proof enough for an evaluation?
>>>>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make
>>>>>> your own picture.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a
>>>>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have
>>>>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" -
>>>>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/>
>>>>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and
>>>>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on
>>>>>> OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based
>>>>>> ISP Multacom (AS35916).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are
>>>>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him
>>>>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles
>>>>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows
>>>>>> the connection to OutsideHeaven.
>>>>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the
>>>>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries
>>>>>> set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside
>>>>>> of the RIPE region.
>>>>>> Seems unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was
>>>>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used
>>>>>> in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?)
>>>>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands,
>>>>>> unused.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him):
>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
>>>>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others)
>>>>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> |
>>>>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at
>>>>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/>
>>>>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC
>>>>>> Maribor, Slovenia
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>>
>>>>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR*
>>>>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ
>>>>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know
>>>>>>> guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same
>>>>>>> LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also,
>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so
>>>>>>> what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far
>>>>>>> from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports
>>>>>>> filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole
>>>>>>> trader status and has one of the largest total
>>>>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los
>>>>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly
>>>>>>> /24 on an ARIN ASN?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and
>>>>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at
>>>>>>> add-alloc?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his
>>>>>>> upstream provider?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3
>>>>>>> 8010 Graz
>>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511
>>>>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500
>>>>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777
>>>>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is
>>>>>>> addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are
>>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
>>>>>>> of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited.
>>>>>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>>>>>>> us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from
>>>>>>> your computer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net
>>>>>>> <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket
>>>>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE
>>>>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space,
>>>>>>>> we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to
>>>>>>>> ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community
>>>>>>>> at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List,
>>>>>>>> and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
>>>>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on
>>>>>>>> a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed
>>>>>>>> due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource
>>>>>>>> Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or
>>>>>>>> more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services
>>>>>>>> Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy
>>>>>>>> Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>> Senior Managers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process
>>>>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were
>>>>>>>> entirely justified.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Andrew de la Haye
>>>>>>>> Chief Operations Officer
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Singel 258
>>>>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam
>>>>>>>> the Netherlands
>>>>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>
>>>>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444
>>>>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior
>>>>>>> Management.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They will come back to you ASAP.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>> Dear Andrea,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist
>>>>>>>> at all?
>>>>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a
>>>>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse
>>>>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE
>>>>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely
>>>>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if
>>>>>>>> i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation
>>>>>>>> to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a
>>>>>>>> system to verify it himself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
>>>>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is
>>>>>>>> reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes,
>>>>>>>> i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE,
>>>>>>>> please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will
>>>>>>>> do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL
>>>>>>>> members.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and
>>>>>>>>> documentation that
>>>>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information
>>>>>>>>> provided by
>>>>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information
>>>>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then
>>>>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same
>>>>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a
>>>>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take
>>>>>>>>> lightly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14
>>>>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
>>>>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>>> Registration Services Manager
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and
>>>>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing
>>>>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have
>>>>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or
>>>>>>>>>> bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no
>>>>>>>>>> trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and
>>>>>>>>>> Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the
>>>>>>>>>> usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
>>>>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are
>>>>>>>>>> for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but
>>>>>>>>>> originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely.
>>>>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are
>>>>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and board
>>>>>>>>>> decision.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----
>>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>>> the general page:
>>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>> ----
>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>> the general page:
>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>
>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>
>>>> ----
>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>>> general page:
>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>
>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>> ----
>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>> general page:
>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>
>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----
>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>
>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>
> --
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> Christian Hoffmann
> Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter
> ----
> sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG (haftungsbeschränkt)
> Winterhuder Weg 29
> DE-22085 Hamburg
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 0
> Fax.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 9
> -
> vetretungsberechtigter Gesellschafter:
> Christian Hoffmann
>
> USt-IdNr.: DE282309913
> Registergericht: Hamburg HRB 121712
>
> --
>
> [ Ein Geschäft, das nur Geld einbringt, ist ein schlechtes Geschäft. ]
>
>
>
> ----
> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>
> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>
Sascha,
We do not have any relation with the complainer, and we would appreciate you avoid to make such suggestions.
If you want to contact us, you can find our phone number and e-mail addresses at RIPE NCC Whois DB.
Thank you.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 17:40, Sascha E. Pollok <sp@iphh.net> escribió:
> +1. This looks clearly personal. Especially those half-anonymous
> complains ("Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]") look strange to me
> (no offense). And William, thank you for sharing all the details about
> your personal life (Who is more evil?) - but probably most people here
> do not find it interesting (just an assumption).
>
> "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]", William, did you two somehow
> organize to get together today to start this? I dont need an answer.
>
> Focus on facts please and keep the noise low. Thank you.
>
> The Management.
>
> Am 21.11.2013 17:21, schrieb Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und mehr
> UG]:
>> Hey,
>>
>> am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue
>> going on here?
>> I mean come on, this guy has the bigger one, i am jalous too, but as
>> part of the RIPE NCC i think i really should trust the persons working
>> for the NCC.
>> For my understanding with every new allocation (and he has a lot..)
>> there is an Audit going on.
>>
>> Ok, he is announcing part of the networks outside the RIPE Area, but for
>> my understanding that is ok as long as the company and the core network
>> is based in Europe. Or did i missed something.
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
>>> Hello together,
>>>
>>> So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my
>>> previous contact tries ignored?
>>>
>>> I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I
>>> would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is
>>> unclear described.
>>>
>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>> personally and my private company as well
>>> I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data
>>> was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria
>>> - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near
>>> the expected.
>>> Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish
>>>> our private income data in the public space without supporting
>>>> evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my
>>>> lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to
>>>> write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and
>>>> community's support.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be
>>> applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that
>>> Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
>>>
>>> The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make,
>>> even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also
>>> not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
>>>
>>> You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and
>>> once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much
>>> about Europe.
>>> The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the
>>> Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish
>>> police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong
>>> authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am
>>> being followed by the Austrian police.
>>>
>>> Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no
>>> one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
>>>
>>> I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian
>>> government does not like me they still send me invitations to
>>> broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
>>>
>>> Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies
>>> with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should
>>> explain himself, not me.
>>>
>>> This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or
>>> statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR
>>> i represent.*
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR:
>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
>>>
>>>> Hi
>>>>
>>>> We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
>>>>
>>>> we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally
>>>> involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
>>>>
>>>> To inasset network:
>>>>
>>>> I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe
>>>> member" and justifying other member's IP usage?
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>> Lu
>>>>
>>>> On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]"
>>>> <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Good Afternoon (in Europe)
>>>>>
>>>>> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC
>>>>> takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in
>>>>> the best interest of its members.
>>>>>
>>>>> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space
>>>>> in ARIN.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
>>>>>
>>>>> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com
>>>>> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What a surprise morning.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think it was talking about me and my company.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our application
>>>>>> took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about
>>>>>> us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being
>>>>>> justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I
>>>>>> would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in
>>>>>> past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing
>>>>>> me personally.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me
>>>>>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain
>>>>>> legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few
>>>>>> companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not
>>>>>> feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not
>>>>>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are
>>>>>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of
>>>>>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has
>>>>>> rights to getting into confidential area of member's business,
>>>>>> otherwise I believe every member would have to publish
>>>>>> every detail about their business to the public.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as
>>>>>> it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you.
>>>>>> Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and
>>>>>> Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have
>>>>>> some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please
>>>>>> contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in
>>>>>> the matter with them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer,
>>>>>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate
>>>>>> publish our private income data in the public space without
>>>>>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law,
>>>>>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I
>>>>>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate
>>>>>> member's understanding and community's support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Let me know if you still have more questions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lu
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber
>>>>>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com
>>>>>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one
>>>>>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them
>>>>>>> before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't
>>>>>>> reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others
>>>>>>> involved.
>>>>>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was
>>>>>>> ignored.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up
>>>>>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now
>>>>>>> the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest
>>>>>>> (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report
>>>>>>> LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i
>>>>>>> sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took
>>>>>>> 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't
>>>>>>> that proof enough for an evaluation?
>>>>>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make
>>>>>>> your own picture.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a
>>>>>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have
>>>>>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" -
>>>>>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/>
>>>>>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and
>>>>>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on
>>>>>>> OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based
>>>>>>> ISP Multacom (AS35916).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are
>>>>>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him
>>>>>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles
>>>>>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows
>>>>>>> the connection to OutsideHeaven.
>>>>>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the
>>>>>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries
>>>>>>> set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside
>>>>>>> of the RIPE region.
>>>>>>> Seems unused.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was
>>>>>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used
>>>>>>> in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?)
>>>>>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands,
>>>>>>> unused.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him):
>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11
>>>>>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others)
>>>>>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> |
>>>>>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at
>>>>>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/>
>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC
>>>>>>> Maribor, Slovenia
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>>
>>>>>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR*
>>>>>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ
>>>>>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear Andrew,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know
>>>>>>>> guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same
>>>>>>>> LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also,
>>>>>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so
>>>>>>>> what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far
>>>>>>>> from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports
>>>>>>>> filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole
>>>>>>>> trader status and has one of the largest total
>>>>>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los
>>>>>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly
>>>>>>>> /24 on an ARIN ASN?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and
>>>>>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at
>>>>>>>> add-alloc?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his
>>>>>>>> upstream provider?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3
>>>>>>>> 8010 Graz
>>>>>>>> Austria
>>>>>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511
>>>>>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500
>>>>>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777
>>>>>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>>> and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is
>>>>>>>> addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL
>>>>>>>> information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are
>>>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
>>>>>>>> of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited.
>>>>>>>> If you have received this communication in error, please notify
>>>>>>>> us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from
>>>>>>>> your computer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net
>>>>>>>> <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket
>>>>>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE
>>>>>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space,
>>>>>>>>> we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to
>>>>>>>>> ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community
>>>>>>>>> at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List,
>>>>>>>>> and via our website. You can find the complete description at:
>>>>>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on
>>>>>>>>> a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed
>>>>>>>>> due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource
>>>>>>>>> Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or
>>>>>>>>> more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services
>>>>>>>>> Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy
>>>>>>>>> Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>> Senior Managers.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process
>>>>>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were
>>>>>>>>> entirely justified.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Andrew de la Haye
>>>>>>>>> Chief Operations Officer
>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Singel 258
>>>>>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam
>>>>>>>>> the Netherlands
>>>>>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>
>>>>>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444
>>>>>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior
>>>>>>>> Management.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> They will come back to you ASAP.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Dear Andrea,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist
>>>>>>>>> at all?
>>>>>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a
>>>>>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse
>>>>>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE
>>>>>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely
>>>>>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if
>>>>>>>>> i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation
>>>>>>>>> to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a
>>>>>>>>> system to verify it himself.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest
>>>>>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is
>>>>>>>>> reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes,
>>>>>>>>> i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE,
>>>>>>>>> please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will
>>>>>>>>> do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL
>>>>>>>>> members.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster
>>>>>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Dear William,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and
>>>>>>>>>> documentation that
>>>>>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information
>>>>>>>>>> provided by
>>>>>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information
>>>>>>>>>> to the
>>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then
>>>>>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same
>>>>>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a
>>>>>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take
>>>>>>>>>> lightly.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on
>>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14
>>>>>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at:
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825.html
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Andrea Cima
>>>>>>>>>> Registration Services Manager
>>>>>>>>>> RIPE NCC
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and
>>>>>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing
>>>>>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have
>>>>>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or
>>>>>>>>>>> bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no
>>>>>>>>>>> trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the
>>>>>>>>>>> usage of this amounts of IPv4 space.
>>>>>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are
>>>>>>>>>>> for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but
>>>>>>>>>>> originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely.
>>>>>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are
>>>>>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and board
>>>>>>>>>>> decision.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09
>>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07
>>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04
>>>>>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached
>>>>>>>>>>> the last /8?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04
>>>>>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>>> William Weber
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH
>>>>>>>>>>> NOC
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----
>>>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>>>> the general page:
>>>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>>> ----
>>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to
>>>>>> the general page:
>>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----
>>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>>>> general page:
>>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>>
>>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>> ----
>>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the
>>>> general page:
>>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>>
>>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists".
>>>> From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----
>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>>
>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>
>> --
>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
>> Christian Hoffmann
>> Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter
>> ----
>> sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG (haftungsbeschränkt)
>> Winterhuder Weg 29
>> DE-22085 Hamburg
>>
>> Tel.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 0
>> Fax.: +49 (0) 40 / 22 81 56 17 9
>> -
>> vetretungsberechtigter Gesellschafter:
>> Christian Hoffmann
>>
>> USt-IdNr.: DE282309913
>> Registergericht: Hamburg HRB 121712
>>
>> --
>>
>> [ Ein Geschäft, das nur Geld einbringt, ist ein schlechtes Geschäft. ]
>>
>>
>>
>> ----
>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>>
>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
>>
>
>
> ----
> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss
> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page:
> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
>
> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hello, On 21.11.2013, at 17:21, Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG] wrote:
...
am i the only person having the feeling that there is a private issue going on here? ... Or did i missed something.
personally I think it boils down to the question if those who use the RIRs to collect IPs as investment are tolerated by the others that only request IPs when needed. Since the "depletion day" (we all?) I get offers to give up IP space for money quite often. Microsoft bought the nortel IPs for $10 each (if I remember correctly). William got in an argument with RIPE NCC about ARIN announcements, and he started looking around. Now he found an (self described) very active community member in ICANN/RIPE/ARIN/etc. who has lots of allocations, with few and not very descriptive assignments to back it up. Undisclosed business activities behind this very large IP pool (which I can accept) does not make it easier to understand for any LIR with probably every /28 in the whois db. So I hope I did sum it up without treating Mr. Lu and Mr. Weber differently. My two cents in this discussion: There are large LIRs (including incumbent operators) that have HUGE IP Pools, and they can serve new customers for years. As incumbent operators they only see little growth, but still have pools of /19 bits or shorter parked. But there is no return policy. Later starts in the game (as our LIR is as well) do have one /21 or /22. I personally try to delegate all business into IPv6, but not all want or can do that, or some customers are hard to win over, without IPv4. This can lead to anger, and anger needs direction. It is easy to direct it to RIPE NCC, or large IP pool holders. I do not want to say this anger is unjustified, as I personally think it is a business disadvantage compared with large telcos that requested block after block in 2012, which accelerated the depletion. This acceleration can be seen in speed the number of available block decreased throughout 2012. Dear community: Please rethink how through policy this matter can be solved, as I personally think there must be a return policy, as otherwise we will see more and more "investment-LIRs", buying IPs now, resell them later. Or make RIPE fees based on IP Pools hold. Then there is immediate calculation going on, how much space needs to be hold for 1/3/5/10 years. 50 cents per IP per year from 2015 on, would move large pools back to RIPE NCC, as this would reduce most LIRs to the technical minimum space needed. This is my first large post in this community, so I hope I didn't repeat too much which might have been said in the last community meeting, which unfortunately I couldn't attend to. Matthias Subik ps: I leave the rest here, as this list is not so much about shortening (it appears).
Am 21.11.2013 17:12, schrieb William Weber:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands. making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.*
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at ??12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
*Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at ??11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT....), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one...), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>> > *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR* > *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ > *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>> > > Dear Andrew, > > And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... > > Sorry, but this is not really any better now: > > This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total > allocations in the entire RIPE region? > > How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? > > Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? > > How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? > > This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > Hauptplatz 3/3 > 8010 Graz > Austria > Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 > Firmenbuch: FN 308697t > > phone: +43 316 827 500 > fax: +43 316 827 500 777 > http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/> > > This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from your computer. > > > Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>: > >> Dear William, >> >> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >> >> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >> >> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: >> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >> >> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >> >> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >> >> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >> >> Kind regards >> >> Andrew de la Haye >> Chief Operations Officer >> RIPE NCC >> >> Singel 258 >> 1016 AB Amsterdam >> the Netherlands >> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net> >> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>:
> > Dear William, > > As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior > Management. > > They will come back to you ASAP. > > Best regards, > Andrea Cima > > RIPE NCC > > > On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> Dear Andrea, >> >> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >> >> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >> >> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >> >> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>: >> >>> >>> Dear William, >>> >>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>> >>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>> lightly. >>> >>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Andrea Cima >>> Registration Services Manager >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> >>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>> >>>> >>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>> >>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>> >>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>> >>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> >>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> >>>> >> ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
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Hello, As a small LIR I can only subscribe to such proposal. This way we'd get a very fair funding scheme for RIPE. Best regards, Francis GASCHET / NUMLOG Le 21/11/2013 17:59, "Mag. Matthias Šubik" a écrit :
Dear community: ..... Or make RIPE fees based on IP Pools hold. Then there is immediate calculation going on, how much space needs to be hold for 1/3/5/10 years. 50 cents per IP per year from 2015 on, would move large pools back to RIPE NCC, as this would reduce most LIRs to the technical minimum space needed.
On Dec 12, 2013, at 3:04 PM, Francis GASCHET <fg@numlog.fr> wrote:
As a small LIR I can only subscribe to such proposal. Le 21/11/2013 17:59, "Mag. Matthias Šubik" a écrit :
Dear community: ..... Or make RIPE fees based on IP Pools hold. Then there is immediate calculation going on, how much space needs to be hold for 1/3/5/10 years. 50 cents per IP per year from 2015 on, would move large pools back to RIPE NCC, as this would reduce most LIRs to the technical minimum space needed.
Hi, this was discussed a bit in the past but did not get through at the end. This is the current status and we really need to do something about it: - IPv4 space is formally exhausted - A lot of it is actually allocated (and sometimes assigned) but si NOT really in use - Some LIRs requested and had allocated in the past huge amounts of IP space - I receive on average two emails per day from people asking me if we want to SELL IP addresses - We see flames on the list about LIRs that are suspected to have too many IPs for some reason I think that all this is nonsense. Really, the RIPE membership fees should be based mostly on "the share of limited resources that your LIR uses", if a LIR has a /8 allocated that is 1/23th of the whole address space available from RIPE; thus should pay alone 1/23th of the budget of RIPE (the model might of course keep in count also other resources like IPv6 and ASNs, but allocating "a significant share of the available IPv6 address space" seems a quite unlikely thing to happen). Doing this would magically free a huge amount of address space, end this shameful "IP address market" and push toward both efficient resource usage and a faster transition to IPv6. I know that there were objections to this idea, which were basically: - Big ISPs would pay a lot: fair enough, they have a big budget. - RIPE can not "sell" IP addresses: not true, RIPE already does have fees changing on the amount of allocated resources, the principle does not change (change the classes from small-medium-large to /4 /5 /6 /7 /8 … /24, and give each class a fee, formally it is not a change in the model) - RIPE would be considered a commercial entity and pay taxes: 1) not true, see previous point; 2) Should even this happen we can live with that JMHO, Regards, A. -------------------------- Andrea Cocito andrea.cocito@ifom.eu CTO - Chief Technology Officer IFOM -- FIRC Institute of Molecular Oncology Via Adamello 16 20139 Milano - Italy tel: +39-02-574303000 fax: +39-02-574303231
Really, the RIPE membership fees should be based mostly on "the share of limited resources that your LIR uses", if a LIR has a /8 allocated that is 1/23th of the whole address space available from RIPE; thus should pay alone 1/23th of the budget of RIPE
But that 1 entry in a database isn't 1/23rd of the cost of running the behemoth that RIPE has become. A *nominal* membership fee and a pay-per-db-object would be fairer. If your concern is over the amount you pay RIPE, then put up a proposal to get rid of soem of the extraneous 'projects' and other spending, so it gets back to just doing, only doing and exactly doing what it was created for - managing a db of a list of resources. If your concern is over the amount of IP addresses you can get access to - you're 10 years too late Ipv4 has run out. Get over it. Rob
Hi, On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 03:24:08PM +0000, rob.golding@astutium.com wrote:
A *nominal* membership fee and a pay-per-db-object would be fairer.
Cool plan. Encourage sloppy documentation. IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :) A.
Hi, On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 05:41:45PM +0100, Andrea Cocito wrote:
On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :)
The fee scheme has been changed after exhaustive discussion (especially with the bazillion ticket systems subscribed to this list) to "every LIR pays the same". Good luck finding a majority of voting members to agree on anything else. I, for one, will not agree to a fee that is directly based on the amount of IPv4 address a LIR holds - wouldn't make a difference for us either way, but because IPv4 is something that is increasingly irrelevant, and not a good base for future funding of the NCC. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
Hello, everyone who says "IPv4 is gone" is living in his/her dreams, denying reality and IPv4 market (and those mentioned average 2 letters/IPv4 requests per day). It may be true for some, but it obviously isn't for others, no matter reasons. While I understand IPv6 propagation, I don't think that punishing/discriminating small IPv4 holders in need for a few more IPs is right. Actually, releasing those big unused IPv4 blocks might have much better impact for IPv6 development, while the small ones would appreciate "a few more C" and it may even be enought for a few more months/years this way. While I must admit I'm not sure how to do this, some fee for IP addresses sounds like natural way. So I must agree, if you are happy IPv6 user who had no problems to move from IPv4 (or started at IPv6 directly) and doesn't need IPv4 addresses anymore, just return them all and you can stop to care about it and less lucky us. You may even have it cheaper. Saying that you don't need IPv4 because you have IPv6 already sounds like "I don't have this problem so I don't want/need it to be solved and I don't care about others" to me. Or in worse case, it may even be "I like current state because I own those big blocks and I have profit from it". Nothing personal here, I wasn't screening anyone and I don't accuse anyone. Just annoyed from all those "IPv6 solves everything" announcers who are, at same time, so much against returning of any unused IPv4 space. Thanks for your understanding. Merry Christmas to everyone Matej Vavrousek CentroNet, a.s. -----Original Message----- From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Andrea Cocito Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:42 PM To: Gert Doering Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :) A. ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hi All, I think that post hits the nail on the head perfectly. I guess if so many of us feel this way we should investigate the Ripe framework to see if there is something that can be done to create positive change. This would be a great short/medium term solution however we all must look to support ipv6 natively. Merry Christmas, Oliver On 16 Dec 2013 09:39, "RIPE" <ripe@centronet.cz> wrote:
Hello,
everyone who says "IPv4 is gone" is living in his/her dreams, denying reality and IPv4 market (and those mentioned average 2 letters/IPv4 requests per day). It may be true for some, but it obviously isn't for others, no matter reasons. While I understand IPv6 propagation, I don't think that punishing/discriminating small IPv4 holders in need for a few more IPs is right. Actually, releasing those big unused IPv4 blocks might have much better impact for IPv6 development, while the small ones would appreciate "a few more C" and it may even be enought for a few more months/years this way.
While I must admit I'm not sure how to do this, some fee for IP addresses sounds like natural way. So I must agree, if you are happy IPv6 user who had no problems to move from IPv4 (or started at IPv6 directly) and doesn't need IPv4 addresses anymore, just return them all and you can stop to care about it and less lucky us. You may even have it cheaper. Saying that you don't need IPv4 because you have IPv6 already sounds like "I don't have this problem so I don't want/need it to be solved and I don't care about others" to me. Or in worse case, it may even be "I like current state because I own those big blocks and I have profit from it". Nothing personal here, I wasn't screening anyone and I don't accuse anyone. Just annoyed from all those "IPv6 solves everything" announcers who are, at same time, so much against returning of any unused IPv4 space. Thanks for your understanding.
Merry Christmas to everyone
Matej Vavrousek CentroNet, a.s.
-----Original Message----- From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net [mailto: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Andrea Cocito Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:42 PM To: Gert Doering Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC
On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :)
A.
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(Hi, I have changed the subject since the substance of the discussion now seem to have moved to a discussion on how to reclaim unused Ipv4 to prolong the lifetime of Ipv4. On 16.12.2013 10:58, Oliver Bryssau wrote:
Actually, releasing those big unused IPv4 blocks
It would be good for the discussion to understand which blocks we are talking about: - legacy space - (from IANA or InterNic) - before RIPE creation - older RIPE space not fully utilized - recent RIPE space not yet utilized There has been various attempts to reclaim address space in the past. Using the RIPE fee structure in this context may be more difficult and is ultimately a topic for the General Assembly. The fee is not for the lease or purchase off address space but a fee for the services provided by the RIPE NCC to its members. Registration services is only part of this fee, there are also other services and most importantly support for the Policy process and RIPE meetings. The breakdown of the cost is now in the activity plan. Hans Petter
Hello, On 16.12.2013, at 11:33, Hans Petter Holen wrote:
(Hi, I have changed the subject since the substance of the discussion now seem to have moved to a discussion on how to reclaim unused Ipv4 to prolong the lifetime of Ipv4.
I would disagree that this should be the primary reason for a changed charging scheme. Let me draw a little picture here, starting from the criticism on unexplained large allocation holders. There are lots of little LIRs out there (we are one of them), counting IPv4 addresses in the little thousands. As a late starter, this is what we got, and we are (still) happy with it. But when comparing IPv6 migration schemes, we know that the late and little ISPs can't count on IPv4 or Dual-Stack for further growth. But incumbent telcos have the large allocations OR the money, to buy addresses if they need one. So any change towards making each and every IPv4 address count ten cents into the RIPE fees, and e.g. 1 cent for every /64 in v6 should make sure that addresses are used or returned. So I definitely don't want to extend the life of IPv4, as it makes the future more uncertain, difficult and less interesting, I do would like to see a move that does not put me in the position to wait for the customer to get tired of dual stack, wanting to come to my IPv6 offering. If RIPE gets IPv4 space back, there is no good reason (yet) to give it out again, but they should get it back, as it helps getting the nail on the coffin in (for v4). This should also be interesting for the IPv4 Investment folks, as long as they hold addresses (and pay to RIPE), they can still sell it higher to the ones in need of addresses later, as supply is much scarce by then. To summarize: asking fees for large IPv4 blocks should only accelerate the transition, not help others to reused addresses. Right now you can buy addresses (via the market at RIPE), you can put out LIR applications in large packages, or privately approach large IP allocation holders. The market is already there, the price is predictable. best regards Matthias Subik -- UCND United City Network Development GmbH Steingasse 23 1030 Wien, Österreich FN 188089b beim Handelsgericht Wien UID ATU 54974906 Mag. Matthias Šubik Head of Solution Design Tel.: +43 676 83820-787
Hi, On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 11:09:09AM +0100, "Mag. Matthias ?ubik" wrote: [..] Please do *not* cross-post between the members-discuss and address-policy-wg mailing lists. Charging scheme discussions should stay in members-discuss, as APWG has no direct influence on the charging scheme. Policy change discussions are welcome in the address-policy-wg list, but should not cross-post to members-discuss, as that will fragment the discussion threads (some replies go to one of the lists, some go to the other, noise level goes up). Gert Doering -- APWG chair -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
Hi, On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 09:58:51AM +0000, Oliver Bryssau wrote:
I guess if so many of us feel this way we should investigate the Ripe framework to see if there is something that can be done to create positive change.
Sure you can, just add a 5th digit to your IPv4 addresses to make them last longer. The point is: assuming that there are "great masses of unused IPv4 space" is delusional. There *is* unused IPv4 space, but even if someone would be willing to pay for the efforts of reclaiming it, it will not last for "multiple years to come" but would be gone again in a few months if handed out freely - but, to point this out, in the RIPE region the current IPv4 policy will still be "every LIR can only get a single(!) /22 out of this". It's not like people haven't been told for 10+ years that they should prepare for the IPv4 run-out and deploy IPv6 - and lots of people have already done that. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
IPv4 market should be illegal. How someone can sell IPv4 address space, if RIPE is allocating address space based on their needs??? If they sell addresses, RIPE allocated to them more than they need. On 12/16/2013 10:58 AM, Oliver Bryssau wrote:
Hi All,
I think that post hits the nail on the head perfectly.
I guess if so many of us feel this way we should investigate the Ripe framework to see if there is something that can be done to create positive change.
This would be a great short/medium term solution however we all must look to support ipv6 natively.
Merry Christmas, Oliver
On 16 Dec 2013 09:39, "RIPE" <ripe@centronet.cz <mailto:ripe@centronet.cz>> wrote:
Hello,
everyone who says "IPv4 is gone" is living in his/her dreams, denying reality and IPv4 market (and those mentioned average 2 letters/IPv4 requests per day). It may be true for some, but it obviously isn't for others, no matter reasons. While I understand IPv6 propagation, I don't think that punishing/discriminating small IPv4 holders in need for a few more IPs is right. Actually, releasing those big unused IPv4 blocks might have much better impact for IPv6 development, while the small ones would appreciate "a few more C" and it may even be enought for a few more months/years this way.
While I must admit I'm not sure how to do this, some fee for IP addresses sounds like natural way. So I must agree, if you are happy IPv6 user who had no problems to move from IPv4 (or started at IPv6 directly) and doesn't need IPv4 addresses anymore, just return them all and you can stop to care about it and less lucky us. You may even have it cheaper. Saying that you don't need IPv4 because you have IPv6 already sounds like "I don't have this problem so I don't want/need it to be solved and I don't care about others" to me. Or in worse case, it may even be "I like current state because I own those big blocks and I have profit from it". Nothing personal here, I wasn't screening anyone and I don't accuse anyone. Just annoyed from all those "IPv6 solves everything" announcers who are, at same time, so much against returning of any unused IPv4 space. Thanks for your understanding.
Merry Christmas to everyone
Matej Vavrousek CentroNet, a.s.
-----Original Message----- From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net <mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net> [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net <mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net>] On Behalf Of Andrea Cocito Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:42 PM To: Gert Doering Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net <mailto:members-discuss@ripe.net> Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC
On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net <mailto:gert@space.net>> wrote: > IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere > will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you > are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and > money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :)
A.
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Hi, On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 11:40:04AM +0100, Rade Djurasinovic wrote:
IPv4 market should be illegal. How someone can sell IPv4 address space, if RIPE is allocating address space based on their needs??? If they sell addresses, RIPE allocated to them more than they need.
The allocation policies always included room for growth - and in some cases, growth did not happen as planned, or the customer structure changed, resulting in some unused allocations. The IPv4 policy never had terms for reclaiming unused allocations - and that was pointed out clearly at the address policy working group meeting two years ago. There was no mandate from the community either to change that. There are a lot of "it should be..." or "it would be nice if...", but there's also a lot of reality out there. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
On Dec 16, 2013, at 11:43 AM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
There are a lot of "it should be..." or "it would be nice if...", but there's also a lot of reality out there.
Yes, this is the reality, and having LIRs pay a significant amount of money for the IP addresses they have allocated would fix it (I get 4-5 mails like this one per week…). Begin forwarded message:
From: Selim Reza <address@removed> Subject: IP Acquisition Date: December 13, 2013 12:25:34 PM GMT+01:00 To: undisclosed-recipients: ;
Hello,
We are a very reputable company from the US looking for a partner in your country to provide IPV4 and IPV6 space. If you are interested please reply and we can discuss details of our offer and partnership. Have a great day!
Regards,
Selim Reza IP Management Services
LOF... I have 4-5 same emails per day =) If I understand correctly all of them are sent by the spammers to get free IP allocations for their needs. On 16 Dec 2013, at 11:46, Andrea Cocito <andrea.cocito@ifom.eu> wrote:
On Dec 16, 2013, at 11:43 AM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
There are a lot of "it should be..." or "it would be nice if...", but there's also a lot of reality out there.
Yes, this is the reality, and having LIRs pay a significant amount of money for the IP addresses they have allocated would fix it (I get 4-5 mails like this one per week…).
Begin forwarded message:
From: Selim Reza <address@removed> Subject: IP Acquisition Date: December 13, 2013 12:25:34 PM GMT+01:00 To: undisclosed-recipients: ;
Hello,
We are a very reputable company from the US looking for a partner in your country to provide IPV4 and IPV6 space. If you are interested please reply and we can discuss details of our offer and partnership. Have a great day!
Regards,
Selim Reza IP Management Services
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
Hi Andrea, Companies that spam the complete over and over again .. are not looking for IP space .. they are .. indeed spammers. We all get the emails from companies from the USA that are looking for IP space these days ... But if they would be eligible for ARIN space as a US company, why would they feel the need to spam the complete RIPE db ? ARIN still has 2 /8's ... and it is a lot cheaper for them to actually get the IP space directly from their own RIR instead of in a depleted region. Any company that requires more IP space, should go to the RIPE website, look at either the listing page or the transfer page where they can find the brokers. As Gert stated, reclaiming un-used IP space won't solve the issue. And it will also not distribute the last bit of IP space more fairly than via a broker. Changes are that if a big portion would be reclaimed and all policies changed to re-issue that reclaimed space, similar as in the final 14 days before depletion, it will be snagged up by some large telco in a single request and we all go back to our daily lives. It is not worth the effort imho. Erik -----Original Message----- From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Andrea Cocito Sent: maandag 16 december 2013 11:47 To: Gert Doering Cc: Rade Djurasinovic; members-discuss@ripe.net Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC On Dec 16, 2013, at 11:43 AM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
There are a lot of "it should be..." or "it would be nice if...", but there's also a lot of reality out there.
Yes, this is the reality, and having LIRs pay a significant amount of money for the IP addresses they have allocated would fix it (I get 4-5 mails like this one per week…). Begin forwarded message:
From: Selim Reza <address@removed> Subject: IP Acquisition Date: December 13, 2013 12:25:34 PM GMT+01:00 To: undisclosed-recipients: ;
Hello,
We are a very reputable company from the US looking for a partner in your country to provide IPV4 and IPV6 space. If you are interested please reply and we can discuss details of our offer and partnership. Have a great day!
Regards,
Selim Reza IP Management Services
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Hi All, A Fee for a Resource that is significantly smaller than Demand won't work .... all it will do is create another market for those with extra IP's ... What do other markets do when there is a shortage ..... it is not guaranteed to work in this market .... Never posted on here but here is my 2 pence worth so bear with me ... Our experience from a telecommunications view is interesting. We had been issued by Ofcom 600 x 10,000 blocks of phone numbers, some ranges were issued in 1K blocks where there was shortage in a town, but if not 10,000 blocks, our mobile range is 100,000 Now we never need 10K blocks for all towns, yes London but not Maldon .... 1K would have been fine. Now Ofcom have never charged for phone numbers historically, but that has all started to change due to a shortage and of course lack of Government funding. First they went to 1K blocks as numbers for a town became scarce.... Now they are starting to charge for numbers in the towns which they say are a conservation area where numbers are scarce. They charge 10p per number per year, whether allocated to a customer or not. Now we have given back promptly 4 million phone numbers some big mobile companies have also dumped the numbers and services on some of those numbers like broadband VOIP some mobile operators cut the service. Phone numbers I am sure will never run out so companies not using them will give them back as they know, "hey we can get some more". With IP's that's different, I think whatever happens IPV4 will run out (or has) whatever approach is taken. The big boys know this and can afford to keep them whatever is charged for them so I doubt the big telcos/ISP's will ever give them back. Irrespective of a charge. The only IP's you may get back if they are charged for is from small operators ... but as IP's are so scarce I even doubt these will be given back as companies can rent them out as they are a scarce resource with a demand greater than supply unlike UK phone numbers where the demand is less than supply but phone numbers where just allocated on blocks too large (so mis -managed). You may think great they will rent them out, I doubt the terms of such will make you smile ... So charging won't necessarily work. Regards Tony From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Oliver Bryssau Sent: 16 December 2013 09:59 To: RIPE Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC Hi All, I think that post hits the nail on the head perfectly. I guess if so many of us feel this way we should investigate the Ripe framework to see if there is something that can be done to create positive change. This would be a great short/medium term solution however we all must look to support ipv6 natively. Merry Christmas, Oliver On 16 Dec 2013 09:39, "RIPE" <ripe@centronet.cz> wrote: Hello, everyone who says "IPv4 is gone" is living in his/her dreams, denying reality and IPv4 market (and those mentioned average 2 letters/IPv4 requests per day). It may be true for some, but it obviously isn't for others, no matter reasons. While I understand IPv6 propagation, I don't think that punishing/discriminating small IPv4 holders in need for a few more IPs is right. Actually, releasing those big unused IPv4 blocks might have much better impact for IPv6 development, while the small ones would appreciate "a few more C" and it may even be enought for a few more months/years this way. While I must admit I'm not sure how to do this, some fee for IP addresses sounds like natural way. So I must agree, if you are happy IPv6 user who had no problems to move from IPv4 (or started at IPv6 directly) and doesn't need IPv4 addresses anymore, just return them all and you can stop to care about it and less lucky us. You may even have it cheaper. Saying that you don't need IPv4 because you have IPv6 already sounds like "I don't have this problem so I don't want/need it to be solved and I don't care about others" to me. Or in worse case, it may even be "I like current state because I own those big blocks and I have profit from it". Nothing personal here, I wasn't screening anyone and I don't accuse anyone. Just annoyed from all those "IPv6 solves everything" announcers who are, at same time, so much against returning of any unused IPv4 space. Thanks for your understanding. Merry Christmas to everyone Matej Vavrousek CentroNet, a.s. -----Original Message----- From: members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net [mailto:members-discuss-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Andrea Cocito Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:42 PM To: Gert Doering Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Complaints against LIRs ignored by NCC On Dec 12, 2013, at 5:39 PM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
IPv4 is *gone*, get over it. No matter of discussion here or elsewhere will bring back IPv4 in quantities needed to "last forever", so all you are doing is postponing the inevitable, and burning lots of effort and money in the denial phase.
Right, then if the fee scheme is changed in that way there will be no problem for LIRs who have millions of IPv4 addresses allocated to release them and save money :) A. ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
отключите меня из переписки 12 Dec 2013, в 19:24, rob.golding@astutium.com написал(а):
Really, the RIPE membership fees should be based mostly on "the share of limited resources that your LIR uses", if a LIR has a /8 allocated that is 1/23th of the whole address space available from RIPE; thus should pay alone 1/23th of the budget of RIPE
But that 1 entry in a database isn't 1/23rd of the cost of running the behemoth that RIPE has become. A *nominal* membership fee and a pay-per-db-object would be fairer.
If your concern is over the amount you pay RIPE, then put up a proposal to get rid of soem of the extraneous 'projects' and other spending, so it gets back to just doing, only doing and exactly doing what it was created for - managing a db of a list of resources.
If your concern is over the amount of IP addresses you can get access to - you're 10 years too late Ipv4 has run out. Get over it.
Rob
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Hi, On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 04:00:15PM +0100, Andrea Cocito wrote:
- RIPE can not "sell" IP addresses: not true, RIPE already does have fees changing on the amount of allocated resources, the principle does not change (change the classes from small-medium-large to /4 /5 /6 /7 /8 ? /24, and give each class a fee, formally it is not a change in the model)
We don't. Wake up, welcome to 2013. All LIRs pay the same fee today (except for PI handling per-resource, not by-size). Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
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Hi For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list. And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:) For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him. Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it. For Christian: Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact AT YOUR ADDRESS in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
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Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. > > Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. > > It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>> >>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >
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I have no issue at all with Lu or his company - I have no issue with ISPs having a /8 either, if the justification is valid. I have an issue with allocations and assignments that seem to be incorrect/wrong and that there is no way to verify possible misusage that can only be verified by a single party (=RIPE), don't forget: i TRIED to work this out with RIPE. If the allocations are valid (and we see the proof for this) then i let him go, that's all i want - Currently we get nothing from RIPE (not even a confirmation that they *will* audit, that is *ALL* i wanted. Nothing more.).
Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. 6, now sit down and Google what Tor is and what a Tor exit does and how it helps the global community and in SPECIAL also the Chinese users. Why i "run"? (Trust me, if i wanted to run i'd be far gone in Africa by now.) Because the EU is a joke (and my political views are mine, you have no right to ask) and as Jew i have the right to migrate to Israel at any time, so this is the way of least resistance.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. I could post under my LIR or another one, why would that matter to you? I could've also posted it in a forum outside of RIPE, and that out of pure generosity so that RIPE can do this internal.
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
What i have to do with you? I see you announce 2 (TWO!!) RIPE /15 in the ARIN region so i report you to RIPE and escalate after ignoring, i see this as fully legitimate and as right for any RIPE member and non RIPEmember to report policy violating usage as obviously recommended by RIPE also. While doing this i obviously also check the background and report what i have to RIPE so they have more starting points for an investigation/audit. -- William Weber william@edisglobal.com | william@edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria Am 21.11.2013 um 17:52 schrieb H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list.
And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:)
For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe.
Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it.
For Christian:
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact AT YOUR ADDRESS in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
> Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> > Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR > Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ > An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> > > Dear Andrew, > > And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... > > Sorry, but this is not really any better now: > > This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total > allocations in the entire RIPE region? > > How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? > > Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? > > How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? > > This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > Hauptplatz 3/3 > 8010 Graz > Austria > Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 > Firmenbuch: FN 308697t > > phone: +43 316 827 500 > fax: +43 316 827 500 777 > http://www.edis.at > > This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. > > > Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: > >> Dear William, >> >> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >> >> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >> >> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: >> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >> >> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >> >> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >> >> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >> >> Kind regards >> >> Andrew de la Haye >> Chief Operations Officer >> RIPE NCC >> >> Singel 258 >> 1016 AB Amsterdam >> the Netherlands >> andrew@ripe.net >> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
> > Dear William, > > As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior > Management. > > They will come back to you ASAP. > > Best regards, > Andrea Cima > > RIPE NCC > > > On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> Dear Andrea, >> >> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >> >> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >> >> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >> >> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: >> >>> >>> Dear William, >>> >>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>> >>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>> lightly. >>> >>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Andrea Cima >>> Registration Services Manager >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> >>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>> >>>> >>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>> >>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>> >>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>> >>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>> >>>> >>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> >>>> >> ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
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I also want to strongly note that Lu started with talks about suing me - I just replied him why it makes no sense and he can save his money. I didn't start this argument and was *mainly* (yes, i wrote in very strong language to RIPE and accused Lu of many things which might be true or not, time will tell) on-business. Also don't get me wrong, Lu is not *not* the only one on my list, just the newest and largest one. I will report them to RIPE one-by-one until i am done and do not care for even a single second what you all think about this (i can report LIRs all i want, and i INSIST that 2 /15 in the ARIN region *ARE* a reason to request an audit), but RIPE did not provide me with *any* way to report a LIR for audit - And this is my main issue with them (for now). All i always wanted, and still want is a confirmation of RIPE that this LIR will be audited - Then i am happy, i have *some* trust left in the RIPE/NCC and cannot change the working policy (at least not now) anyway. -- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh william@edisglobal.com | william@edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria Am 21.11.2013 um 19:02 schrieb Sourish <sourish.ganguly@bssteleport.com>:
Dear William, I do understand your concern and appreciate that if you can take directly with RIPE NCC, instead of its members.
You have all the rights to ask for clear allocation, but probably your forum is wrong. Because no members are part of allocation in the RIPE.
Thanks for understanding
With Regards
Sourish
On 11/21/2013 06:47 PM, William Weber wrote:
I have no issue at all with Lu or his company - I have no issue with ISPs having a /8 either, if the justification is valid.
I have an issue with allocations and assignments that seem to be incorrect/wrong and that there is no way to verify possible misusage that can only be verified by a single party (=RIPE), don't forget: i TRIED to work this out with RIPE.
If the allocations are valid (and we see the proof for this) then i let him go, that's all i want - Currently we get nothing from RIPE (not even a confirmation that they *will* audit, that is *ALL* i wanted. Nothing more.).
Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. 6, now sit down and Google what Tor is and what a Tor exit does and how it helps the global community and in SPECIAL also the Chinese users. Why i "run"? (Trust me, if i wanted to run i'd be far gone in Africa by now.) Because the EU is a joke (and my political views are mine, you have no right to ask) and as Jew i have the right to migrate to Israel at any time, so this is the way of least resistance.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. I could post under my LIR or another one, why would that matter to you? I could've also posted it in a forum outside of RIPE, and that out of pure generosity so that RIPE can do this internal.
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
What i have to do with you? I see you announce 2 (TWO!!) RIPE /15 in the ARIN region so i report you to RIPE and escalate after ignoring, i see this as fully legitimate and as right for any RIPE member and non RIPEmember to report policy violating usage as obviously recommended by RIPE also. While doing this i obviously also check the background and report what i have to RIPE so they have more starting points for an investigation/audit.
-- William Weber william@edisglobal.com | william@edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 17:52 schrieb H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list.
And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:)
For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe.
Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it.
For Christian:
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact AT YOUR ADDRESS in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
> Hi: > > What a surprise morning. > > I think it was talking about me and my company. > > To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC. > > Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally. > > I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly. > > Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish > every detail about their business to the public. > > And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more. > > At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them. > > Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support. > > Let me know if you still have more questions. > > > > Kind regards > > Lu > > On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote: > >> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. >> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored. >> >> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) >> >> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? >> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture. >> >> -- >> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8: >> >> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com >> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. >> >> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). >> >> A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs: >> >> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >> >> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. >> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused. >> >> >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >> >> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. >> Seems unused. >> >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> >> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH. >> >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >> >> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well. >> >> >> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> >> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused. >> >> >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >> >> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. >> >> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): >> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 >> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 >> -- >> >> >> >> >> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) >> william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net >> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC >> Maribor, Slovenia >> >> >> >> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: >> >>> Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> >>> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR >>> Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >>> An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> >>> >>> Dear Andrew, >>> >>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... >>> >>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >>> >>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total >>> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >>> >>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >>> >>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? >>> >>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? >>> >>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> Hauptplatz 3/3 >>> 8010 Graz >>> Austria >>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >>> >>> phone: +43 316 827 500 >>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >>> http://www.edis.at >>> >>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. >>> >>> >>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: >>> >>>> Dear William, >>>> >>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >>>> >>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >>>> >>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: >>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>>> >>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>>> >>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >>>> >>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >>>> >>>> Kind regards >>>> >>>> Andrew de la Haye >>>> Chief Operations Officer >>>> RIPE NCC >>>> >>>> Singel 258 >>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>>> the Netherlands >>>> andrew@ripe.net >>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >>> >> >> >> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: >> >>> >>> Dear William, >>> >>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior >>> Management. >>> >>> They will come back to you ASAP. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Andrea Cima >>> >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> >>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>> Dear Andrea, >>>> >>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >>>> >>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >>>> >>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >>>> >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> >>>> >>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Dear William, >>>>> >>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>>>> >>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>>> lightly. >>>>> >>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>>> >>>>> Kind regards, >>>>> >>>>> Andrea Cima >>>>> Registration Services Manager >>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>>> >>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>>> >>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>>>> >>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> >>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>>> >>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>>> >>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>>> William Weber >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>>> NOC >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >> ---- >> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss >> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: >> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >> >> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. > ---- > If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss > mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: > https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view > > Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 07:12:05PM +0100, William Weber wrote:
All i always wanted, and still want is a confirmation of RIPE that this LIR will be audited - Then i am happy, i have *some* trust left in the RIPE/NCC and cannot change the working policy (at least not now) anyway.
and who died and made you Auditor General of the RIPE region? I pay RIPE to make the decision whether a LIR needs auditing or not, not to act as the enforment arm for some personal dispute or DSW. rgds, Sascha Luck
If it wouldn't get later and later with every minute, I would probably jump and get bag of popcorn and box of beer, but this way, I'm scared my mailbox will be filled by tomorrow morning with mails of people acting like 2 years old kids, and my phone will be beeping all night long. Can you guys please grow up, and solve your personal issues somewhere else. I don't think this list is appropriate place fpr these sort of problems, and I doubt majority of us have certain medical degree to be able to help in such situations. greets, Primoz Jeroncic Support - IP Connectivity & Routing ------------------------------------------------------------------- Softnet d.o.o. tel: +386 1 81 00 100 | Yesterday is history, Borovec 2 fax: +386 1 81 00 101 | tomorrow is mystery, 1236 Trzin primoz(at)softnet.si | but today is gift. That's Slovenija http://flea.softnet.si/ | why it's called present ------------------------------------------------------------------- On 11/21/13 7:12 PM, William Weber wrote:
I also want to strongly note that Lu started with talks about suing me - I just replied him why it makes no sense and he can save his money. I didn't start this argument and was *mainly* (yes, i wrote in very strong language to RIPE and accused Lu of many things which might be true or not, time will tell) on-business.
Also don't get me wrong, Lu is not *not* the only one on my list, just the newest and largest one. I will report them to RIPE one-by-one until i am done and do not care for even a single second what you all think about this (i can report LIRs all i want, and i INSIST that 2 /15 in the ARIN region *ARE* a reason to request an audit), but RIPE did not provide me with *any* way to report a LIR for audit - And this is my main issue with them (for now).
All i always wanted, and still want is a confirmation of RIPE that this LIR will be audited - Then i am happy, i have *some* trust left in the RIPE/NCC and cannot change the working policy (at least not now) anyway.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at> | http://edis.at <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 19:02 schrieb Sourish <sourish.ganguly@bssteleport.com <mailto:sourish.ganguly@bssteleport.com>>:
Dear William, I do understand your concern and appreciate that if you can take directly with RIPE NCC, instead of its members.
You have all the rights to ask for clear allocation, but probably your forum is wrong. Because no members are part of allocation in the RIPE.
Thanks for understanding
With Regards
Sourish
On 11/21/2013 06:47 PM, William Weber wrote:
I have no issue at all with Lu or his company - I have no issue with ISPs having a /8 either, if the justification is valid.
I have an issue with allocations and assignments that seem to be incorrect/wrong and that there is no way to verify possible misusage that can only be verified by a single party (=RIPE), don't forget: i TRIED to work this out with RIPE. * * If the allocations are valid (and we see the proof for this) then i let him go, that's all i want - Currently we get nothing from RIPE (not even a confirmation that they *will* audit, that is *ALL* i wanted. Nothing more.).
Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. 6, now sit down and Google what Tor is and what a Tor exit does and how it helps the global community and in SPECIAL also the *Chinese users*. Why i "run"? (Trust me, if i wanted to run i'd be far gone in Africa by now.) Because the EU is a joke (and my political views are mine, you have no right to ask) and as Jew i have the right to migrate to Israel at any time, so this is the way of least resistance.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. I could post under my LIR or another one, why would that matter to you? I could've also posted it in a forum outside of RIPE, and that out of pure generosity so that RIPE can do this internal.
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
What i have to do with you? I see you announce 2 (TWO!!) RIPE /15 in the ARIN region so i report you to RIPE and escalate after ignoring, i see this as fully legitimate and as right for any RIPE member and non RIPEmember to report policy violating usage as obviously recommended by RIPE also. While doing this i obviously also check the background and report what i have to RIPE so they have more starting points for an investigation/audit.
-- William Weber william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at> | http://edis.at <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 17:52 schrieb H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
Hi
For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list.
And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:)
For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe.
Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it.
For Christian:
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.*
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote:
> > Good Afternoon (in Europe) > > Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE > NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is > not in the best interest of its members. > > For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC > space in ARIN. > > *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ] > > El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com > <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió: > >> Hi: >> >> What a surprise morning. >> >> I think it was talking about me and my company. >> >> To clarify few things, the justification process of our >> application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC >> investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at >> the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very >> much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC. >> >> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community >> in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list >> knowing me personally. >> >> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me >> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be >> obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing >> quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies >> I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly. >> >> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not >> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are >> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of >> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC >> has rights to getting into confidential area of member's >> business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish >> every detail about their business to the public. >> >> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long >> as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with >> you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more. >> >> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members >> and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we >> have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, >> please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to >> assist in the matter with them. >> >> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, >> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate >> publish our private income data in the public space without >> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, >> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I >> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate >> member's understanding and community's support. >> >> Let me know if you still have more questions. >> >> >> >> Kind regards >> >> Lu >> >> On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber >> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com >> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote: >> >>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one >>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to >>> them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if >>> you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to >>> get others involved. >>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and >>> was ignored. >>> >>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up >>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, >>> now the last reply i got was again useless and without any >>> interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to >>> report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) >>> >>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before >>> i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely >>> took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, >>> isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? >>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make >>> your own picture. >>> >>> -- >>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a >>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have >>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8: >>> >>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - >>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/> >>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and >>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. >>> >>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced >>> on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles >>> based ISP Multacom (AS35916). >>> >>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are >>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him >>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs: >>> >>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >>> >>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles >>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail >>> shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. >>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the >>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries >>> set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem >>> unused. >>> >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >>> >>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX >>> outside of the RIPE region. >>> Seems unused. >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>> >>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was >>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be >>> used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH. >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >>> >>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) >>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well. >>> >>> >>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>> >>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the >>> Netherlands, unused. >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>> >>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. >>> >>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): >>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 >>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 >>> -- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) >>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | >>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at >>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> >>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC >>> Maribor, Slovenia >>> >>> >>> >>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: >>> >>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>> >>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR* >>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>> >>>> >>>> Dear Andrew, >>>> >>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i >>>> know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, >>>> the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, >>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, >>>> so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... >>>> >>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >>>> >>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even >>>> far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income >>>> reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and >>>> his sole trader status and has one of the largest total >>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >>>> >>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los >>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a >>>> measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >>>> >>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and >>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at >>>> add-alloc? >>>> >>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his >>>> upstream provider? >>>> >>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >>>> >>>> >>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>> William Weber >>>> >>>> -- >>>> EDIS GmbH >>>> NOC >>>> Hauptplatz 3/3 >>>> 8010 Graz >>>> Austria >>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >>>> >>>> phone: +43 316 827 500 >>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/> >>>> >>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is >>>> STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or >>>> organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain >>>> PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the >>>> intended recipient, you are hereby notified that >>>> any dissemination, distribution or copying of this >>>> communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you >>>> have received this communication in error, please notify us >>>> at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from >>>> your computer. >>>> >>>> >>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye >>>> <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>: >>>> >>>>> Dear William, >>>>> >>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket >>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE >>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department. >>>>> >>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address >>>>> space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation >>>>> procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 >>>>> run-out. >>>>> >>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and >>>>> community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group >>>>> Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete >>>>> description at: >>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>>>> >>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled >>>>> on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we >>>>> followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP >>>>> Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or >>>>> /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration >>>>> Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our >>>>> Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two >>>>> RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>>>> >>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process >>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were >>>>> entirely justified. >>>>> >>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to >>>>> contact me. >>>>> >>>>> Kind regards >>>>> >>>>> Andrew de la Haye >>>>> Chief Operations Officer >>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>> >>>>> Singel 258 >>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>>>> the Netherlands >>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net> >>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >>>> >>> >>> >>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster >>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>: >>> >>>> >>>> Dear William, >>>> >>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC >>>> Senior >>>> Management. >>>> >>>> They will come back to you ASAP. >>>> >>>> Best regards, >>>> Andrea Cima >>>> >>>> RIPE NCC >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>> Dear Andrea, >>>>> >>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not >>>>> exist at all? >>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a >>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse >>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >>>>> >>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE >>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely >>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that >>>>> if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your >>>>> obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with >>>>> access to a system to verify it himself. >>>>> >>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest >>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 >>>>> is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... >>>>> yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by >>>>> the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is >>>>> appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the >>>>> RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >>>>> >>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>> William Weber >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>> NOC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster >>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear William, >>>>>> >>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and >>>>>> documentation that >>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information >>>>>> provided by >>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other >>>>>> members. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false >>>>>> information to the >>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can >>>>>> then >>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. >>>>>> The same >>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having >>>>>> received a >>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>>>> lightly. >>>>>> >>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date >>>>>> on which >>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct >>>>>> date is 14 >>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>>>> >>>>>> Kind regards, >>>>>> >>>>>> Andrea Cima >>>>>> Registration Services Manager >>>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and >>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing >>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have >>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies >>>>>>> or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company >>>>>>> has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch >>>>>>> and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify >>>>>>> the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most >>>>>>> are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region >>>>>>> but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) >>>>>>> solely. >>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are >>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and >>>>>>> board decision. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE >>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE >>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE >>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>>>> William Weber >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>>>> NOC >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> >>> ---- >>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC >>> members-discuss >>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go >>> to the general page: >>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >>> >>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing >>> Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. >> ---- >> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC >> members-discuss >> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to >> the general page: >> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >> >> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing >> Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. > > ---- > If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss > mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to > the general page: > https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view > > Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". > From here, you can add or remove addresses. ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
-- Primoz Jeroncic / Softnet d.o.o.
haha, +1. still, lold about Lu, "I'll sue you!" :D William, will you go after ipv6 also? ipv4 is dead, deal with it :) On 21/11/13 20:49, Primoz Jeroncic / Softnet wrote:
If it wouldn't get later and later with every minute, I would probably jump and get bag of popcorn and box of beer, but this way, I'm scared my mailbox will be filled by tomorrow morning with mails of people acting like 2 years old kids, and my phone will be beeping all night long. Can you guys please grow up, and solve your personal issues somewhere else. I don't think this list is appropriate place fpr these sort of problems, and I doubt majority of us have certain medical degree to be able to help in such situations.
greets, Primoz Jeroncic Support - IP Connectivity & Routing ------------------------------------------------------------------- Softnet d.o.o. tel: +386 1 81 00 100 | Yesterday is history, Borovec 2 fax: +386 1 81 00 101 | tomorrow is mystery, 1236 Trzin primoz(at)softnet.si | but today is gift. That's Slovenija http://flea.softnet.si/ | why it's called present -------------------------------------------------------------------
On 11/21/13 7:12 PM, William Weber wrote:
I also want to strongly note that Lu started with talks about suing me - I just replied him why it makes no sense and he can save his money. I didn't start this argument and was *mainly* (yes, i wrote in very strong language to RIPE and accused Lu of many things which might be true or not, time will tell) on-business.
Also don't get me wrong, Lu is not *not* the only one on my list, just the newest and largest one. I will report them to RIPE one-by-one until i am done and do not care for even a single second what you all think about this (i can report LIRs all i want, and i INSIST that 2 /15 in the ARIN region *ARE* a reason to request an audit), but RIPE did not provide me with *any* way to report a LIR for audit - And this is my main issue with them (for now).
All i always wanted, and still want is a confirmation of RIPE that this LIR will be audited - Then i am happy, i have *some* trust left in the RIPE/NCC and cannot change the working policy (at least not now) anyway.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at> | http://edis.at <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 19:02 schrieb Sourish <sourish.ganguly@bssteleport.com <mailto:sourish.ganguly@bssteleport.com>>:
Dear William, I do understand your concern and appreciate that if you can take directly with RIPE NCC, instead of its members.
You have all the rights to ask for clear allocation, but probably your forum is wrong. Because no members are part of allocation in the RIPE.
Thanks for understanding
With Regards
Sourish
On 11/21/2013 06:47 PM, William Weber wrote:
I have no issue at all with Lu or his company - I have no issue with ISPs having a /8 either, if the justification is valid.
I have an issue with allocations and assignments that seem to be incorrect/wrong and that there is no way to verify possible misusage that can only be verified by a single party (=RIPE), don't forget: i TRIED to work this out with RIPE. * * If the allocations are valid (and we see the proof for this) then i let him go, that's all i want - Currently we get nothing from RIPE (not even a confirmation that they *will* audit, that is *ALL* i wanted. Nothing more.).
Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. 6, now sit down and Google what Tor is and what a Tor exit does and how it helps the global community and in SPECIAL also the *Chinese users*. Why i "run"? (Trust me, if i wanted to run i'd be far gone in Africa by now.) Because the EU is a joke (and my political views are mine, you have no right to ask) and as Jew i have the right to migrate to Israel at any time, so this is the way of least resistance.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. I could post under my LIR or another one, why would that matter to you? I could've also posted it in a forum outside of RIPE, and that out of pure generosity so that RIPE can do this internal.
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly. What i have to do with you? I see you announce 2 (TWO!!) RIPE /15 in the ARIN region so i report you to RIPE and escalate after ignoring, i see this as fully legitimate and as right for any RIPE member and non RIPEmember to report policy violating usage as obviously recommended by RIPE also. While doing this i obviously also check the background and report what i have to RIPE so they have more starting points for an investigation/audit.
-- William Weber william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at> | http://edis.at <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 17:52 schrieb H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
Hi
For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list.
And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:)
For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe.
Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it.
For Christian:
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact *AT YOUR ADDRESS* in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate > publish our private income data in the public space without > supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, > although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I > insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate > member's understanding and community's support. I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: *The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.*
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si>
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>>:
> Hi > > We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English. > > we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally > involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process, > > To inasset network: > > I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of > ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? > Kind regards > > Lu > > On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks > ]" <admin@inasset.es <mailto:admin@inasset.es>> wrote: > >> Good Afternoon (in Europe) >> >> Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE >> NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is >> not in the best interest of its members. >> >> For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC >> space in ARIN. >> >> *Administration* - [ inAsset Networks ] >> >> El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com >> <mailto:h.lu@anytimechinese.com>> escribió: >> >>> Hi: >>> >>> What a surprise morning. >>> >>> I think it was talking about me and my company. >>> >>> To clarify few things, the justification process of our >>> application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC >>> investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at >>> the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very >>> much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC. >>> >>> Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community >>> in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list >>> knowing me personally. >>> >>> I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me >>> personally and my private company as well. as it can not be >>> obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing >>> quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies >>> I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly. >>> >>> Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not >>> provide more details here, like every request, Member base are >>> trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of >>> application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC >>> has rights to getting into confidential area of member's >>> business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish >>> every detail about their business to the public. >>> >>> And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long >>> as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with >>> you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more. >>> >>> At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members >>> and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we >>> have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, >>> please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to >>> assist in the matter with them. >>> >>> Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, >>> making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate >>> publish our private income data in the public space without >>> supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, >>> although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I >>> insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate >>> member's understanding and community's support. >>> >>> Let me know if you still have more questions. >>> >>> >>> >>> Kind regards >>> >>> Lu >>> >>> On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber >>> <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com >>> <mailto:ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com>> wrote: >>> >>>> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one >>>> needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to >>>> them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if >>>> you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to >>>> get others involved. >>>> This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and >>>> was ignored. >>>> >>>> I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up >>>> mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, >>>> now the last reply i got was again useless and without any >>>> interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to >>>> report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) >>>> >>>> Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before >>>> i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely >>>> took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, >>>> isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? >>>> I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make >>>> your own picture. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a >>>> sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have >>>> RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8: >>>> >>>> His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - >>>> http://outsideheaven.com <http://outsideheaven.com/> >>>> Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and >>>> does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. >>>> >>>> First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced >>>> on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles >>>> based ISP Multacom (AS35916). >>>> >>>> A short view on the website shows that no real services are >>>> provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him >>>> personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs: >>>> >>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >>>> >>>> This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles >>>> ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail >>>> shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. >>>> The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the >>>> descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries >>>> set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem >>>> unused. >>>> >>>> >>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >>>> >>>> A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX >>>> outside of the RIPE region. >>>> Seems unused. >>>> >>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>>> >>>> RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was >>>> allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be >>>> used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH. >>>> >>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs >>>> >>>> Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) >>>> announced by OVH on France, unused as well. >>>> >>>> >>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>>> >>>> Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the >>>> Netherlands, unused. >>>> >>>> >>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs >>>> >>>> 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. >>>> >>>> List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): >>>> 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs >>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>> 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 >>>> 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 >>>> -- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) >>>> william@edisglobal.com <mailto:william@edisglobal.com> | >>>> william@william.si <mailto:william@william.si> | http://edis.at >>>> <http://edis.at/> | http://as57169.net <http://as57169.net/> >>>> EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC >>>> Maribor, Slovenia >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: >>>> >>>>> *Von: *William Weber <william@edis.at <mailto:william@edis.at>> >>>>> *Betreff: **Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR* >>>>> *Datum: *09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >>>>> *An: *Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>> >>>>> >>>>> Dear Andrew, >>>>> >>>>> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i >>>>> know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, >>>>> the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, >>>>> 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, >>>>> so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... >>>>> >>>>> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >>>>> >>>>> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even >>>>> far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income >>>>> reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and >>>>> his sole trader status and has one of the largest total >>>>> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >>>>> >>>>> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los >>>>> Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a >>>>> measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >>>>> >>>>> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and >>>>> never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at >>>>> add-alloc? >>>>> >>>>> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his >>>>> upstream provider? >>>>> >>>>> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>> William Weber >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>> NOC >>>>> Hauptplatz 3/3 >>>>> 8010 Graz >>>>> Austria >>>>> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >>>>> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >>>>> >>>>> phone: +43 316 827 500 >>>>> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >>>>> http://www.edis.at <http://www.edis.at/> >>>>> >>>>> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is >>>>> STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or >>>>> organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain >>>>> PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the >>>>> intended recipient, you are hereby notified that >>>>> any dissemination, distribution or copying of this >>>>> communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you >>>>> have received this communication in error, please notify us >>>>> at support@edis.at <mailto:support@edis.at> and delete it from >>>>> your computer. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye >>>>> <andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net>>: >>>>> >>>>>> Dear William, >>>>>> >>>>>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket >>>>>> has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE >>>>>> NCC's Registration Services Department. >>>>>> >>>>>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address >>>>>> space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation >>>>>> procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 >>>>>> run-out. >>>>>> >>>>>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and >>>>>> community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group >>>>>> Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete >>>>>> description at: >>>>>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>>>>> >>>>>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled >>>>>> on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we >>>>>> followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP >>>>>> Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or >>>>>> /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration >>>>>> Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our >>>>>> Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two >>>>>> RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>>>>> >>>>>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process >>>>>> completely and, based on the information we received, were >>>>>> entirely justified. >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to >>>>>> contact me. >>>>>> >>>>>> Kind regards >>>>>> >>>>>> Andrew de la Haye >>>>>> Chief Operations Officer >>>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>>> >>>>>> Singel 258 >>>>>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>>>>> the Netherlands >>>>>> andrew@ripe.net <mailto:andrew@ripe.net> >>>>>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>>>>> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >>>> >>>> Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster >>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>: >>>> >>>>> Dear William, >>>>> >>>>> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC >>>>> Senior >>>>> Management. >>>>> >>>>> They will come back to you ASAP. >>>>> >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> Andrea Cima >>>>> >>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>>> Dear Andrea, >>>>>> >>>>>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not >>>>>> exist at all? >>>>>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a >>>>>> suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse >>>>>> than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >>>>>> >>>>>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE >>>>>> members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely >>>>>> *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that >>>>>> if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your >>>>>> obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with >>>>>> access to a system to verify it himself. >>>>>> >>>>>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest >>>>>> allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 >>>>>> is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... >>>>>> yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by >>>>>> the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is >>>>>> appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the >>>>>> RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>>> William Weber >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>>> NOC >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster >>>>>> <hostmaster@ripe.net <mailto:hostmaster@ripe.net>>: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Dear William, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and >>>>>>> documentation that >>>>>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information >>>>>>> provided by >>>>>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other >>>>>>> members. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false >>>>>>> information to the >>>>>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can >>>>>>> then >>>>>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. >>>>>>> The same >>>>>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having >>>>>>> received a >>>>>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>>>>> lightly. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date >>>>>>> on which >>>>>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct >>>>>>> date is 14 >>>>>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>>>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Kind regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Andrea Cima >>>>>>> Registration Services Manager >>>>>>> RIPE NCC >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and >>>>>>>> at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing >>>>>>>> <removed> and <removed>) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have >>>>>>>> either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies >>>>>>>> or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company >>>>>>>> has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch >>>>>>>> and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify >>>>>>>> the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most >>>>>>>> are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region >>>>>>>> but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) >>>>>>>> solely. >>>>>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are >>>>>>>> very questionable as well and overturning a members and >>>>>>>> board decision. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE >>>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE >>>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE >>>>>>>> reached the last /8? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>>>>> William Weber >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>>>>> NOC >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>> ---- >>>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC >>>> members-discuss >>>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go >>>> to the general page: >>>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >>>> >>>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing >>>> Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. >>> ---- >>> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC >>> members-discuss >>> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to >>> the general page: >>> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >>> >>> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing >>> Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. >> ---- >> If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss >> mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to >> the general page: >> https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view >> >> Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". >> From here, you can add or remove addresses. > ---- > If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss > mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to > the general page: > https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view > > Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". > From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
-- Tālrunis: +371 67788888
Hi Thanks everybody for the support William, yes, I fully understand you want to work out with Ripe NCC for simple question: what is our justification material and how we get justified with the amount of range we have. But that is the exact the confidential part of the question, if anyone can work into the door of RIR and asking for justification material of any Ripe Ncc member, I believe RIR will never able to do their job anymore. We work with multiple RIRs, and I am ensure you that all of them are very good at their job, so if we really doing something bad around, All of RIRs around global would not give us this amount resource.(you have find out some of our sub companies), and yes, I am not participate in this region alone, I also join in African region, and in the future, maybe lacnic and other regions as well. As Ripe NCC has indicated, they will talk to us if there is anything we missing with current policy text, and I am 100% ensure you that we will following their instracturtions to make sure we did everything correctly. Regarding your mentioned action towards other members, I would suggest you trust Ripe NCC with their job, as a member yourself, you should already know how tough they are in asking the exact needed information for justification process. And as today's policy, even the need does not exists anymore, LIR are not forced to return the allocation but they can exchange it for other things with another LIR in the region. If you are not happy with current policy development, please move to the PDP, and you can propose the change you might think is proper for the community. And last, I agree it is not the matter for the list and my apologize for bother everybody this afternoon, It will be my last post in the treads and william, please, if you have more question about us or even you want to meet me in person, you are very welcome to send me a personal Email, as long as it is not confidential, I will happy to answer. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午2:47, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
I have no issue at all with Lu or his company - I have no issue with ISPs having a /8 either, if the justification is valid.
I have an issue with allocations and assignments that seem to be incorrect/wrong and that there is no way to verify possible misusage that can only be verified by a single party (=RIPE), don't forget: i TRIED to work this out with RIPE.
If the allocations are valid (and we see the proof for this) then i let him go, that's all i want - Currently we get nothing from RIPE (not even a confirmation that they *will* audit, that is *ALL* i wanted. Nothing more.).
Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe. 6, now sit down and Google what Tor is and what a Tor exit does and how it helps the global community and in SPECIAL also the Chinese users. Why i "run"? (Trust me, if i wanted to run i'd be far gone in Africa by now.) Because the EU is a joke (and my political views are mine, you have no right to ask) and as Jew i have the right to migrate to Israel at any time, so this is the way of least resistance.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. I could post under my LIR or another one, why would that matter to you? I could've also posted it in a forum outside of RIPE, and that out of pure generosity so that RIPE can do this internal.
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
What i have to do with you? I see you announce 2 (TWO!!) RIPE /15 in the ARIN region so i report you to RIPE and escalate after ignoring, i see this as fully legitimate and as right for any RIPE member and non RIPEmember to report policy violating usage as obviously recommended by RIPE also. While doing this i obviously also check the background and report what i have to RIPE so they have more starting points for an investigation/audit.
-- William Weber william@edisglobal.com | william@edis.at | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Graz, Austria
Am 21.11.2013 um 17:52 schrieb H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
For information: Just to be clear to every member, nor my company or me personally receive any message William has sent to us before, the only message I have read from william was on 14th Feb,2012, he replied my treads regarding member fees in the member mailing list.
And as I state in the last Email, I am at RIPE, AFRINIC,LACNIC,ICANN,IGF,and many other internet meetings, so I am not a guy not reachable, you can easily attend any of the meetings and talk to me in a coffee break. I believe many active members in the list can proof that for me. You might not remember my name, I am the big Chinese guy always being around in every Ripe meeting---and most time the only Chinese there as well. So if someone wants to talk to me, really don't need to go that far all the way to China to finds me, I live in the Europe, and I have been told I am more european thinking than Chinese by many people:)
For William: Giving all the information with possible unlawful activity you might involved with(the reason government would investigate about you), I am very doubtfully wonder your profession and what is your really involvement with us. And why you need to run away from Europe.
Both Slovenia/Austria are subject to European Law, and as my very limited knowledge about it, it is unlawful to obtain third party private financial information without court permission--even for any countries' government. I believe any level of LIR audit shouldn't involved illegal information or research about private company or private person's confidential information. This is way too far beyond simple Ripe's policy. I would appreciate fellow members does not support such unlawful investigation going on as if let it goes on, every of us might one day being disclose your private company data and your personal financial information just because other people think you have a bit bigger IP range than him.
Last but not least, if you are not speaking for EDIS, and if your company are not yet a Ripe member, I think it is inappreicate for you to post in this list, as it is only for members. But you still can post on the policy mailing list, and we are very happy to hear what policy experts has to say about our activity, although we are very carefully read though every policy and make sure our activity does not conflicts with Ripe policy, due to the scale of our operation, we might miss one or two things, and if it has been pointed out, we are very happy to correct it.
For Christian:
Thanks for the support. I also wonder where this guy is coming from and what really is his problem with our business, as we really has nothing to do with him at all. and I personally has been actively involved in the Ripe policy working group for many years, we would seriously obey every Ripe policy, and end of the day, I see nothing wrong as playing the game fairly.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午1:12, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
Hello together,
So so so, finally he can reply - Hello there Mr. Lu, why were my previous contact tries ignored?
I was in fact AT YOUR ADDRESS in Holland in 2012, nobody there - I would have someone sent to your address in China also, but that one is unclear described.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well I do not need to share any sources (what is this, the PLA?), all data was obtained legally in my country of residence (Slovenia) and Austria - I can not vouch for correctness but in the past it was usually near the expected. Not like your data is secret in the Netherlands.
making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
I'm not sure what gives you the idea that Dutch law would be applicable to me in Slovenia/Austaira (or at all, considering that Slovenia/Austria as per constitution cannot extradict citizens)?
The statement of mine - *POSSIBLE* bribe - Is fully legal to make, even the implication of it would be - The RIPE ticket system is also not the public and neither is the mailing list, it is a closed system.
You can sue me all you want, i have not much to loose currently, and once cleared move to Israel which does neither extradict nor care much about Europe. The Austrian police confiscated my hardware 2012 and 2013, the Austrian police investigates my financial transactions, the Polish police wants to see me in jail (and has an order for that), Hongkong authorities are not amused, my phones and internet is taped, i am being followed by the Austrian police.
Just google my name and add "tor" and you get an image, you (and no one else) can threaten me with "law" anymore.
I will reply more lenghty later, because even though the Austrian government does not like me they still send me invitations to broadband expansion forums and force me to attend and speak.
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
This is also a note: The statements here are fully personal or statements of my own companies, not EDIS GmbH which is however one LIR i represent.
-- William Weber | RIPE: WW | LIR: william@william.si
Am 21.11.2013 um 16:44 schrieb "H.Lu" <h.lu@anytimechinese.com>:
Hi
We do not want to sue "anybody" here, sorry for mistyping English.
we followed all the process in the Ripe region, and I personally involved and participated in the Ripe policy development process,
To inasset network:
I wonder how you as single organization define "best interest of ripe member" and justifying other member's IP usage? Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:26, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
> As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. > This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored. > > I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.) > > Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? > I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture. > > -- > Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8: > > His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com > Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all. > > First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916). > > A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs: > > 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs > > This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. > The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused. > > > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs > > A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. > Seems unused. > > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > > RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH. > > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs > > Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well. > > > 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > > Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused. > > > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs > > 2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom. > > List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): > 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs > 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 > 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 > 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 > -- > > > > > William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) > william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net > EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC > Maribor, Slovenia > > > > Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht: > >> Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> >> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR >> Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ >> An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net> >> >> Dear Andrew, >> >> And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same... >> >> Sorry, but this is not really any better now: >> >> This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total >> allocations in the entire RIPE region? >> >> How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN? >> >> Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc? >> >> How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider? >> >> This all is still very fishy and not really impressive... >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> Hauptplatz 3/3 >> 8010 Graz >> Austria >> Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 >> Firmenbuch: FN 308697t >> >> phone: +43 316 827 500 >> fax: +43 316 827 500 777 >> http://www.edis.at >> >> This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer. >> >> >> Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>: >> >>> Dear William, >>> >>> We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. >>> >>> Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. >>> >>> This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: >>> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf >>> >>> Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. >>> >>> The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. >>> >>> If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. >>> >>> Kind regards >>> >>> Andrew de la Haye >>> Chief Operations Officer >>> RIPE NCC >>> >>> Singel 258 >>> 1016 AB Amsterdam >>> the Netherlands >>> andrew@ripe.net >>> tel: +31 20 535 4444 >>> fax: +31 20 535 4445 >> > > > Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior >> Management. >> >> They will come back to you ASAP. >> >> Best regards, >> Andrea Cima >> >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> Dear Andrea, >>> >>> So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? >>> Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... >>> >>> Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. >>> >>> It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC >>> >>> >>> Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: >>> >>>> >>>> Dear William, >>>> >>>> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >>>> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >>>> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >>>> >>>> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >>>> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >>>> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >>>> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >>>> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >>>> lightly. >>>> >>>> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >>>> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >>>> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >>>> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >>>> >>>> Kind regards, >>>> >>>> Andrea Cima >>>> Registration Services Manager >>>> RIPE NCC >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>>>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>>>> >>>>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>>>> >>>>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>>>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>>>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>>>> >>>>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> >>>>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> >>>>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> >>>>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>>>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>>>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>>>> William Weber >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> EDIS GmbH >>>>> NOC >>>>> >>>>> >>> > ---- > If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss > mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: > https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view > > Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses. ---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hi, On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 05:12:33PM +0100, William Weber wrote:
Also, most here agree with me and you CLEARLY violate RIPE policies with the ARIN routing and others - So *you* are the one that should explain himself, not me.
Speak for yourself, and for "the administration", if you will. Don't try to speak for "most here". I, for one, have met Lu Heng in person, have seen him actively take part in the address policy discussions, and do trust the RIPE NCC to very closely check whether such a big allocation can be backed by numbers and documentation. So I most certainly do not see "CLEARLY" that there would be a violation of RIPE policies - and even if it's currently announced from elsewhere, that doesn't mean it's not actually *used* in the RIPE service region (think "VPN services"), which is the key issue - address space being *used*, and not siphoned off elsewhere. Even though the latter point is a bit moot nowadays. Gert Doering -- The Netmaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 10:51 AM, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote:
Hi,
Don't try to speak for "most here". I, for one, have met Lu Heng in person, have seen him actively take part in the address policy discussions, and do trust the RIPE NCC to very closely check whether such a big allocation can be backed by numbers and documentation. So I most certainly do not see "CLEARLY" that there would be a violation of RIPE policies - and even if it's currently announced from elsewhere, that doesn't mean it's not actually *used* in the RIPE service region (think "VPN services"), which is the key issue - address space being *used*, and not siphoned off elsewhere. Even though the latter point is a bit moot nowadays.
Agreed. However: nmap -n -sn -PE -T4 37.222.0.0/15 Nmap done: 131072 IP addresses (406 hosts up) scanned in 210.43 seconds --Dave
Hi, On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 11:06:59AM -0700, David Knell wrote:
nmap -n -sn -PE -T4 37.222.0.0/15 Nmap done: 131072 IP addresses (406 hosts up) scanned in 210.43 seconds
Yes. So he has a firewall in there? Try pinging the IP range any large 3G operator assigns to their UMTS customers. You'll find that almost all telcos block packets from the outside to their UMTS customer ranges... does that mean the addresses are not in use? It's not that easy to see from the outside whether a block is used or not, but I *do* know from experience that the RIPE NCC is quite thorough in asking nasty questions if it's "not obvious" that a block is full, before assigning a new one. Gert Doering -- No Attribution -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
Good Afternoon (in Europe) Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members. For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN. Administration - [ inAsset Networks ] El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote:
x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>)
Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone....
LIR is nl.outsideheaven
I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision.
185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Hi confidentiality are very important to protect everybody's business rights. We do not want to sue everybody here---even though I believe everybody should agree that if your company financial data get inaccurately published and your business secret getting asked in the member list, would you answer it? To answer everybody here: 1. Regarding announcement, I am not the tech guy, I will check with our tech guy and our policy guy and make sure everything is obeying the policy, and yes, as far as I know, we do announce smaller allocation inside of large allocation outside of Europe, in which is allowed by current policy, there is no policy text forbidden globe announcement. And there are many members in the list doing the same practice. 2. Regarding our business, we do not see a point that we making anything public here, if anyone would suggest any unlawful practice you may think we have, we are very happy to assist in the matter. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:28, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members.
If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take lightly.
Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825...
Kind regards,
Andrea Cima Registration Services Manager RIPE NCC
On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: > x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) > > > Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... > > LIR is nl.outsideheaven > > I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. > His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. > The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. > > 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 > -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? > > > 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 > -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE > > > > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC
---- If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
If you don't want to receive emails from the RIPE NCC members-discuss mailing list, please log in to your LIR Portal account and go to the general page: https://lirportal.ripe.net/general/view
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Click on "Edit my LIR details", under "Subscribed Mailing Lists". From here, you can add or remove addresses.
Another lie on your part: 5.224.0.0/15 *[BGP/170] 8w0d 11:17:44, MED 0, localpref 150, from 213.248.64.245 AS path: 3561 35916 I to 213.155.135.28 via ae0.0 to 213.155.135.34 via ae1.0 > to 213.155.135.40 via ae2.0 to 213.155.135.42 via ae3.0 to 213.155.135.48 via ae4.0 to 213.155.135.54 via ae5.0 to 213.155.136.240 via ae11.0 to 213.155.136.242 via ae12.0 Tested range is announced outside RIPE region (AS35916) in full. On 21 Nov 2013, at 16:39, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> wrote:
Hi
confidentiality are very important to protect everybody's business rights.
We do not want to sue everybody here---even though I believe everybody should agree that if your company financial data get inaccurately published and your business secret getting asked in the member list, would you answer it? To answer everybody here:
1. Regarding announcement, I am not the tech guy, I will check with our tech guy and our policy guy and make sure everything is obeying the policy, and yes, as far as I know, we do announce smaller allocation inside of large allocation outside of Europe, in which is allowed by current policy, there is no policy text forbidden globe announcement. And there are many members in the list doing the same practice.
2. Regarding our business, we do not see a point that we making anything public here, if anyone would suggest any unlawful practice you may think we have, we are very happy to assist in the matter.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:28, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department.
Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out.
This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers.
The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me.
Kind regards
Andrew de la Haye Chief Operations Officer RIPE NCC
Singel 258 1016 AB Amsterdam the Netherlands andrew@ripe.net tel: +31 20 535 4444 fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote:
Dear Andrea,
So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery...
Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself.
It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC
Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
> > Dear William, > > All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that > demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by > members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. > > If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the > RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then > start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same > counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a > bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take > lightly. > > Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which > the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 > September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: > http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... > > Kind regards, > > Andrea Cima > Registration Services Manager > RIPE NCC > > > On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >> >> >> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >> >> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >> >> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >> >> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >> >> >> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >> >> >> >> >> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >> William Weber >> >> -- >> EDIS GmbH >> NOC >> >>
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
Hi Andrei: I haven't been involve with daily operation of the company for quite sometime. But if what you claim is true, we will correct it in next few days and investigate the case. let us know if any other questions you may have. Kind regards Lu On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:42, Andrei Kushnireuski <ipas.master@gmail.com> wrote:
Another lie on your part:
5.224.0.0/15 *[BGP/170] 8w0d 11:17:44, MED 0, localpref 150, from 213.248.64.245 AS path: 3561 35916 I to 213.155.135.28 via ae0.0 to 213.155.135.34 via ae1.0 > to 213.155.135.40 via ae2.0 to 213.155.135.42 via ae3.0 to 213.155.135.48 via ae4.0 to 213.155.135.54 via ae5.0 to 213.155.136.240 via ae11.0 to 213.155.136.242 via ae12.0
Tested range is announced outside RIPE region (AS35916) in full.
On 21 Nov 2013, at 16:39, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> wrote:
Hi
confidentiality are very important to protect everybody's business rights.
We do not want to sue everybody here---even though I believe everybody should agree that if your company financial data get inaccurately published and your business secret getting asked in the member list, would you answer it? To answer everybody here:
1. Regarding announcement, I am not the tech guy, I will check with our tech guy and our policy guy and make sure everything is obeying the policy, and yes, as far as I know, we do announce smaller allocation inside of large allocation outside of Europe, in which is allowed by current policy, there is no policy text forbidden globe announcement. And there are many members in the list doing the same practice.
2. Regarding our business, we do not see a point that we making anything public here, if anyone would suggest any unlawful practice you may think we have, we are very happy to assist in the matter.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 下午12:28, "Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]" <admin@inasset.es> wrote:
Good Afternoon (in Europe)
Mr. Lu, we will follow your activities closely, and see if RIPE NCC takes action in the event the use of your assigned space is not in the best interest of its members.
For now, we would like to know why you are announcing RIPE NCC space in ARIN.
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ]
El 21/11/2013, a las 16:02, H.Lu <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> escribió:
Hi:
What a surprise morning.
I think it was talking about me and my company.
To clarify few things, the justification process of our application took very long in ripe NCC and I believe ripe NCC investigate about us heavily in the major service we provided at the time of it being justified. and corruption claim are very much inappreicate and I would ask you apologizes to Ripe NCC.
Me as individual as been actively involved in the ripe community in past 5 years, and I believe most active member in the list knowing me personally.
I wondering where you have the inaccurate income data about me personally and my private company as well. as it can not be obtain legally and the data was not correct. I personally owing quite few companies worldwide but they are all private companies I do not feel the need to share our financial details publicly.
Most part of our business are confidential so sorry we can not provide more details here, like every request, Member base are trusting Ripe NCC to make the right decision at the time of application. That is how business really works, only Ripe NCC has rights to getting into confidential area of member's business, otherwise I believe every member would have to publish every detail about their business to the public.
And I would ask if you do have more questions for me, as long as it is not confidential, I'd like to share my stories with you. Please do not bother Ripe NCC for this matter any more.
At this point, Ripe NCC are just a book keeper for its members and Ripe community, they are not police force, if you do feel we have some unlawful practice--thought I seriously doubt about it, please contact related law enforcement and we are very happy to assist in the matter with them.
Last but not least, as I just had phone call with my lawyer, making an criminal charge(corruption) to Ripe NCC, inaccurate publish our private income data in the public space without supporting evidence are very serious offense under european law, although my lawyer strongly suggest him to write the letter, I insists my self to write here just because I would appreciate member's understanding and community's support.
Let me know if you still have more questions.
Kind regards
Lu
On 2013-11-21, at 上午11:05, William Weber <ripe-members-discussion@edisglobal.com> wrote:
As RIPE seems to have decided that i can be ignored and no one needs to reply to me i make this public now as threatened to them before - See Dear Andrew, i don't care what you say - if you don't reply me with anything useful then i take steps to get others involved. This is not the first time i reported a LIR for evaluation and was ignored.
I waited over a month for any reply and sent multiple follow up mails, no replies and the ticket is "open" in the Lirportal, now the last reply i got was again useless and without any interest (No Andrew, i cannot use the LIR<>LIR report form to report LIR<>RIPE, i can't even enter that there.)
Theres some more fun to be had, here's a text i prepared before i sent my mail to RIPE after some investigations (which merely took 10 minutes time and a few calls to some associates) - Now, isn't that proof enough for an evaluation? I think so and the other LIRs i represent do as well, but make your own picture.
-- Today we follow an interesting 'ISP' which is based on a sole-trader in the Netherlands which managed to have RIPE/Afrinic/ARIN assign him IPv4 space totaling to a /8:
His name is Heng Lu, also known as "OutsideHeaven" - http://outsideheaven.com Seemingly based in the Netherlands Lu is of Chinese origin and does (as far as informations go) not live in Europe at all.
First being a customer of OVH and having his IP space announced on OVHs AS now most space seems to be announced by Los Angeles based ISP Multacom (AS35916).
A short view on the website shows that no real services are provided yet massive amounts of IPs are registered to him personally, him as sole trader or his companies at all RIRs:
154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs
This is an AFRINIC net assigned to a company in the Seychelles ("Abacus (Seychelles) Limited"), the Person handle and mail shows the connection to OutsideHeaven. The network itself contains smaller assignments, all with the descr of "CloudInnovation infrastructure" and various countries set (AD, SD, YT….), most IPs are not announced at all and seem unused.
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
A RIPE network from 2012.09 announced by Multacom in LAX outside of the RIPE region. Seems unused.
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
RIPE network dating to 2012.07 (Just 3 months after the /15 was allocated, exactly the timeframe RIPE required a space to be used in to get a new one…), announced on OVH.
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs
Yet another RIPE network from 2012.04 (who can spell 'bribe'?) announced by OVH on France, unused as well.
46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
Allocated 2010.11 - Announced by a datacenter in the Netherlands, unused.
31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65000 IPs
2011.04 - Announced in LAX/Multacom.
List (not complete, there is more smaller assignments on him): 154.80.0.0/12 - Afrinic - 1.048.574 IPs 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 46.136.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2010.11 178.236.224.0/20 - RIPE - 4096 IPs - 2010.06 --
William Weber | RIPE Person: WW | LIR: at.edisgmbh (among others) william@edisglobal.com | william@william.si | http://edis.at | http://as57169.net EDIS GmbH (AS57169) NOC Maribor, Slovenia
Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: William Weber <william@edis.at> Betreff: Aw: NCC#2013100726 Complaint against a LIR Datum: 09. Oktober 2013 13:18:36 MESZ An: Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>
Dear Andrew,
And who verified that these 2 analysts were not bribed... i know guys buying /12s by bribing AFRINIC officials (in fact, the same LIR as this mail is about "bought" space there also, 154.80.0.0/12) and this isn't unheard in LACNIC/APNIC either, so what tells me RIPE did/does not do the same...
Sorry, but this is not really any better now:
This guy "accidentally" sits in Amsterdam as well, not even far from you, being Chinese(!) with barely 3000EUR income reports filled 2012/2013 in the Netherlands for his BVs and his sole trader status and has one of the largest total allocations in the entire RIPE region?
How can he announce 2(!) *ENTIRE* /15 from an ARIN ASN in Los Angeles while i and others got contacted by RIPE about a measly /24 on an ARIN ASN?
Why do his assignments make no sense, look auto generated and never contain any end-user data? Why was this not verified at add-alloc?
How does he use over a million IPs on a 100Mbit uplink to his upstream provider?
This all is still very fishy and not really impressive...
Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, William Weber
-- EDIS GmbH NOC Hauptplatz 3/3 8010 Graz Austria Umsatzsteuer-ID: ATU 64124511 Firmenbuch: FN 308697t
phone: +43 316 827 500 fax: +43 316 827 500 777 http://www.edis.at
This message was sent by EDIS GmbH, it is STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL and is solely for the individual or organisation to whom it is addressed. It may contain PRIVILEGED and CONFIDENTIAL information. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication and its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us at support@edis.at and delete it from your computer.
Am 08.10.2013 um 11:55 schrieb Andrew de la Haye <andrew@ripe.net>:
> Dear William, > > We take your allegations very seriously. As such, your ticket has been escalated to me by Andrea Cima, manager of the RIPE NCC's Registration Services Department. > > Before the RIPE NCC reached the last /8 of IPv4 address space, we implemented a temporarily enhanced allocation procedure to ensure a fair, neutral and well-documented IPv4 run-out. > > This procedure was communicated to our membership and community at meetings, via the Address Policy Working Group Mailing List, and via our website. You can find the complete description at: > https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf > > Measures were taken to ensure our members' needs were filled on a first-come, first-served basis, and to ensure that we followed due diligence. Each request was evaluated by two IP Resource Analysts. Furthermore, all large requests (/15 PA or /18 PI or more) were rigorously evaluated by Registration Services Management, checked for policy compliance by our Policy Development Officer, and were finally approved by two RIPE NCC Senior Managers. > > The IPv4 requests you have listed followed this process completely and, based on the information we received, were entirely justified. > > If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact me. > > Kind regards > > Andrew de la Haye > Chief Operations Officer > RIPE NCC > > Singel 258 > 1016 AB Amsterdam > the Netherlands > andrew@ripe.net > tel: +31 20 535 4444 > fax: +31 20 535 4445
Am 07.10.2013 um 14:29 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>:
Dear William,
As requested I have escalated your complaint to the RIPE NCC Senior Management.
They will come back to you ASAP.
Best regards, Andrea Cima
RIPE NCC
On Fri, 4 Oct 2013 16:11:37 +0200, William Weber wrote: > Dear Andrea, > > So if there is no proof for a bribe you do as it does not exist at all? > Why did no one tell me this before, i would have come with a suitcase of cash to AMS... Seriously, this statement is worse than what 3rd world dictators state all the time about bribery... > > Considering that RIPE members have no access to other RIPE members add-alloc (or any other) forms it is also entirely *impossible* to prove lies in them (hey, how should i do that if i can't read them at all?) - Thus it clearly is your obligation to verify this claims OR provide the accuser with access to a system to verify it himself. > > It is by itself alone VERY suspicious that the single largest allocation for weeks is allocated 8 days before the last /8 is reached to an unknown sole trader without any business.... yes, i think i have enough 'proof' to get this verified by the RIPE, please escalate it to whoever you think is appropriate or i will do so myself today at 00:00 via the RIPE mailing list to ALL members. > > Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, > William Weber > > -- > EDIS GmbH > NOC > > > Am 04.10.2013 um 15:52 schrieb RIPE NCC Hostmaster <hostmaster@ripe.net>: > >> >> Dear William, >> >> All allocations are issued based on RIPE policy and documentation that >> demonstrates the need for those resources. The information provided by >> members is confidential and cannot be shared with other members. >> >> If you have proof that a member has provided false information to the >> RIPE NCC, please provide us this proof. Based on this we can then >> start evaluating the claims and take appropriate actions. The same >> counts for your accusation of a RIPE NCC emloyee having received a >> bribe, which is a very serious accusation, that we do not take >> lightly. >> >> Finally it seems there is a misunderstanding about the date on which >> the RIPE NCC has reached its last /8 policy. The correct date is 14 >> September 2012. Please find the official announcement at: >> http://www.ripe.net/ripe/mail/archives/ncc-services-wg/2012-September/001825... >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Andrea Cima >> Registration Services Manager >> RIPE NCC >> >> >> On Thu, 3 Oct 2013 13:49:32 +0200, William Weber wrote: >>> x-ncc-regid: at.edisgmbh (and at.<removed>, li.<removed>, li.<removed>, plus representing <removed> and <removed>) >>> >>> >>> Yes, i have to complain again to evaluate someone.... >>> >>> LIR is nl.outsideheaven >>> >>> I am 100% sure that the allocation of his netblocks have either used false data in the add-alloc forms, plain lies or bribes (which i see as the most likely) - His company has no trading activity in any country (verified with Dutch and Chinese tax authorities) and nothing that would justify the usage of this amounts of IPv4 space. >>> His usage of some of them also violates RIPE rules, most are for example not even announced inside the RIPE region but originate from AS35916 (Multacom in Los Angeles, USA) solely. >>> The assignments while RIPE already reached the last /8 are very questionable as well and overturning a members and board decision. >>> >>> 185.2.48.0/22 - RIPE - 1024 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> 5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> 37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 >>> -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8? >>> >>> >>> 31.201.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2011.04 >>> -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards, >>> William Weber >>> >>> -- >>> EDIS GmbH >>> NOC
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- Andrei Kushnireuski AK1065-RIPE regID: cz.alfatelecom
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On 21/11/2013 14:05, William Weber wrote:
5.224.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.09 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /15 5 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
5.132.0.0/16 - RIPE - 65.534 IPs - 2012.07 -> Announced in the ARIN region entirely, not RIPE -> How was he able to obtain a /16 3 months AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
37.222.0.0/15 - RIPE - 131.070 IPs - 2012.04 -> How was he able to obtain a /15 1 month AFTER RIPE reached the last /8?
fyi, ripe ncc exhausted their regular address pool on sep 14 2012: http://www.ripe.net/internet-coordination/ipv4-exhaustion Not sure why you're claiming that exhaustion happened in march 2013. Nick
participants (35)
-
"Mag. Matthias Šubik" -
Administration - [ inAsset Networks ] -
Alexandr Gurbo -
Andrea Cocito -
Andrei -
Andrei Kushnireuski
-
Andrew de la Haye -
Christian Hoffmann [sfip84 Hosting und mehr UG] -
Daniel Ponticello -
David Knell -
Erik Bais -
Fahad AlShirawi -
Francis GASCHET -
Gert Doering -
H.Lu -
Hans Petter Holen -
Henrik Kramshøj Solido NOC abuse -
Jānis Jaunošāns -
Michael Kennedy -
Nick Hilliard -
Oliver Bryssau -
Primoz Jeroncic / Softnet -
Rade Djurasinovic -
RIPE -
rob.golding＠astutium.com -
Sander Steffann -
Sascha E. Pollok -
Sascha Luck -
sergey myasoedov -
Sergey Razu -
Simon Lockhart -
Sourish -
Thomas Mangin -
Tony Turner -
William Weber