hi warren, i understand, support, and admire your intent and your persistent effort. i wish i had your stamina. but the ietf has spent years telling operators how important the ietf is while treating ops as second class citizens inside the ietf[0]. i sympathise that the latter is much harder to address than the former; welcome to late stage capitalism. and i confess to having given up. but i can not resist two comments on the former, dns tech content o the ietf is not an unknown. the nerdy ripe dns wg members already follow the ietf dns documents; though some at a safe distance :). the issue may be more how to make it efficient and productive to engage. when being a standards professional is not one's dayjob, efficiency is key. o your message focuses on the deleg effort to boil the ocean yet omits the only (to me) deeply interesting work, that of johan stenstam et alia on multi-provider dns[1]. this is something dns operators actually need! randy --- [0] https://archive.psg.com/051000.ccr-ivtf.html [1] https://indico.dns-oarc.net/event/56/contributions/1223/