- tld-wg - mailman.ripe.net

Problems with PL ccTLD's administrator
by JimFleming＠unety.net 01 Sep '98

01 Sep '98

-----Original Message----- From: W.Sylwestrzak at icm.edu.pl <wojsyl1 at icm.edu.pl> To: Artur Grzymala <artur at zoo.pl> Cc: tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> Date: Monday, August 31, 1998 7:00 PM Subject: Re: Problems with PL ccTLD's administrator Artur Grzymala: > > Hi, > > I'm looking for help. PL administrator stole my domain. Where can I write > about it? Which internet organization can help me? > First of all, a domainname is not your 'property', actually it's no-one's property. And please don't explain what you mean by PL administrator *stealing* *your* domain. if you have a legal agreement with him, then just sue him for breaking it. --w @@@@@@@@@ I am not sure that it makes sense to fill the courts with domain name disputes that might be easily handled, using the Internet, by the Internet community in the "region" where the dispute is located. Using the "neighbor net" approach, we see that the trustees from Greece and Switzerland and the TLDs in between can come together to help resolve these types of disputes. One person can not do the job. http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/130dftmail/unir.txt 3:174 GR (GREECE) <-------------- Can these people help ? 3:175 SALT 3:176 PL (POLAND) <---------- Dispute 3:177 ROME 3:178 CANVAS 3:179 BEL (BELGIUM) 3:180 LIE (LIECHTENSTEIN) 3:181 FINE 3:182 TUR (TURKEY) 3:183 GEO (GEORGIA) 3:184 CH (SWITZERLAND) <--------- Can these people help ? As the picture above fills in, the dispute would be handled even more local to the .PL domain. In an ideal case we will have the 8 trustees for the .PL domain who can provide a forum to give people a fair hearing. Working out from the .PL domain, the trustees for the .SALT and .ROME domains would be called upon to help. Not the whole world. In summary, this is like a large auditorium. If someone has an illness in one of the "seats" the entire population does not have to rush to their rescue. In many cases, the people local to the situation can resolve the problem. Let's say the person faints. It might be a simple matter of reviving them. The answer is not to bring the whole world in and then to sue everyone. Think global and act local... Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Wed Sep 2 18:50:42 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CIX's Position in the IFWP Steering Committee detailed below
by JimFleming＠UNETY.NET 01 Sep '98

01 Sep '98

Dave, Thanks for the summary. To clarify, my main agenda is not IPv6 or IPv8. My main agenda is to help create more resources and to allow those resources to find their way into people's hands around the world with as low a distribution cost as possible to help allow more people to use the Internet without funding a bunch of lounge lizards to fly around the world every time they feel like it funded by taxes they collect from the disadvantaged people that they have under their thumbs....or IN-ADDR.ARPA. I was hopeful that the IETF (without the ISOC) would continue to be a good group to help encourage the low-cost distribution of resources. It now appears that the new IANA Inc. may be a better facilitator for that mission because the IETF has been captured by the ISOC "suits". Even though the IFWP people mean well, they have now attracted the IAHC CORE crowd that is mainly looking to cash in on some quick buck schemes. I am hopeful that Jon Postel saw enough of the IAHC result to know better than to go near the IFWP this time around. He has also been able to witness the "members only" approach used in ARIN and which the IFWP people seem to think provides a democracy. I am confident that Jon Postel and the various old-school IETF people will be able to push forward to move the IANA Inc. to a point where it is legally disjoint from the ISOC and the IETF. When that occurs, we might have a chance to all work to renew the faith and to bring more resources to people around the world at a low cost. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -----Original Message----- From: Dave Paulsen <dave at reststop.net> To: Multiple recipients of list <com-priv at lists.psi.com> Date: Monday, August 31, 1998 11:38 PM Subject: Re: CIX's Position in the IFWP Steering Committee detailed below >On 30 Aug 98,, Eric Weisberg wrote: > >> 2. Is Jim Flemming correct that this is not worth getting excited about? >> >Well, in some ways. His agenda, of course, is IPvX. Which, I also believe, is >more important in the grand scheme of things than the hoopla over TLDs. >Some of his concerns, however, are equally valid in both debates. > >Other TLDs are being successfully used--on a technical level. And, on a >technical level, the IP address space problem could be migrated more >smoothly into TNG if some of the "big boys" (and I use this term loosely here >(no, it's _mine_, you can't _make_ me give it back)) would aggregate/return >more of the current address space. > >Part of the problem in both debates is the concern over whose "deserving" >pockets the profits are going into, and especially on the in-addr.arpa side, >that profiteering not take place on the _necessary_ resource. I mean, a TLD >is just a string of characters, and with GUIs, no longer of much real use >outside of marketing. For Internet based communications to occur at all, >though, you _need_ an affordable, routable, IP address. > >I think for efficient, ubiquitous use of Internet technologies, both TLDs and >IPvX need to be based on open protocol standards, and centrally managed >(even with a regional second tier for day to day operations) to prevent >collisions and non-reachable sites. As far as I'm aware, the only way to have >this, at least on this particular planet, is either with a "benign" government >agency, or an international non-profit organization, ideally run by geeks. > >And I make that last little comment because _what_ people do on the >Internet is a social phenomena and the capitalists, politicians, and marketers >can do what they will to try to sleaze their way into the mindset of the user; >that people _can_ do what they will on the Internet is solidly in the domain of >the engineer and meddling merely decreases efficiency. > > >_dave_(seemingly obligatory and definitely resource wasting .sig) > -------- Logged at Wed Sep 2 08:52:13 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by veni＠isoc.bg 01 Sep '98

01 Sep '98

I don't get it. Why is such a concern about ccTLD, which are different from the two-letter country codes? If everything is OK in france and israel, the situation in bulgaria is pretty bad, and since Jon Postel wouldn't read all the mail, web sites, etc. about this problem, but say "there's no problem in the .bg TLDA", how are we supposed to solve it?? I mean, we (ISOC-Bulgaria) tried everything, and it wouldn't work. The current ccTLD system is rotten - at least in the .bg case. Ergo, we have to find an alternative. With all my respect for Israel and France, I remain sincerely, Veni Markovski, Chairmain, the Internet Society - Bulgaria, http://www.isoc.bg, http://www.bulgaria.com/isoc/, http://www.bol.bg/isoc/ phone: (+359-2) 9809666, phone/fax (+359-2) 9806431 mailing address: p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria -----Original Message----- From: Annie Renard <Annie.Renard at nic.fr> To: Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il> Cc: Jean-Christophe Praud <jc.praud at ludexpress.com>; Fay Howard <fay at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; 'Artur Grzymala' <artur at zoo.pl>; Veni Markovski <veni at isoc.bg>; Adam Todd <at at ah.net>; Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net>; renard at gaillac.inria.fr <renard at gaillac.inria.fr> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 11:43 AM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers > > In your previous mail you wrote: > > On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Jean-Christophe Praud wrote: > > If RIPE CENTR includes "alternate" cccTLDs in its charter, .il will have > to withdraw its support. > >idem for .fr > > Annie > -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 11:42:57 MET DST 1998 ---------

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[ifwp] Re: announcement from the Berkman Center
by JimFleming＠unety.net 30 Aug '98

30 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Chuck Gomes <cgomes at internic.net> To: IFWP Discussion List <list at ifwp.org> Date: Sunday, August 30, 1998 6:29 AM Subject: [ifwp] Re: announcement from the Berkman Center >What CRITICAL functions is the IANA currently performing? What would happen to >those functions if IANA did not perform them? > >There have been a lot of generalizations about IANA's critical role but I don't >think I have seen anyone SPECIFICALLY define that role. It seems to me that the >only reasonable way to clearly decide how critical that role really is is to look at >the functions one by one in an honest, unemotional way. In each case we should >answer these questions: who is actually performing the function? what impact would >there be if IANA was not involved? what would happen if IANA did not have any >funding come October 1st? would the stability of the Internet be affected in any >way? if so, how? > >This is not in anyway intended to denigrate any of the accomplishments that Jon may >have accomplished in the past, but rather to help us look honestly at the present. >If we are unwilling to do this, then it is absurd to create a new organization to >replace the existing functionality of the current IANA. > >Chuck Gomes > I AGREE 100.00% Not only should we document what critical functions the IANA provides, but also what critical functions that they DO NOT PROVIDE !!!! For the past few years, people with very little knowledge have been allowed to claim that the IANA performs some function, when in fact the IANA does not. Unfortunately, the small staff at the IANA and it's Director Jon Postel has not seen the need to dispute people's claims. On one hand people should be able to understand that it is not Jon's duty to run around the net reading every word spoken about the IANA and setting the record straight when the words are not true. On the other hand, when groups like the ISOC, IAHC, CORE, POC, PAB, EXCOM, etc. make claims such as, "The IANA will be adding TLDs to the legacy Root Name Servers", those claims should be disputed. Jon Postel was not forthcoming in making it clear what he could do and could not do. At the present time, we know a couple of things that the IANA is not able to do. 1. The IANA can not add new TLDs to the legacy Root Name Servers. 2. The IANA can not add entries to the IN-ADDR.ARPA zone except via ARIN where Jon Postel is a Board member. If people follow Chuck's advice, we should separate Jon Postel from the IANA. Just because Jon Postel may be able to do something does not mean the IANA can do the same thing. If and when Jon Postel helps the ITAG and/or a board create the so-called IANA Inc. in California the same approach should hold. People need to clearly look at that NEW corporation as a legal agent, distinct from the Jon Postel human agent, and make sure they clearly understand what each agent can and CAN NOT do. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Mon Aug 31 22:27:22 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by veni＠isoc.bg 30 Aug '98

30 Aug '98

Hank, there's only one little problem - until the people at IANA (or this committee) realise I am arguing on behalf of many people, ISPs, organizatoins; and this has nothing to do with competition... until then, they'll listen to the current .bg TLDA. And you know what? They just don't realise the situation in Bulgaria; this is what you call a "cross cultural difference". regards, Veni Markovski, Chairmain, the Internet Society - Bulgaria, http://www.isoc.bg, http://www.bulgaria.com/isoc/, http://www.bol.bg/isoc/ phone: (+359-2) 9809666, phone/fax (+359-2) 9806431 mailing address: p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria >If you feel the .bg ccTLD is not properly managed and that Jon is not >responsive enough, soon will be an IANA-ng organization and you will be >able to submit your request to a committee and it will be decided. >Patience. If you are correct in your statements - then I am sure a panel >of people will get to the truth. But alternate TLDs belong in their own >sphere. There are the current gTLDs and there are the ccTLDs. Create an >aTLD organization for alternate TLDs which can include alterNIC and >network luminaries like Jim Fleming, Bob Allisat, etc. -------- Logged at Sun Aug 30 15:27:55 MET DST 1998 ---------

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PL TLD (re: BG TLD)
by JimFleming＠unety.net 29 Aug '98

29 Aug '98

Artur, Can you explain what *specific* changes you would want to see to the root zone if any ? By specific I mean name servers, technical and administrative contact changes, etc. Keep in mind that most people can not keep up on all of the TLDs in the world. It helps to provide context and specific requests. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -----Original Message----- From: Artur Grzymala <artur at zoo.pl> To: Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il> Cc: Veni Markovski <veni at isoc.bg>; E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net>; Daniel Karrenberg <Daniel.Karrenberg at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> Date: Saturday, August 29, 1998 1:42 PM Subject: PL TLD (re: BG TLD) > > >On Sat, 29 Aug 1998, Hank Nussbacher wrote: > >> If you feel the .bg ccTLD is not properly managed and that Jon is not >> responsive enough, soon will be an IANA-ng organization and you will be >> able to submit your request to a committee and it will be decided. >> Patience. > >Sorry, but I'm very impatient. I've registered a domain two months ago. >It was a domain in regional subdomain of PL ccTLD. Two weeks after reg. >the .pl adm (NASK) send me such a letter: > >"If we will give regional domains to regions, we will do it with all >registered subdomains." > >It's obvious, what's the difference, where the delegation of my domain >will be hold. Last week they've done it, but the first move of new adm. >was deleting my delegations. Two days ago I was talking with president of >NASK and... > >P. of NASK - "It's your problem, it isn't our domain" >Me - "You have took money for this" >P. of NASK - "It is not our problem." > >How long I've got to wait for decision of court or IANA-ng (if...); >a year? > >Regards, >Artur > >ps. New administrator isn't answering my emails. > > -------- Logged at Mon Aug 31 10:54:56 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by veni＠isoc.bg 29 Aug '98

29 Aug '98

Well, I not only sent hundreds of e-mail, putting together all the emails, conversation and seminars held in Bulgaria about it, I've also asked and have received a positive answer to put this "Open letter" in the web - you can see it at many locations, including http://www.bol.bg/protest/ and http://www.isoc.bg, and http://www.kit.bg and many other. But I'll write you more later on today, when I can take a better look at your mails. It's been a busy week, and for the past 2 days I am having a flu and about 38 degrees C. have a good weekend, yours as usual sincerely, veni -----Original Message----- From: Daniel Karrenberg <Daniel.Karrenberg at ripe.net> To: E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net> Cc: veni at isoc.bg <veni at isoc.bg>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> Date: 28 aWGUST 1998 G. 12:49 Subject: Re: BG TLD > >Edgar, > >*very* well said. This has ben pointed out to Veni numerous times in >private correspondence. > >Daniel > > > E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net> writes: > > > > ... file wrongful > > conduct action against BG NIC in your country and make Internet > > community in Bulgaria aware of the situation: if your rights, or rights > > of public are not honored, it is your and public's responsibility to > > defend and enforce them. Internet isn't a monarchy and Dr. Postel > > isn't a king. > -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 14:31:55 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by JimFleming＠unety.net 29 Aug '98

29 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Randy Bush <randy at psg.com> To: Adam Todd <at at ah.net> Cc: centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 8:33 PM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers >> OK, Randy, I have some bad news for an irrelevant fantasy there are a lot >> of people dreaming ... and it grows - every day. > >cool. then use your other email address on all internet subscriptions and >mail. > I wonder when the day will come that people suggest that people use a native-mode IPv6 system to only communicate with other people using such systems. People could leave the entire IPv4 internet for the vultures to pick apart. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Sat Aug 29 10:48:04 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by veni＠isoc.bg 29 Aug '98

29 Aug '98

>No Randy they didn't try to get outsiders to rectify the problem. They >went to IANA to have the problem solved in accordance with the protocol. and if IANA has answered us AFTER reviewing the whole case, there wouldn't have been a problem. After all we DIDN'T want to change the current TLDA! We just want them to follow rules which are created by another organization, and not an ISP, what's the case today. It is not possible to have an ISP as an independent TLDA, esp. when the .bg TLDA is breaking even IANA & RIPE own rules! rgrds, Veni Markovski, Chairmain, the Internet Society - Bulgaria, http://www.isoc.bg, http://www.bulgaria.com/isoc/, http://www.bol.bg/isoc/ phone: (+359-2) 9809666, phone/fax (+359-2) 9806431 mailing address: p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria -------- Logged at Sat Aug 29 10:44:52 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by veni＠isoc.bg 29 Aug '98

29 Aug '98

OK, Here are some messages that have been sent to some people & organizations, Daniel Karrenberg included: (number 2 and 4 are pretty interesting:-) I think I've done what's needed - organized group of people (rather, they came to me, but it's another story...), have them on the web, have Digsys at the Fair Trade Comission, etc, etc. However, it seems the wisest will be to advise the Government to take control over it - at least we can have control to some extent over the government via the parlament. ====== 1: >---------- Forwarded message ---------- >Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 17:13:37 +0200 (GMT+0200) >From: Veni Markovski <veni at mail.bol.bg> >To: Daniel Karrenberg <Daniel.Karrenberg at ripe.net> >Cc: Niall.oReilly at ucd.ie, burack at isoc.org, iana at iana.org, vcerf at mci.net, > Don Heath <heath at isoc.org>, Jon Postel <postel at isi.edu> >Subject: Re: RIPE meeting and the situation in Bulgarian TLDA > >On Thu, 19 Mar 1998, Daniel Karrenberg wrote: > >> [cut] >Dear collegues, >I understand your position "If something is working, don't touch it", but >after all, and I am not going to get tired repeating it, our point is >that the current TLDA may keep on being a TLDA, but the rules after which >they conduct their behaviour should be created not by the TLDA himself, >but from an NGO. >You can read more about this idea at >http://www.ibm.com/othervoices/levine/february1398155624.phtml > >There is nothing wrong in our request. >There is something wrong in the fact that this simple request is being >turned down by the hostmaster, by IANA, and by RIPE. > >The Internet should not be a tool for unfair competition. >The Internet in Bulgaria will definitely NOT become a place where one >organization (the hostmaster) can dictate the conditions for using the >net to the rest of the Internauts. If you don't want to, can not, or are >not willing to help us in our appeal for creating publicly accepted >rules, then perhaps we'll have to search for another way. > >However, I think that you could still read at >http://www.bol.bg/protest/protest_e.htm >that a huge amount of serious players in Bulgaria are against this >discriminating policy. > >Losing hope, >regards, >veni > > ==== 2: the next one is very interesting, as .bg TLDA respondedn to Vint, but never have sent me a contract. -----Original Message----- From: vinton g. cerf <vcerf at MCI.NET> To: veni markovski <veni at isoc.bg> Date: Monday, April 20, 1998 2:22 PM Subject: Re: contract for paying the domain names Digsys responded and said they would be pleased to execute a contract with you. They claim that charging is well within reason and the law. ====== 3: -----Original Message----- From: veni markovski <veni at isoc.bg> To: vinton g. cerf <vcerf at MCI.NET> Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 2:17 PM Subject: Re: contract for paying the domain names >Oh, >let's put it briefly: >the local TLDA is an ISP. They started from back date to charge for domain >names ($ 50 start up fee, $ 50 / yearly fee). They introduced this price in >mid January, but said it's since January 1st. The protest of some of the >Internauts is listed in many web sites in the country. I'm attaching it to >this message. >As a lawyer, and as a normal citizen, I don't think what DigSys (the local >TLDA) did was correct. On the contrary: >- it's against the laws (FTC is already informed and taking actions against >them), >- it's not bringing consensus in the internet community in Bulgaria; >- it's not fair, if you want, for an ISP to take money for fulfilling their >"public service" > >We proposed the organization of an NGO to handle the TLDAdministration, >which will issue to an ISP the right to keep the name server(s). I wrote to >IANA directly after a message from them, that they would not respond to a >CC: message (why not?), but since January 15th there's no answer! No answer >from IANA, from RIPE, from Digsys, from ISOC... > >Why do I waste time? Well, since for one year I'm a practising judge, >prosecutor, investigator, (that's part of my law education), I have time. > >I'll make sure no one in Bulgaria will ever have this right to decide what >the Internauts should do. I am also involved in the development of the new >law on Information, and have opposed directly the intentions of the >government to control the information provided in the web space in Bulgaria. >If nothing works out, and we all let them (digsys, the government) censure >the content on the Internet, then perhaps I am in the wrong country or in >the wrong time. But my sense of honesty and fairness is suffering when I can >not do anything to help the internauts... > >Anyway, I know the last way would be to go in court, and I think I can do >that to protect a broken right. > >yours, >veni ====== This one is also pretty interesting. It seems Mr. Postel hasn't read http://www.bol.bg/protest/ 4: -----Original Message----- From: postel at ISI.EDU <postel at ISI.EDU> To: veni at isoc.bg <veni at isoc.bg> Cc: daniel at dcave.digsys.bg <daniel at dcave.digsys.bg>; postel at ISI.EDU <postel at ISI.EDU>; iana at ISI.EDU <iana at ISI.EDU>; isoc-eu at imag.fr <isoc-eu at imag.fr>; Bruno.Oudet at imag.fr <Bruno.Oudet at imag.fr>; vcerf at MCI.NET <vcerf at MCI.NET>; ISOC-TRUSTEES at listserv.isoc.org <ISOC-TRUSTEES at listserv.isoc.org> Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 12:28 AM Subject: Bulgarian situation > >Veni Markovski: > >The IANA certainly agrees that the selection of a management authority >for a country code TLD should be based on the consensus of all >interested parties in the country. This is often hard to accomplish. > >However, complaints from one person do not demonstrate that a consensus >does not exist, or that the current management needs to be replaced. > >We have received your many messages complaining about the managemnent >of the .BG ccTLD. > >We have reviewed these matters several times with the current manager >of the .BG domain and found the responses to be quite reasonable. > >--jon. > -----Original Message----- From: Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net> To: E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net>; veni at isoc.bg <veni at isoc.bg> Cc: centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; rsctalk at ah.net <rsctalk at ah.net> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 2:11 PM Subject: Re: BG TLD > >-----Original Message----- >From: E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net> >To: veni at isoc.bg <veni at isoc.bg> >Cc: centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> >Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 4:43 AM >Subject: Re: BG TLD > > >> >> >>Dear Veni: >> >>> I mean, we (ISOC-Bulgaria) tried everything, and it wouldn't work. The >>> current ccTLD system is rotten - at least in the .bg case. Ergo, we have >to >>> find an alternative. >> >>With all respect for you, Veni, you do not have to find an alternative - >>you have to defend your viewpoint. I'd advise you to forward all >correspondence >>between you and Dr. Postel to this list for public consideration; >afterwards, >>if you believe you're right, file wrongful conduct action against BG NIC in >>your country and make Internet community in Bulgaria aware of the >situation: >>if your rights, or rights of public are not honored, it is your and >public's >>responsibility to defend and enforce them. Internet isn't a monarchy and >>Dr. Postel isn't a king. >> >>Yours >>Edgar >>AM NIC >> >> > >I agree and would further suggest that >this be handled in the G3 region as much >as possible with the help of the "neighbor net" >community for the .BG TLD. In a growing >Internet, Jon Postel or a small IANA staff >will not be able to sort out all of the local >issues. People in the "region" can help >with that. That is one of the merits of >socializing these discussions. > >Does anyone have the current "neighbor net" >for the .BG TLD which I assume is in G3 ? > > >Jim Fleming >Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com > > > -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 18:00:26 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Randy Bush <randy at psg.com> To: Jean-Christophe Praud <jc.praud at ludexpress.com> Cc: veni markovski <veni at isoc.bg>; Annie Renard <Annie.Renard at nic.fr>; Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il>; Fay Howard <fay at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; 'Artur Grzymala' <artur at zoo.pl>; Adam Todd <at at ah.net>; Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net>; renard at gaillac.inria.fr <renard at gaillac.inria.fr> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 12:23 PM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers >>>> I don't get it. Why is such a concern about ccTLD, which are different from >>>> the two-letter country codes? >>> because they are an irrelevant fantasy. >> Mmm. Like democracy during absolute monarchy era :o) > >please read rfcs 1033-1035, 2181, etc and notice that it is a hierarchy. > >demagoguery about abstract political theory absent real technical and/or >operational substance is irrelevant fantasy. > That is why eventually people have to come to a complete understanding of who owns and operates the various Root Name Servers Clusters (RSCs) and who owns and operates the various TLD Name Servers, registries and registrars. At the heart of most of this are simple text files. In the end, someone has to be able to edit those files....those are part of the "operational substance". For many people they could start there and skip all of the rest of the fantasies. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Sat Aug 29 10:46:08 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by veni＠isoc.bg 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

It seems I've read the rfc1591 most recently: This means that the same rules are applied to all requests, all requests must be processed in a non-discriminatory fashion, and academic and commercial (and other) users are treated on an equal basis. No bias shall be shown regarding requests that may come from customers of some other business related to the manager -- e.g., no preferential service for customers of a particular data network provider. There can be no requirement that a particular mail system (or other application), protocol, or product be used. and more: Significantly interested parties in the domain should agree that the designated manager is the appropriate party. The IANA tries to have any contending parties reach agreement among themselves, and generally takes no action to change things unless all the contending parties agree; only in cases where the designated manager has substantially mis-behaved would the IANA step in. However, it is also appropriate for interested parties to have some voice in selecting the designated manager. There are two cases where the IANA and the central IR may establish a new top-level domain and delegate only a portion of it: (1) there are contending parties that cannot agree, or (2) the applying party may not be able to represent or serve the whole country. The later case sometimes arises when a party outside a country is trying to be helpful in getting networking started in a country -- this is sometimes called a "proxy" DNS service. === Would you like to comment on that?? It's so obvious, yet you're trying to tell me we are wrong?? === and here's ripe: As for "special case" registries as defined above, it is recommended that where such a registry charges for service, it should, in addition to complying with the recommendations listed above: relate charges to costs of operation and apply all revenues to such costs; regularly publish a budget of its anticipated operating costs and revenue; publish guidelines and apply these uniformly; ensure equality of access to registration services; aim to achieve consensus within the community it serves as to the disposal of any surplus revenues; regularly publish accounts of income and expenditure ; refrain from using their unique position as leverage in any other business venture. I don't really want to comment on that - read it, then visit http://www.bol.bg/protest/ It's not me alone; the .bg TLDA is using their (his, rather) position to gain business from competitors (example was given at the InnternetExpo '98 in Sofia by www.onlin.bg about a customer of theirs which domain name was not registered in time, because they didn't want the .bg TLDA to be their provider), etc., etc., etc., etc....) Veni Markovski, Chairmain, the Internet Society - Bulgaria, http://www.isoc.bg, http://www.bulgaria.com/isoc/, http://www.bol.bg/isoc/ phone: (+359-2) 9809666, phone/fax (+359-2) 9806431 mailing address: p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 19:23:36 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Randy Bush <randy at psg.com> To: veni markovski <veni at isoc.bg> Cc: Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net>; E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; rsctalk at ah.net <rsctalk at ah.net>; bgr at isoc.bg <bgr at isoc.bg> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 11:25 AM Subject: Re: BG TLD >you want outsiders to 'solve' your internal problem. most countries tend to >object to that. postel's repeated policy, as stated in rfc 1591 is that you >need to resolve your internal problems locally. coming from a country which >has so often been accused of interfering in others' business, i find your >expections rather unexpected. > I think we have all learned that TLDs are domains and not countries. People from one domain can help people from other domains. The Internet is international and crosses geographic boundaries. The boundaries between domains are more distinct. I see several people here from the .NET domain and some from .COM. Some day we will have more diversity in domains and opinions. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Sat Aug 29 10:45:31 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Randy Bush <randy at psg.com> To: veni markovski <veni at isoc.bg> Cc: Annie Renard <Annie.Renard at nic.fr>; Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il>; Jean-Christophe Praud <jc.praud at ludexpress.com>; Fay Howard <fay at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; 'Artur Grzymala' <artur at zoo.pl>; Adam Todd <at at ah.net>; Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net>; renard at gaillac.inria.fr <renard at gaillac.inria.fr> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 11:00 AM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers >> I don't get it. Why is such a concern about ccTLD, which are different from >> the two-letter country codes? > >because they are an irrelevant fantasy. > >randy > It would be interesting to dig up the numerous postings by people that claimed the IANA was in control of the legacy Root Name Servers. Some have now learned that this was apparently a fantasy. At some point we all have to separate fact from fantasy. We do not seem to be moving in that direction here. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Sat Aug 29 10:46:49 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by veni＠isoc.bg 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

>I agree and would further suggest that >this be handled in the G3 region as much >as possible with the help of the "neighbor net" >community for the .BG TLD. In a growing >Internet, Jon Postel or a small IANA staff >will not be able to sort out all of the local >issues. People in the "region" can help >with that. That is one of the merits of >socializing these discussions. Well, I believe now that Jon Postel, as well as the current TLDAs have reached an agreement to keep the status quo as long as possible. Just read his mail to me, and then visit the web http://www.bol.bg/protest/ and chosse the English version. It's obvious that: a) he hasn't read them but replied to protect the current .bg TLDA. b) he has read them, but ignored it, to protect the current .bg TLDA. tell me which is the similarity:-) regards, Veni Markovski, Chairmain, the Internet Society - Bulgaria, http://www.isoc.bg, http://www.bulgaria.com/isoc/, http://www.bol.bg/isoc/ phone: (+359-2) 9809666, phone/fax (+359-2) 9806431 mailing address: p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:43:07 MET DST 1998 ---------

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replace .tw with .rc
by BERI＠etf.bg.ac.yu 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

>> could any alternate root server help us to do this? >> ... >> An entry in ISO 3166 like >> China, Republic of RC ROC 158 >> would be right and better. Using an alternate root server, you can do whatever you want, except: (1) You won't change the root zone maintained by the IANA. (2) You cannot change the ISO 3166 table (at all!). To solve (1), you'll have to contact IANA, but they strictly follow the ISO 3166 table. So, you must solve (2) first and that requires an official contact with the ISO 3166 authority from your government. As far as I heard, the authority which has to be contacted is located at DIN offices in Berlin. After your government gets a positive ack from Berlin, you must ask IANA what to do further. Hope this helps. ;-) Regards, Beri .-------. | --+-- | Berislav Todorovic, B.Sc.E.E. | E-mail: BERI at etf.bg.ac.yu | /|\ Hostmaster of the YU TLD | |-(-+-)-| School of Electrical Engineering | Phone: (+381-11) 3221-419 | \|/ Bulevar Revolucije 73 | 3370-106 | --+-- | 11000 Belgrade SERBIA, YUGOSLAVIA | Fax: (+381-11) 3248-681 `-------' -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:38:18 MET DST 1998 ---------

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replace .tw with .rc
by wchao＠post.uni-bielefeld.de 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

Hallo, could any alternate root server help us to do this? The official name of Taiwan is "Republic of China"(ROC), not a province of People's Republic of China(PRC), but in the ISO 3166 Taiwan TW TWN 158 They use the data from the UN, which the RC is not a member of. You could visit http://www.gio.gov.tw/ to see the opinion of the goverment. An entry in ISO 3166 like China, Republic of RC ROC 158 would be right and better. How can I change that? Yours sincerely, Wei-Lun Chao -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 15:36:52 MET DST 1998 ---------

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BG TLD
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: E D Danielyan <edd at aic.net> To: veni at isoc.bg <veni at isoc.bg> Cc: centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 4:43 AM Subject: Re: BG TLD > > >Dear Veni: > >> I mean, we (ISOC-Bulgaria) tried everything, and it wouldn't work. The >> current ccTLD system is rotten - at least in the .bg case. Ergo, we have to >> find an alternative. > >With all respect for you, Veni, you do not have to find an alternative - >you have to defend your viewpoint. I'd advise you to forward all correspondence >between you and Dr. Postel to this list for public consideration; afterwards, >if you believe you're right, file wrongful conduct action against BG NIC in >your country and make Internet community in Bulgaria aware of the situation: >if your rights, or rights of public are not honored, it is your and public's >responsibility to defend and enforce them. Internet isn't a monarchy and >Dr. Postel isn't a king. > >Yours >Edgar >AM NIC > > I agree and would further suggest that this be handled in the G3 region as much as possible with the help of the "neighbor net" community for the .BG TLD. In a growing Internet, Jon Postel or a small IANA staff will not be able to sort out all of the local issues. People in the "region" can help with that. That is one of the merits of socializing these discussions. Does anyone have the current "neighbor net" for the .BG TLD which I assume is in G3 ? Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:22:45 MET DST 1998 ---------

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.FR
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Annie Renard <Annie.Renard at nic.fr> To: Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il> Cc: Jean-Christophe Praud <jc.praud at ludexpress.com>; Fay Howard <fay at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; 'Artur Grzymala' <artur at zoo.pl>; Veni Markovski <veni at isoc.bg>; Adam Todd <at at ah.net>; Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net>; renard at gaillac.inria.fr <renard at gaillac.inria.fr> Date: Friday, August 28, 1998 3:42 AM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers > > In your previous mail you wrote: > > On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Jean-Christophe Praud wrote: > > If RIPE CENTR includes "alternate" cccTLDs in its charter, .il will have > to withdraw its support. > >idem for .fr > > Annie > Can you provide the contacts in the French government that endorse that position ? Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:22:00 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by fay＠ripe.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

Dear ccTLD Managers, As previously announced, a CENTR workshop is to be held for managers of TLD registries in Edinburgh 21 September 1998. The meeting is schedule between 10.00 and 17.00 and will take place at The University of Edinburgh, George Square Complex, William Robertson Building, Edinburgh, Scotland. As with the technical workshop, the aim of the managerial workshop will be to encourage discussion and exchange of experiences. Discussion leaders for each topic will give presentations and then open the debate to all participants. Four proposed topics are listed below. If you manage a ccTLD and wish to attend, please reply completing the template at the end of this email. Places are restricted to 26 and so initially we must limit participation to one person per TLD. Preference will be given to CENTR participants should applications exceed 26. Developing local TLD policy and naming rules: Many ccTLD are at some stage in the process of restructuring their registry and/or reviewing their current naming policy example being: - Creation of a new organization to replace work done on a voluntary basis by a university or academic network. - Introduction of charges for registering domain names or review of existing charging model. - Review of naming policy and naming restriction (liberal stance of first-come-first-served versus strict naming policy) - Government requirement Whatever changes are envisaged, it is often necessary to consult with the local networking community/service providers and even the general internet using public within the country. The participants will see examples of how this process has been handled in some countries followed by open discussion on how to manage consultation and to "sell" the changes to the public. Possible areas of harmonization for ccTLDs There are many organizations keen to document the practices of TLD registries around the world and the CENTR project has been collecting information on the participating ccTLDs. There is often talk of 'best practice' and even standardization of ccTLD rules and policies. With one of the key requirements of ccTLDs being autonomy and with the diversity of economies, legal systems and cultures, is there any room for harmonization? This session will examine information gathered in accordance with the CENTR template and also discuss areas where some level of harmonization may be achieved. Example might be who-is database policy, quality, pricing structure. Pooling Resources and Joint Funding One of the roles of the established CENTR should be to coordinate or commission projects on behalf of members. Pooling of resources or sharing the cost of software developments for example would be a significant benefit of CENTR membership. This item relates also to discussion at the technical workshop at which there was general agreement that the development of BIND Software is very important and should be supported by ccTLDs. A short presentation will be given by David Conrad of Internet Software Consortium on how CENTR members, as funders, could have input into the direction that new BIND developments take. Discussion will then be opened to identify other areas where CENTR can initiate work or coordinate the pooling of ideas/manpower on behalf of its members. Who-is Policy There has already been some debate on the issue of acceptable use of who-is database information. The session will begin with a presentation on the problems of confidentiality, misuse and possible solutions. There will also be a presentation on possible legitimate and acceptable use of who-is data before the debate is opened up to the participants. ************************** REGISTRATION FOR CENTR WORKSHOP I wish to attend the CENTR workshop for Managers of TLD Rgistries Name: Organization and country: Position held: Any other Comments: ************************* -------- Logged at Thu Aug 27 23:57:27 MET DST 1998 ---------

7 6

CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by veni＠isoc.bg 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

Very interesting. Why not allow cccTLDs to this meeting? The situation in Bulgaria shows very clearly that cccTLD is a _must_ if we want free and democratic Internet. Else, we'll continiue registering domain names in the .com, .net domains, as they are more than 2 times cheaper than in Bulgaria, and their computers are faster than the "hostmaster team" at .bg TLDA, which "team" consists only of one person. >On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Jean-Christophe Praud wrote: > >If RIPE CENTR includes "alternate" cccTLDs in its charter, .il will have >to withdraw its support. > >-Hank -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 11:18:45 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by at＠AH.NET 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

At 07:39 28/08/98 +0300, Hank Nussbacher wrote: >On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Jean-Christophe Praud wrote: > >If RIPE CENTR includes "alternate" cccTLDs in its charter, .il will have >to withdraw its support. Hank, I would like to explore with you the reasons behind your statement. Please feel free to discuss this with me in private. It would be appreciated. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Adam Todd http://adamtodd.ah.net Business Development, Technology, Domain Registration and Network Advisory Phone +61 2 9729 0565 - Todd Corporation http://www.todd.inoz.com Fax +61 2 4659 6786 - AHNET http://www.ah.net - AURSC http://www.aursc.ah.net Telstra Reseller and Telstra Convey Member (Not an Employee of Telstra) Get the DOMAIN NAME HANDBOOK NOW http://www.domainhandbook.com -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:18:14 MET DST 1998 ---------

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CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Aug '98

28 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: Hank Nussbacher <hank at ibm.net.il> To: Jean-Christophe Praud <jc.praud at ludexpress.com> Cc: Fay Howard <fay at ripe.net>; centr at ripe.net <centr at ripe.net>; centr-info at ripe.net <centr-info at ripe.net>; tld-wg at ripe.net <tld-wg at ripe.net>; 'Artur Grzymala' <artur at zoo.pl>; Veni Markovski <veni at isoc.bg>; Adam Todd <at at ah.net>; Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net> Date: Thursday, August 27, 1998 11:40 PM Subject: Re: CENTR workshop for ccTLD Managers >On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Jean-Christophe Praud wrote: > >If RIPE CENTR includes "alternate" cccTLDs in its charter, .il will have >to withdraw its support. > Out of curiosity, how do you classify TLDs as "alternate" ? Also, who in the government in Israel helps to set these policies ? Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Fri Aug 28 17:19:10 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Abuse of ccTLD powers
by veni＠isoc.bg 03 Aug '98

03 Aug '98

Jim, please forward to the appropriate lists, as I'm not subscribed to most of them) More than 6 months ago, when I was telling each and everyone of you about the problems with the .bg TLDA (see details at http://www.bol.bg/protest/ - English version is also available), Mr. Postel answered me that there's no conflict of interests, since I am the only one to have written him?! The Bulgarian TLDA is behaving in total disaccordance with the current RIPE, IANA and Bulgarian Laws; they are combining at the same time ISP and a public service. They've decided to introduce a tax for registering new domain ($ 50), plus a yearly tax ($ 50); that's more than twice as high as in the US, yet in Bulgaria average monthly payment is $ 100! This brings them about $ 20-30 thousand per year - money that could be used for the good of all the Internet in Bulgaria, and not only for the profit of one private company which is misusing it's monopolist situation Noone from abroad except for 8 European ISOC (http://www.isoc.bg/disc_e.htm) representatives supported us in our protest. Mr. Postel is obviously and unonditionally taking side of the current TLDA in Bulgaria, eventhough they've shown their disrespect towards the Internet community in the country. He could have at least asked for more details from the Internet Society - Bulgaria, and from other interested parties to learn the trutn. regards, Veni Markovski, Chairman, the Internet Society - Bulgaria p.o.box 71, Sofia 1164, Bulgaria phone +359-2-9809666, phone/fax: () 9806431 p.s. off topic. I had a domain veni.bg, which was stopped, eventhough I've paid in advance some money, and have specifically expressed my interest in keeping my domain but in return for my money I wanted a contract from the .bg TLDA. The contract was never received, but the domain was stopped. Now I had to register veni.com to be able to have private correspondence. >-----Original Message----- >From: mueller <mueller at syr.edu> >To: apple at apnic.net <apple at apnic.net>; anr-talk at anr.org <anr-talk at anr.org> >Date: Sunday, August 02, 1998 11:34 AM >Subject: Abuse of ccTLD powers > > >>Apple members: >>If you read the following news article, you will see how control of a >>ccTLD can be abused for economic reasons. This is why many of us coming >>out of Geneva are concerned about the efforts of ccTLD registrars to >>organize themselves as a political bloc. I hope any apple member who is >>interested in maintaining a free and open Internet will attend the >>Singapore meeting with this in mind. I also hope that the Asia Pacific >>Internet Association members who are part of the IFWP steering committee >>will make it clear that they oppose such absuses, otherwise they may >>begin to lose the trust of the international community. >>--MM >> >>http://www.sjmercury.com/asia/center/japan080198.htm >> >>* APPLe: To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe" to apple-request at apnic.net * >> > >Milton, > >This is not the only ccTLD with such practices. >Jon Postel's IANA has allowed people to obtain >top level domains and claim they have the >support of the government. When challenged, >they claim they have the support of the people. >When really challenged, they claim to have the >support of ISPs. In some cases, they are that >ISP. In other words, they endorse themselves. > >This is one of the reasons why experts in this >area have concluded that TLDs should be TLDs >because there is no way to clean up the existing >mess and little benefit in doing it. The general >public needs to be better educated about the >fraud and corruption in ccTLDs. In some areas >of the world, this is done and their solution is >to send everyone to .COM. That is one of the >reasons why it is so crowded. > > >Jim Fleming >Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Thu Aug 27 18:22:08 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Abuse of ccTLD powers
by JimFleming＠unety.net 02 Aug '98

02 Aug '98

-----Original Message----- From: mueller <mueller at syr.edu> To: apple at apnic.net <apple at apnic.net>; anr-talk at anr.org <anr-talk at anr.org> Date: Sunday, August 02, 1998 11:34 AM Subject: Abuse of ccTLD powers >Apple members: >If you read the following news article, you will see how control of a >ccTLD can be abused for economic reasons. This is why many of us coming >out of Geneva are concerned about the efforts of ccTLD registrars to >organize themselves as a political bloc. I hope any apple member who is >interested in maintaining a free and open Internet will attend the >Singapore meeting with this in mind. I also hope that the Asia Pacific >Internet Association members who are part of the IFWP steering committee >will make it clear that they oppose such absuses, otherwise they may >begin to lose the trust of the international community. >--MM > >http://www.sjmercury.com/asia/center/japan080198.htm > >* APPLe: To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe" to apple-request at apnic.net * > Milton, This is not the only ccTLD with such practices. Jon Postel's IANA has allowed people to obtain top level domains and claim they have the support of the government. When challenged, they claim they have the support of the people. When really challenged, they claim to have the support of ISPs. In some cases, they are that ISP. In other words, they endorse themselves. This is one of the reasons why experts in this area have concluded that TLDs should be TLDs because there is no way to clean up the existing mess and little benefit in doing it. The general public needs to be better educated about the fraud and corruption in ccTLDs. In some areas of the world, this is done and their solution is to send everyone to .COM. That is one of the reasons why it is so crowded. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Mon Aug 3 10:44:10 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Fw: Working Together in 15 Groups
by JimFleming＠unety.net 28 Jul '98

28 Jul '98

-----Original Message----- From: Jim Fleming <JimFleming at unety.net> To: IFWP ORG <ifwp at ifwp.org> Cc: discussion-draft at giaw.org <discussion-draft at giaw.org>; DOMAIN-POLICY at LISTS.INTERNIC.NET <DOMAIN-POLICY at LISTS.INTERNIC.NET> Date: Monday, July 27, 1998 7:23 PM Subject: Working Together in 15 Groups > >As an example of a way to "seed" the 15 Board Seats, >the following list was produced from a recent copy of the >iana-announce mailing list. The UNIX "jot" command was >used to generate random numbers from 0 to 14 over and >over and those were placed in front of the people's names >and then the final list was sorted. These people could be >viewed as "sitting" in 15 virtual auditoriums. Becky Burr >would be sitting next to Sarah Deutsch and ngreenfi at arelaw.com. >People would first get to know each other and then as a >group would start working to appoint a spokesperson as >a board member. They might do this by first creating 15 >mailing lists or some groups might convince each other >to use one of the existing lists. Fred Baker might suggest >the IETF list in Group 0 and Richard Sexton might suggest >ORSC. As a group they would decide. Maybe they would >create the IFWP0 list. Once set in motion, the 1022 people >below could move from list to list. By starting with something >and 15 auditoriums you know you will eventually have >15 spokespeople. Those 15 people would decide on the >IANA matters brought before them. If a person stepped >down the group would appoint someone new. With a Java >animatiom, you could "watch" the whole thing in action. > > > >>0 <BBurr at ntia.doc.gov> Becky Burr >>0 <BC0VG0H at LEGAL.BELL-ATL.COM> Sarah Deutsch >>0 <J.Crowcroft at cs.ucl.ac.uk> Jon Crowcroft >>0 <SawyerCurt at bah.com> Curtis Sawyer >>0 <agonzalez at empresas-galicia.com> Angelo Gonzalez >>0 <andyl at shore.net> Charles James >>0 <charles.perkins at sun.com> Charles Perkins >>0 <computer_consultant at email.msn.com> Caroline E Horton >>0 <dbednarski at geocities.com> Daniel F. Bednarski >>0 <doug42 at ix.netcom.com> Doug Anderson >>0 <dwood at halldickler.com> Doug Wood >>0 <emma at zereau.com> Emma Stromberg >>0 <estelas at caramail.com> Santos Estela >>0 <fred at cisco.com> Fred Baker >>0 <gab at undp.org> Gabriel Accascina >>0 <john at burkeis.com> John Burke >>0 <lawrencen at mauimail.com> Lawrence >>0 <lesage at altern.org> Veronique LeSage >>0 <lhl at cs.wisc.edu> Lawrence Landweber >>0 <megatrend at adam.es> Megatrend >>0 <mexicoweb at usa.net> Ramiro Portillo >>0 <peter at ains.at> DI Peter Burgstaller >>0 <raes at swbell.net> Rae Latham/McCaine >>0 <richard at sexton.com> Richard J. Sexton >>0 <yeungjoseph at hotmail.com> Joseph Yeung >>0 ZILLMANUSA at delphi.com >>0 charlene at ns1.steelelink.com >>0 daniel at digsys.bg >>0 dev at dm2.deskmedia.com >>0 g.kessler at hill.com >>0 jason at pathwaynet.com >>0 kjoy at staff.office.interlog.com >>0 lino at rccn.net >>0 mau at beatles.cselt.it >>0 mcfadden at 21st-century-texts.com >>0 mk at kpn.com >>0 mnemonic at well.com >>0 ngreenfi at arelaw.com >>1 <0002131750 at MCIMail.Com> T Swinehart >>1 <Akkirra at aol.com> Edwin Jeffcoat >>1 <Daniel.Karrenberg at ripe.net> Daniel Karrenberg >>1 <Jackovy at aol.com> Jack Overton >>1 <JimFleming at doorstep.unety.net> Jim Fleming >>1 <LawrncGolf at aol.com> Lawrence Heraty >>1 <Rarog at mail.dec.com> Robert Rarog >>1 <andy at salemctr.com> Andrew Lutts >>1 <bbaskin at iname.com> R Baskin >>1 <brad at indeliblelink.com> Brad Price >>1 <brucek at linktrader.com> Bruce Kaduk >>1 <cantrellj at mail.dnb.com> J Cantrell >>1 <david.johnson at Counsel.COM> David Johnson >>1 <deanna at secretshopnet.com> Deanna Oxtoby >>1 <dekoningk at mailexcite.com> Karen DeKoning >>1 <desmoins at caramail.com> Desmoins jan >>1 <dirops at worldnetla.net> C. Robert Rose >>1 <eric at macweb.com> >>1 <gkowack at well.com> Glenn Kowack >>1 <gumby_gumby at mailcity.com> Gumby >>1 <haywood.torrance at bellatlantic.com> Woody Torrance >>1 <hostmaster at webcafe.net> Camilo Pereira >>1 <ivan at netnames.com> Ivan Pope >>1 <jon at adr.weare.nh.us> Jonathan Wallace >>1 <kammerer at epix.net> John Kammer >>1 <kawchuk at idirect.com> Ron Kawchuk >>1 <leni at moniker.net> Leni Mayo >>1 <marick at bluedot.com> Michael Arick >>1 <matt at zedat.fu-berlin.de> Matthias Tschakert >>1 <michaellibby at hotmail.com> Michael Libby >>1 <pacer at escape.com> Mark Feingold >>1 <phil at charon.milepost.com> Phil Howard >>1 <rh120 at columbia.edu> Ronda Hauben >>1 <robcray at altern.org> Robert Cray >>1 <samsonso at hotmail.com> Samson So >>1 <saunders at earthdome.com> HENRY SAUNDERS >>1 <shaund at secretshopnet.com> Shaun Doolan >>1 <tinwee at pobox.org.sg> >>1 <tonyhain at microsoft.com> Tomy Hain >>1 <williamr at postmaster.co.uk> William Robinson >>1 <windows at domainbank.net> Steve Heflin >>1 <wright at nstar.net> B. Wright >>1 Alf.Hansen at uninett.no >>1 Editor at Opiniao.com >>1 John.Hine at MCS.VUW.AC.NZ >>1 brett at world.std.com >>1 cebriggs at aitcom.net >>1 dhares at autonet.net >>1 edb at interport.net >>1 estaicut at linkguide.ici.ro >>1 eva at nic-se.se >>1 geoff at nominet.org.uk >>1 hhochheiser at cpsr.org >>1 hlubsen at altronics.com >>1 jan at dtn.net >>1 jromary at ns-1.csn.net >>1 kalhosni at gto.net.om >>1 lists at spirale.demon.nl >>1 martyn at mars.dti.ne.jp >>1 mcfadden at cix.org >>1 mpawlo at algonet.se >>1 mschwimmer at FROSSZELNICK.COM >>1 pckizer at tamu.edu >>1 perwork at mx2.redestb.es >>1 pitcairn at iconz.co.nz >>1 rms46 at geocities.com >>1 sandra.schickele at sonoma.edu >>1 stevep-hv at virtation.com >>1 vadillo at rcp.net.pe >>1 will at activ-consult.de >>1 ynusseir at philadelphia.nic.gov.jo >>10 <BSautter at aol.com> William T. Sautter >>10 <Clmoore7 at aol.com> CL Moore 7 >>10 <Cowgir107 at aol.com> Sara R. Smith >>10 <ERoberts at dca.gov.au> Erica Roberts >>10 <FLOR235 at LNI.WA.GOV> Bridget J. Flory >>10 <FRANK.ERZ at lhsystems.com> Frank Erz >>10 <Hamlet1929 at aol.com> >>10 <Mccledon at Gateway.com> Donald McClellan >>10 <R.F.Kearns at open.ac.uk> R.F.Kearns >>10 <bhelfant at globecomm.com> Bob Helfant >>10 <bills at rpa.net> Bill Sly >>10 <boonhing at ncb.gov.sg> Khoo Boon Hing >>10 <charles at arnold.idiscover.co.uk> Charles Arnold >>10 <davem at solve.net> Dave McFerren >>10 <dfares at uscib.org> David A. Fares >>10 <esr at snark.thyrsus.com> Eric S. Raymond >>10 <fowlie at walt-disney.com> Paul Ricard Fowlie >>10 <jlevee at jonesday.com> Jeff LeVee >>10 <john at toyota-slo.com> John Frangie >>10 <kgautier at mdek12.state.ms.us> Kris Gautier >>10 <klensin at mci.net> John Klensin >>10 <lovingoodlaw at mindspring.com> Katherine P Lovingood >>10 <matti at fugue.Jpl.Nasa.Gov> Matti Siltanen >>10 <michael at nicertech.com> Michael Wang >>10 <mike at enoch.org > Mike Johnson >>10 <mkibati at rpcp.mit.edu> Mugo Kibati >>10 <nick at digitalmagic.net> Nick Wemyss >>10 <osusan98 at yahoo.com> Susan O'Donnell >>10 <page at lcc.net> Page >>10 <pat at py.com> Pat McGarvey >>10 <pchris at tiac.net> Chris Perleberg >>10 <randy at psg.com> Randy Bush >>10 <rbodoff at CBBB.BBB.ORG> >>10 <reedpc at libbey.com> Phillip C. Reed >>10 <robertjrose at worldnet.att.net> Bob Rose >>10 <schomburgp at panasonic.com> >>10 <sirjames at jalyn.com> James Wright >>10 <slaw at audiophile.com> Stephen Law >>10 <sly at msn.com> Simon White >>10 <tmurphy at earthlink.net> Tom Murphy >>10 <vaden at texoma.net> Larry Vaden >>10 <vcerf at mci.net> Vint Cerf >>10 <vonne at i8.net> Pat Lynch >>10 <vsayler at saylerfamily.com> Van Sayler >>10 <wsimpson at greendragon.com> William Allen Simpson >>10 <zittrain at law.harvard.edu> Jonathan Zittrain >>10 BENHAMADI at IST.CERIST.DZ >>10 George.Sadowsky at nyu.edu >>10 Sean at Jackson.TC >>10 amarine at globe.arc.nasa.gov >>10 ao at Anwalt.DE >>10 barryblue at mindspring.com >>10 bernhard at telia.net >>10 cambler at iodesign.com >>10 colin at iafrica.com >>10 cyarnell at coredump.arc.nasa.gov >>10 domains at calvin.tcscs.com >>10 fvdb at datafront.net >>10 geert.glas at lcv.be >>10 gusb at atina.ar >>10 hostmast at nic.de >>10 ichii at ms.u-tokyo.ac.jp >>10 jacobe at tvl.net.vu >>10 jeff at isa.net >>10 jyfortin at kiwi.on.ca >>10 narten at raleigh.ibm.com >>10 orla.osullivan at ucd.ie >>10 pfs at cisco.com >>10 robert.shaw at itu.int >>10 rsawon at starnet.net.ar >>10 sra=iana-announce at epilogue.com >>11 2217279 at MCIMAIL.COM >>11 <Billburr at aol.com> Bill Burrington >>11 <DaviesKJ at corporate.pwh.qld.gov.au> Kevin Davies >>11 <JaneKeeler at pigeon.carleton.ca> Jane Keeler >>11 <Janine.Coulthard at postoffice.co.uk> Janine Coulthard >>11 <Ole.Carsten.Pedersen at DK.net> Tele Danmark >>11 <alewis at biosys.net> Alan Lewis >>11 <amit_mehrotra at geocities.com> Amit Mehrotra >>11 <brianl at comports.com> Brian Longstien >>11 <brunner at hi.com> Eric Brunner (Wampumpeag) >>11 <carioca at televar.com> Jack Wyant >>11 <chon at cosmos.kaist.ac.kr> Kilnan Chon >>11 <cliffd at endispute.co.uk> Cliff Dilloway >>11 <david_j_anderson at yahoo.com> David J. Anderson >>11 <dcrocker at brandenburg.com> Dave Crocker >>11 <development at webpro.com> Webpro International >>11 <djk at cyber.com.au> David Keegel >>11 <hargreaves at n2computers.com> John R. Hargreaves >>11 <joea at rway.com> Joe Angiolillo >>11 <johno at psynet.net> John O'Donnell >>11 <kimh at arin.net> Kim Hubbard >>11 <kskakkad at dvlp.mnscu.edu> Ketan Kakkad >>11 <markgoll at express-news.net> Mark Goll >>11 <montalban at n2trouble.com> Jim Montalban >>11 <mueller at ist.syr.edu> Milton Mueller >>11 <notions at earthlink.net> Walter or Marilyn Pavlovsky >>11 <paul.kane at icb.co.uk> Paul M. Kane >>11 <peterhansen at technologist.com> Peter Hansen >>11 <pf at laie.1sc.com> Pat Forrestal >>11 <pja at glocom.ac.jp> Adam Peake >>11 <ramesh at mimos.my> Ramesh Kumar Nadarajah >>11 <rhodes at altern.org> Andrea Rhodes >>11 <ridgewrg at columb34.dhec.state.sc.us> Robert Ridgeway >>11 <sap8 at cornell.edu> Santos A. Perez >>11 <smits at positive-thinking.com> Donald Smits >>11 <sob at harvard.edu> Scott Bradner >>11 <ssteele at eff.org> Shari Steele >>11 <staff at registrars.net> Shaun Dolan >>11 <stim at technologist.com> Tim Storr >>11 <stuartb at demon.net> Stuart Berman >>11 <ted.tatchio at esc20.k12.tx.us> Ted Tatchio >>11 <the.third.millennium at erols.com> James Sullivan >>11 <webmaster at csg-i.com> Rick Tuinenburg >>11 Annie.Renard at nic.fr >>11 ETHTAN at ntu.edu.sg >>11 Jonas.Bergenudd at framfab.se >>11 Julie_Fenster at timeinc.com >>11 acaparros at fedma.org >>11 aktive at magix.co.uk >>11 alago at galeno.unicies.cesga.es >>11 alan at connected.org >>11 brc at nic.cc >>11 burack at isoc.org >>11 cc at bcmicro.com >>11 greenfld at pipeline.com >>11 gvagbxs at typeb.sita.int >>11 jkaufman at tmlaw.com >>11 jlangley at cossette.com >>11 lcrouch at pobox.com >>11 lisa at numa.niti.org >>11 mazuda at flab.fujitsu.co.jp >>11 olivier.muron at francetelecom.fr >>11 post-iana-announce at partan.com >>11 ramita at ray.apdip.net >>11 rrodin at skadden.com >>11 rsf at CS.Stanford.EDU >>11 rsparkman at att.net >>11 scarmalt at swconsult.ch >>11 schneider at switch.ch >>11 simon at horizon.cc.huji.ac.il >>11 skawina at ii.pw.edu.pl >>11 ted at usa.net >>11 turcotte at crim.ca >>12 <3RI at fwbnet.com> Rob Buckman >>12 <GameHob at aol.com> Keith Kail >>12 <INHOUSE95 at aol.com> Ali Kamarei >>12 <Jimmie_Haines at nsist.unomaha.edu> Jimmie Haines >>12 <KINGKYU at aol.com> King K. Yu >>12 <Kathryn at domain-name.org> Kathryn Kleiman >>12 <Keith at atreve.com> Keith Weng >>12 <MWHITNEY1 at aol.com> Mark Whitney >>12 <Phil_Feeney at mediaone.net> Phil Feeney >>12 <TMHSJH at worldnet.att.net> Tim Hickman >>12 <Tim.Casey at MCI.Com> Tim D. Casey >>12 <WerBAC at aol.com> Cassandrea Simpson >>12 <aka at maui.net> Kenneth F. Proctor Jr. >>12 <allancrane at netlimit.com> Allan W. Crane >>12 <bhall at faith.gordonc.edu> Brian Hall >>12 <big_al at idacom.net> Alan Carter >>12 <bourdaa at chem.ucla.edu> Michael Bourdaa >>12 <byrne_jason at hotmail.com> Jason Byrne >>12 <davide.migliavacca at inferentia.it> Davide Migliavacca >>12 <dholtz at internic.net> David H. Holtzman >>12 <dweitzel at mail50.mitretek.org> David S. Weitzel >>12 <dwsimpso at august.com> Dennis Simpson >>12 <frode.greisen at ebone.net> Frode Greisen >>12 <gih at telstra.net> Geoff Huston >>12 <girard at artlover.com> Bill GirarD >>12 <glenn at microagegb.com> Glenn Bell >>12 <hsscott at waikato.ac.nz> Howard Scott >>12 <huitema at bellcore.com> Christian Huitema >>12 <jchinn at unixg.ubc.ca> Jade Chinn >>12 <jtsmith at mailer.fsu.edu> Todd Smith >>12 <karl at cavebear.com> Karl Auerbach >>12 <kevin at kmsmith.com> Kevin M. Smith >>12 <kraybill at vianet.net.au> Gene Kraybill >>12 <krishanamar at hotmail.com> Amar Singh >>12 <liz at gablegroup.com> Liz Deakin >>12 <mac16 at globalnet.co.uk> Niall McDonough >>12 <marge at itw.com> Marge Palermo >>12 <mike at execworld.net> >>12 <mikehack at juno.com> >>12 <mixmaster at remail.obscura.com> John Robertson >>12 <msg43 at columbia.edu> Matthew Greer >>12 <msondow at ic.sunysb.edu> Michael Sondow >>12 <mtimmeny at cisco.com> >>12 <mvi at tektown.com> Sharon Clemons >>12 <naldi at alinet.it> Andrea Naldi >>12 <pvollrat at UCSD.Edu> Peter Vollrath >>12 <qhhu at cnnic.net.cn> Qiheng Hu >>12 <roberts at ivory.educom.edu> Mike Roberts >>12 <scott at secretshopnet.com> Scott Moore >>12 <shirleyl at hway.net> Shirley Louise Coffie >>12 <skoug at mocca.com> >>12 <skylimited at mailexcite.com> Amy Smith >>12 <urben at ibm.net> Steve Urben >>12 <visa at wanadoo.fr> Manuel Vila >>12 <webmaster at belfast.net> David Jobling >>12 <y2-yamam at mpt.go.jp> >>12 <yhp at sover.net> Paul Happ >>12 Francis.Dupont at inria.fr >>12 MBone at multimedia.net.id >>12 charles.smith at ispc.org >>12 chris at connect.com.au >>12 cloos at jhcloos.com >>12 denis at acacia.cts.ucla.edu >>12 dominic.young at newsint.co.uk >>12 ivan at srce.hr >>12 jbroom at manta.outremer.com >>12 ldunlap at cossette.com >>12 quaynor at ghana.com >>12 rbj at np.ac.sg >>12 rekel at belau.net >>12 sabine at denic.de >>12 sekjen at apjii.or.id >>12 sma at fwpa.com >>12 vixie at vix.com >>13 <ARTHUR.SACKLER at twi.com> Arthur Sackler >>13 <DWILSON at baker-hostetler.com> Arthur Sackler(c/o DENNIS WILSON) >>13 <Howland at Priss.com> Curt Howland >>13 <MKKavana at aol.com> Mark Kavana >>13 <RAJ at inf.wsp.krakow.pl> Jaroslaw Rafa >>13 <RHICKS at clear.co.nz> Roger Hicks >>13 <VicQuality at aol.com> VicQuality >>13 <andrueron at earthlink.net> Andru Eron >>13 <caldwell at ilv.ucl.ac.be> Hugh Caldwell >>13 <christopher.wilkinson at bxi.dg13.cec.be> Christopher Wilkinson >>13 <clough at discoverymail.com> Kurt Clough >>13 <dhughes at ford.com> Dan Hughes >>13 <dwomack at dragons-inn.org> Dave Womack >>13 <eestapl at televar.com> Ed Stapleton >>13 <ericrenken at forest-view-computing.com> Eric Renken >>13 <flemmingdaniel at hotmail.com> Daniel Flemming >>13 <garyclarke at yahoo.com> Gary Clarke >>13 <gnana at ibm.net> Gnana >>13 <grixon at aol.com> Gregory Rixon >>13 <heather at garden.net> Dan Parisi >>13 <howes at netscape.com> Tim Howes >>13 <ishida at u-tokyo.ac.jp> Haruhisa Ishida >>13 <joel.jaakkola at lm.vn.fi> Joel Jaakkola >>13 <jstrout at ucsd.edu> Joseph J. Strout >>13 <kam.woo at mindspring.com> Kam F. Woo >>13 <karp1 at airmail.net> Karen Arp >>13 <kenwh at microsoft.com> Ken Whitaker >>13 <lahoag at athenet.net> Lucille A. Hoag >>13 <luke at magna.com.au> Luke Carruthers >>13 <mathiason at mail.netstep.net> John R. Mathiason >>13 <mberejka at microsoft.com> Marc Berejka >>13 <merv at aaaaustralia.com.au> Merv Francis >>13 <mrburke at mail.bc.rogers.wave.ca> Eric Burke >>13 <os10000 at cus.cam.ac.uk> Oliver Seidel >>13 <palger at ix.netcom.com> Pam Alger >>13 <rfromme at usa.net> Richard Fromme >>13 <rock at columbus.rr.com> Rock >>13 <sales at advsc.com> Ted Eckerson >>13 <sammy at technotrade.com> Sammy Afifi >>13 <sawan at hierarchy.mit.edu> Sawan P. Deshpande >>13 <sestrada at aldea.com> Susan Estrada >>13 <simon at eagle.ca> Simon Rowland >>13 <svl at nrw.net> Siegfried Langenbach >>13 <volpe at net.telecomitalia.it> Michele Volpe >>13 <wada at cthulhu.engr.sgi.com> Alan Wada >>13 Jeff.Hodges at Stanford.EDU >>13 amar at telia.net >>13 avc at netnames.com >>13 cab at tc.umn.edu >>13 dburk at comstar.ru >>13 dkelly at Counsel.COM >>13 dorn at atl.eni.net >>13 emv at datamarkets.com.ar >>13 g.wright at nominet.org.uk >>13 geoff at mulligan.com >>13 kristopher.s at cadvision.com >>13 mal at jaring.my >>13 michael at memra.com >>13 mike at advsys.co.uk >>13 mjs at plaza.ds.adp.com >>13 olaogun at worldnet.att.net >>13 ray at hallmans.org >>13 swepett at netch.se >>13 tommy at sol.put.poznan.pl >>13 vivian at internet-research.com >>13 wayne at domain.net >>13 waynec at spinnaker.com >>13 wmingoen at sr.net >>14 <S.C.Foster at Prodigy.Net> S.C.Foster >>14 <ggm at dstc.edu.au> George Michaelson >>14 <hales at MelbourneIT.com.au> Trevor Hales >>14 <jalhade at ibm.net> Joseph H. Alhadeff >>14 <jeandav at yahoo.com> Jean David >>14 <jim at onrampinc.net> Jim Baker >>14 <kenrohde at hotmail.com> Ken Rohde >>14 <kmmartinsen at ucdavis.edu> Kristen Martinsen >>14 <omat at rorqual.cc.metu.edu.tr> Onur Mat >>14 <rogerc at us.ibm.com> Roger Cochetti >>14 <timothy.r.howell at boeing.com> Tim Howell >>14 <webmaster at 4images.com> Jerry Winegard >>14 Haywood_Torrence at SMTP.NYNEX.COM >>14 Isabelle.Valet at digital.com >>14 RAF at CU.NIH.GOV >>14 Robert at NetNamesUSA.com >>14 admin at twnmoe10.edu.tw >>14 centr at ripe.net >>14 gdt at ns.cr >>14 hotz at ISI.EDU >>14 jak8 at cornell.edu >>14 k13 at nikhef.nl >>14 megwork at yyz.com >>14 mljenkins at rbd-law.com >>14 shafiek at is.co.za >>14 shirsch at hol.fr >>14 tspangler at mecklermedia.com >>2 <BMccam at aol.com> Bill McCampbell >>2 <Boudewijn.Nederkoorn at surfnet.nl> Boudewijn Nederkoorn >>2 <Ira_C._Magaziner at oa.eop.gov> Ira C. Magaziner >>2 <Lowell.Sachs at East.Sun.COM> Lowell Sachs >>2 <MarmaxFWA at aol.com> Marge Winteregg >>2 <Niall.oReilly at ucd.ie> >>2 <PKVC32A at prodigy.com> Kent DeLong >>2 <Pc-User at wipo.int> >>2 <Sacramento at aol.com> >>2 <aktiveeccs at hotmail.com> Dallas Baird >>2 <bernier at mediafusion.ca> Jacques Bernier >>2 <bodebeckman at bode.com> Judy Caruthers >>2 <boud1 at videotron.ca> Albert Y. Boud >>2 <chrisw at iwl.com> Chris Wellens >>2 <cls at flywheel.com> Craig Simon >>2 <cnsmith at UU.NET> Clint N. Smith >>2 <cooke at for-president.com> Cindy Cooke >>2 <crc at clark.net> Charles Chidekel >>2 <david at bowsher.net> David E. Bowsher >>2 <davidc at apnic.net> David Conrad >>2 <ed at capital.net.au> Ed Sweeney >>2 <erthlng at tias.com> Phillip Davies >>2 <gbrowning at cdt.org> Graeme Browning >>2 <harrycole at yahoo.com> Harry Cole >>2 <jfernan at mailcity.com> Jose Fernandez >>2 <jsola at aui.es> Javier Sola >>2 <kenc at cwi.emap.com> Kenneth Cukler >>2 <kitalet at trvnet.net> Terry Ferguson >>2 <klmn2 at aol.com> Kalman Kaminer >>2 <liucharles at yahoo.com> Charles Liu >>2 <mjmaeng at shinbiro.com> MJ Maeng >>2 <monet at conk.com> Monet Rosara >>2 <mrory at deathsdoor.com> Rory McDonald >>2 <mshay at gradschools.com> Mark Shay >>2 <naylor at netexecutive.com> Todd Naylor >>2 <nfall at yahoo.com> Norman Fall >>2 <paul at xs2.net> Paul Kalocsay >>2 <pgp at pgmedia.net> Paul Garrin >>2 <pinchet at postmaster.co.uk> Mary Pinchet >>2 <pw at iol.ie> John Moran >>2 <rick at vegas.com> Rick >>2 <rony at usit.net> Peter Rony >>2 <sacolvin at juno.com> Sue Ann Colvin >>2 <skuppa at ecom.net> Don Mulligan >>2 <stuart at mfcc.com> Jim Michael c/o Stuart Altschuler >>2 <thepoet at thepoet.com> Richard Miller >>2 <werbes at phayze.com> Leonard Werbes >>2 <wsl at cerebalaw.com> William S. Lovell >>2 Didier.Lebrun at ilink.fr >>2 NASHWA at FRCU.EUN.EG >>2 andreas at gtn.com >>2 centr-info at ripe.net >>2 dan at dpcsys.com >>2 davidk at ISI.EDU >>2 dnsops at usvi.net >>2 domain at uni2.dk >>2 dr at firstdomain.net >>2 dzidonu at nust.ac.zw >>2 freedman at netaxs.com >>2 j-endoh at the.ne.jp >>2 james at wired.com >>2 jesper at maartenson.net >>2 moore.louis at childrens.tchden.org >>2 nlj at bellcore.com >>2 npc at longshot.jetcafe.org >>2 orobles at nic.mx >>2 splendid at umich.edu >>2 valtteri.halla at research.nokia.com >>2 vance at usq.edu.au >>2 wta at adamspat.com >>3 <BRPWIT at aol.com> Witkin Associates >>3 <DrDandJim at aol.com> >>3 <Kevin.Brown at NetComm.IE> Kevin Brown >>3 <Nederkoorn at SURFnet.nl> Boudewijn Nederkoorn >>3 <RFWaechter at erols.com> Ray Waechter >>3 <Rich at directorio.com.mx> Rich Robins >>3 <Stephanie_Stitzer at aeanet.org> Stephanie Stitzer >>3 <alanmay at mailcity.com> Alan May >>3 <amadill at digicron.com> Adrienne Madill >>3 <ario at mailcity.com> Eduardus Isworo >>3 <at at ah.net> Adam Todd >>3 <beacon at customnet.net> Wendy Polk >>3 <bill at modeleasy.com> Bill Teeters >>3 <billtanner at iname.com> Bill Tanner >>3 <birdip at aloha.net> Angela Charlebois >>3 <bradjacobsen at postmaster.co.uk> Bradley Jacobsen >>3 <bretdouglas at hotmail.com> Bret Douglas >>3 <brichard at mpaa.org> Bonnie Richardson >>3 <carsten.reinke at berlinonline.de> Carsten Reinke >>3 <cjardon at wbkq.com> William Boger >>3 <clance at connect.com.au> Kate Lance >>3 <cook at cookreport.com> Gordon Cook >>3 <dan at lynch.com> Dan Lynch >>3 <deering at cisco.com> Steve Deering >>3 <edit4u at mindspring.com> Randy Marshall >>3 <george.sadowsky> George Sadowsky >>3 <gsmee at yahoo.com> Dr. Smee >>3 <heath at isoc.org> Don Heath >>3 <hhsiung at mail50.mitretek.org> Hsiaosu Hsiung >>3 <imbatman at acc.jbu.edu> Chris Rikli >>3 <jgtestut at pratique.fr> Jean-Guy Testut >>3 <jjb4 at gte.net> Jim Byron >>3 <jorange at orpat.com> John R. S. Orange >>3 <josephf at touro.edu> Joseph Friedman >>3 <jrogers at mail.internet.com.mx> John A Rogers >>3 <jvcret at goodnet.com> James Carroll >>3 <kent at songbird.com> Kent Crispin >>3 <lim at bitsmart.com> Tony Lim >>3 <maruyama at nic.ad.jp> MARUYAMA Naomasa >>3 <morgand at mailcity.com> Dennis Morgan >>3 <phil at hockers.com> Philip M. Hocker >>3 <sarah.b.deutsch at BellAtlantic.com> Sarah B. Deutsch >>3 <schlotsky at conk.com> Richard Schlotsky >>3 <scottfleury at turnhere.com> Scott Fleury >>3 <stephanie.bowman at mailexcite.com> Stephanie Bowman >>3 <supplysider at email.msn.com> Thomas J. Feery >>3 <tfrankel at bu.edu> Tamar Frankel >>3 <tmdenton at magma.ca> Timothy M. Denton >>3 <vpacha at caramail.com> Pacha Vivian >>3 aca at telia.net >>3 asjl at netlink.co.nz >>3 awsmith at rip.ops.neosoft.com >>3 caj at tdrs.com >>3 calle at internwww.telia.net >>3 debbgirl at ix.netcom.com >>3 doron at isoc.org.il >>3 exec at aop.org >>3 gvinall at erols.com >>3 julio at apogeedigital.com >>3 kj at fedex.com >>3 lcristal at fishneave.com >>3 mark at mentat.com >>3 mheltzer at inta.org >>3 miguel.sanz at satec.es >>3 obata at ats.sjk.kdd.co.jp >>3 rainer at schlund.de >>3 rvh at alum.mit.edu >>3 smattin at nadler.com >>3 sola at jet.es >>3 yumiyumi at nic.ad.jp >>4 <ASkwar at DigitalProjects.com> Alexander Skwar >>4 <BestQuote at aol.com> Wade Thomas >>4 <Champion67 at aol.com> Charles J. Champion >>4 <Georg.Korger at BIGFOOT.COM> George Korger >>4 <Hmiller at itaa.org> Harris Miller >>4 <LMRist at aol.com> >>4 <RCard68865 at aol.com> >>4 <aghaffar at artemedia.ch> Atif Ghaffar >>4 <bjcon at earthlink.net> Brian Considine >>4 <chrissiewissie at hotmail.com> Christine Beed >>4 <dwmaher at ibm.net> Dave W. Maher >>4 <fneilson at mauimail.com> Frank Neilson >>4 <gallant at altern.org> Kristine Gallant >>4 <gavin at careerbuilder.com> Gavin Rodkey >>4 <georges at secretshopnet.com> George E. Stea >>4 <gnemitz at isecorp.com> Gregory Nemitz >>4 <hun at geocities.com> Hun >>4 <jameskl at earthlink.net> James Leong >>4 <jdd at vbc.net> Jim Dixon >>4 <jeffmasters at mailcity.com> Jeffrey masters >>4 <jun at wide.ad.jp> Jum Muri >>4 <jwalko at acm.org> Julie Walko >>4 <jyamiolk at nimbus.ocis.temple.edu> Tim Hicks >>4 <lfischer67 at hotmail.com> Louis Fischer >>4 <mark at pagemaster.com> Mark Ferguson >>4 <mike at unival.com> Mike Hitchcock >>4 <mweinberg at jonesday.com> Mike Weinberg >>4 <noran at discoverymail.com> Frank Noran >>4 <peggy.haney at aexp.com> Peggy Haney >>4 <richardh at writeme.com> Richard Hartig >>4 <rpbedell at bellatlantic.net> Robert P. Bedell >>4 <soneill at itaa.org> Sheila ONeill >>4 <sstapf at hastingsgroup.com> Scott Stapf >>4 <stuartm at cyberjunkie.com> Stewert Mctaggart >>4 <sundog at rmi.net> Neal Graham >>4 <tbqian at cnnic.net.cn> Tianbai Qian >>4 <tim at ora.com> Tim O Reilly >>4 <toru at tokyonet.ad.jp> Toru Takahashi >>4 <trail.leanne at usa.net> Leanne Frances Trail >>4 <vik at compuserve.com> Vik Olliver /NZ >>4 <weisberg at texoma.net> Eric Weisberg >>4 Elisabeth.PORTENEUVE at cetp.ipsl.fr >>4 JIMBRAMSON at aol.com >>4 JohnW at Prince.com >>4 MUncapher at itaa.org >>4 Rosa.Delgado at gva.sita.int >>4 SYSOP at bol.healthnet.org >>4 Walter.vanDijk at surfnet.nl >>4 abraham at afro.cnuce.cnr.it >>4 ajh at this.net >>4 bb+lists.iana.announce at cyrus.watson.org >>4 bmanning at ISI.EDU >>4 bygg at sunet.se >>4 cabell at mama-tech.com >>4 charles at alternet.co.za >>4 ck at nrm.se >>4 crocker at mbl.edu >>4 demco at cs.ubc.ca >>4 director at connect.ie >>4 el at lisse.NA >>4 fdcj at iphil.net >>4 fm at mids.org >>4 fnormant at technologia.ca >>4 galvin at commerce.net >>4 gkm at muSys.com >>4 jbehrman at netropolis.net >>4 jfisher at isdmnl.wr.usgs.gov >>4 jimd at lmi.net >>4 keith.gymer at bt.com >>4 landi at mail.nacamar.de >>4 mar at planete.net >>4 mje at co.za >>4 musa at kacst.edu.sa >>4 nr at act.wilton.ct.us >>4 paf at swip.net >>4 steve.bartholomew at concert.com >>4 sully at votiv.com >>4 yoki at acm.org >>5 <2courier at airmail.net> David Reiner >>5 <AWeinrib at ibeam.intel.com> Abel Winerib >>5 <Anichols at poboxes.com> Adrian Nichols >>5 <BCCollins at aol.com> BCCollins >>5 <GCunningham at smtp.csinet.org> Gregory Cunningham >>5 <Jay at Iperdome.com> Jay Fenello >>5 <JohnW at Prince.co.uk> John Wood >>5 <NELSOND at ny-smtp.army.mil> Dennis Nelson >>5 <SLP at webtv.net> S. Wells >>5 <adrian at edge.com.sg> Adrian Stewart >>5 <allenkratz at lucent.com> Allen Kratz >>5 <benharness at yada-yada.com> Ben Harness >>5 <brianjericho at altern.org> Brian Jericho >>5 <carl at oppedahl.com> Carl Oppedahl >>5 <collignon at netbay.net> Collignon Francois-luc >>5 <dbucher at horus.ch> Denis Bucher >>5 <dieterp at mailcity.com> Dieter Pesch >>5 <esthert at n2investing.com> Esther Thompson >>5 <eustaran at paisner.co.uk> Eduardo Ustaran >>5 <gnu at toad.com> John Gilmore >>5 <griz at ldd.net> Shane Grissom >>5 <hlubsen at idomains.net> Hal Lubsen >>5 <jcurran at bbn.com> John Curran >>5 <joanne at secretshopnet.com> Joanne Toller >>5 <jzambanini at ofmconv.org> Julian Zambanini >>5 <kstubbs at corenic.org> Kevin Stubbs >>5 <nathwani at ida.net> Kala Nathwani >>5 <partners at worldgaming.net> Tracy Kurz >>5 <patent at perstorp.com> Patent Department >>5 <rgm at htt-consult.com> Robert Moskowitz >>5 <samanthaleader at your-house.com> Samantha Leader >>5 <staff at intergate.bc.ca> Paul C.H. Lum >>5 <stef at nma.com> Einar Stefferud >>5 <tim__rice at yahoo.com> Tim Rice >>5 <william at walsh.tj> William X. Walsh >>5 Andre.Duminy at postoffice.co.uk >>5 Asa.Johansson at itu.int >>5 DOUGSMITH at prodigy.net >>5 ELMAOUHAB at IST.CERIST.DZ >>5 Jiri.Orsag at eunet.cz >>5 abduwani at gto.net.om >>5 bnatale at acecomm.com >>5 bridges at merit.edu >>5 ccaputo at alt.net >>5 clifford at utama.bolnet.bo >>5 dkaplan at terra-nova.fr >>5 gefib at francenet.fr >>5 gidaa at perkinscoie.com >>5 gilles at mana.pf >>5 goto at goto.info.waseda.ac.jp >>5 hostmaster at nunames.nu >>5 jspira at basex.com >>5 julian.fagandini at assocnews.co.uk >>5 jzucker at suncare.net >>5 krose at ntia.doc.gov >>5 marius at isgate.is >>5 measday at ibm.net >>5 mikejani at aitcom.net >>5 nanako at web.ad.jp >>5 nfra at hpe25.inima.al >>5 nwood at netsearchers.co.uk >>5 pdeblanc at usvi.net >>5 ppoblete at dcc.uchile.cl >>5 srh at merit.edu >>5 tim_evans at admiral.ad.jp >>5 vern at ee.lbl.gov >>5 xdat11 at email.mot.com >>6 <104056.110 at compuserve.com> Jose Luis Pardos >>6 <Amadeu at nominalia.com> Nominalia >>6 <Deborah_K_Jones at email.whirlpool.com> Deborah Jones >>6 <Elnadie2 at aol.com> >>6 <GTESSIER at REDCROSS.CA> Guy Tessier >>6 <HeyJim at Mad.Scientist.com> Jim Sheetz >>6 <HoveyR at mail.dec.com> Richard Hovey >>6 <KMCGEE at us.oracle.com> >>6 <Keith.Gymer at btinternet.com> Keith Gymer >>6 <MKRIEGER/0005975596 at MCIMAIL.COM> Michael Krieger >>6 <MyDeadCow at aol.com> >>6 <Roberto.Gaetano at etsi.fr> Roberto Gaetano >>6 <adatta at ml.org> Aveek Datta >>6 <bcannon at jps.net> Bruce Cannon >>6 <bdooley at cix.org> Barbara Dooley >>6 <bedlam at gte.net> Ben Hamilton >>6 <blacklaura at hotmail.com> Laura Black >>6 <charles_goldman at hotmail.com> Charles Goldman >>6 <clearsol at newton.dialix.com.au> Bret Busby >>6 <dancohen at best.com> Dan Cohen >>6 <darrell_greenwood at mindlink.net> Darrell Greenwood >>6 <davidprice at the18thhole.com> David Price >>6 <ddbailey at roman.net> David & Julie Bailey >>6 <dont at netsol.com> Donald N. Telage >>6 <doug at solipsis.com> Doug Anderson >>6 <dsrobson at erols.com> Darian Scott Robson >>6 <dthompso at lan.tjhsst.edu> David Thompson >>6 <farber at cis.upenn.edu> Dave Farber >>6 <frazierf at telsurf.net> Fred Frazier >>6 <glenn at technologylaw.com> Glenn B. Manishan >>6 <herman.merlo at mailcity.com> Herman Merlo >>6 <jberman at cdt.org> >>6 <kurtred at canwetalk.com> >>6 <laina at singnet.com.sg> Laina Raveendran Greene >>6 <maxwell at aix.pacwan.net> Christine Maxwell >>6 <ned.freed at innosoft.com> Ned Freed >>6 <oddbod at dogsbody.ccls.edu> L J Davies >>6 <pandy at tande.com> Andrew Parker >>6 <petersterry at yahoo.com> Terry Peters >>6 <pfh at netscape.com> Peter Harter >>6 <ppreston at imsglobal.com> Paul Preston >>6 <risner at stdio.com> James Risner >>6 <robins at cryogen.com> Robin Smith >>6 <samwarner at deal-maker.com> Samuel Warner >>6 <sascha at isoc.vienna.org> Sascha Ignjatovic >>6 <sharoneg at victory-research.com> Sharon Eisner >>6 <smitty at tyler.net> Smitty >>6 <swolff at cisco.com> Steve Wolff >>6 <usdh at mail.ccnet.com> Stephen J. Page >>6 Kathy_Chelini at thomson-thomson.com >>6 L-IANA.announce at blackbox.at >>6 agockel at arin.net >>6 akraft at association.org >>6 andy at interactivehq.org >>6 badkins at itic.nw.dc.us >>6 brunner at maine.rr.com >>6 cheryle at ms6.hinet.net >>6 cts at star-nets.com >>6 dakin at ham.southam.ca >>6 dmc at bayarea.net >>6 elizabethw at thestandard.net >>6 fleck at informatik.uni-bonn.de >>6 froomkin at law.miami.edu >>6 gtld at MelbourneIT.com.au >>6 jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com >>6 ltang at suncare.net >>6 pjnesser at Nesser.COM >>6 plat at ripn.net >>6 rob at echelon.ca >>6 sastre at Anwalt.DE >>6 tomg at gablegroup.com >>6 tsubo at global-commons.co.jp >>6 wolf at informatik.uni-ulm.de >>7 <BobMar123 at aol.com> >>7 <Bruce.Linn at camtech.com.au> Bruce Linn >>7 <KMPA8317 at jpo-miti.go.jp> Japanese Patent Office (JPO) >>7 <Randy_R_Butera at ccm.sc.intel.com> Randy Butera >>7 <SamHahn at StoneSpring.org> Samuel Hahn >>7 <UFMG at unfinishedfurnstores.com> Mary Voorhees >>7 <agneslee at ncb.gov.sg> Agnes Lee >>7 <amy at aipla.org> Gary Griswold >>7 <bcdmulti at earthlink.net> Peter J. Dockendorf >>7 <boccelli at ohio-state.com> Joanne Boccelli >>7 <brian.kennedy at CyberSafe.COM> Brian J. Kennedy >>7 <brian at hursley.ibm.com> Brian Carpenter >>7 <cal at jazzflavor.com> Cal Godot >>7 <cmj at 3Com.com> Cyndi Jung >>7 <digitalpcs at earthlink.net> Chad Folkening >>7 <dlackner at MIT.EDU> David I. Lackner >>7 <dleung at biogate.com> Daniel Leung >>7 <ecoe at worldnet.att.net> Sheryl E. Coe >>7 <eisner at end-war.com> Laurence Eisner >>7 <elizabeth_frazee at corp.disney.com> Elizabeth Frazee >>7 <frank.brushes at t-online.de> Stefan Ganzmann >>7 <garthk at a-vip.com> Garth Krock >>7 <hadeed at batelco.com.bh> Hadeed >>7 <john at actrix.gen.nz> John Vorstermans >>7 <jpm at nscs.fast.net> John P. McGrath >>7 <jw at altern.org> J. Williams >>7 <k-stager at email.mc.ti.com> Keith Stager >>7 <karl at mcs.net> Karl Denninger >>7 <khan at pla-net.net> The Continuum >>7 <kirk at dyrad.com> Kirk Rader >>7 <kuester at kuesterlaw.com> Jeff Kuester >>7 <matti at telmo.fi> Matti Vasara >>7 <mcade at att.com> Marilyn S Cade >>7 <mek at sco.com> >>7 <mmcdonn at indranet.com> Mike McDonnell >>7 <moore at cs.utk.edu> Keith Moore >>7 <mpearl at itaa.org> >>7 <paul.stanyer at virgin.net> Paul Stanyer >>7 <pindar at HK.Super.NET> Pindar Wong >>7 <pkl348 at hotmail.com> Paul Lum >>7 <postel at isi.edu> Jon Postel >>7 <quent at altern.org> Quentin Flores >>7 <rcbartel at iname.com> Richard C. Bartel >>7 <rconnell at psi-japan.com> Robert F. Connelly >>7 <rob at direct-connect.com> Rob Brown >>7 <rsimpson at bellatlantic.net> Robert Simpson >>7 <scole at CBBB.BBB.ORG> >>7 <senad at aiiseitz.com> Senad Mehikic >>7 <sldavis at halldickler.com> Sally Davis >>7 <smb at research.att.com> Steven M. Bellovin >>7 <tomlinson at tomlin.com> Doug Tomlinson >>7 <youngs at secretshopnet.com> Sean Young >>7 Clare.Wardle at postoffice.co.uk >>7 HermanD at dnb.com >>7 JEisenbe at nas.edu >>7 MarkRhoads at aol.com >>7 Olle.Thylander at mbox301.swipnet.se >>7 Patrick at hosein.nom.tt >>7 billh at iconz.co.nz >>7 brian at system.co.za >>7 briano at isa.net >>7 cooker at staff.ci.ua.pt >>7 corbato at cac.washington.edu >>7 delegue at afa-france.com >>7 jhhur at nuri.net >>7 ks_lim at logchina.com.sg >>7 lee at cix.org >>7 lonely at skynet.be >>7 meno at aetea.com >>7 mis at gronaverket.se >>7 nigel at nic.gg >>7 paul at isoc.nl >>7 paule at CHT.de >>7 perry at piermont.com >>7 phoffman at imc.org >>7 rlfink at lbl.gov >>7 shimono at nagano.net >>7 skwan at microsoft.com >>7 sonko at noumea.orstom.nc >>7 ssh at HSAcorp.net >>7 take at barrier-free.co.jp >>7 victor.castelo at rediris.es >>8 <GVAVKXS at typeb.sita.int> Frederick de Cock >>8 <Jean_M_Baronas at co.xerox.com> Jean M Baronas >>8 <Joe_Sims at jonesday.com> Joe Sims >>8 <Kfouru at aol.com> Virginia Comito >>8 <Liz.Hogan at mci.com> Liz Hogan >>8 <P.O.BRIEN at DOMAINZ.NET.NZ> Patrick O' Brien >>8 <Paul.Huish at onyx.net> Paul Huish >>8 <SCOTT_COOPER at HP-USA-om62.om.hp.com> Scott Cooper >>8 <SDIINTLSTF at aol.com> Richard Dutchman >>8 <SP078740 at shellus.com> Scott Philbrook >>8 <alinet at email.msn.com> SCA >>8 <anthonybrearley at flashemail.com> Anthony Brearley >>8 <beauxarts at mailexcite.com> Celine Beauxarts >>8 <becky at postmaster.co.uk> Becky Gramsci >>8 <bill.poulos at eds.com> Bill Poulos >>8 <bouchons at videotron.ca> >>8 <christopher.gibson at wipo.int> Christopher Gibson >>8 <ckp at hen.nca.or.kr> Chanki Park >>8 <davinci at iprolink.ch> John Moetteli >>8 <deb.howard at 2cowherd.net> Deb Howard >>8 <dennx at earthlink.net> Dennis Lloyd >>8 <dermot at iceltic.com> Dermot O'Brien >>8 <djw at cdt.org> Danny Weitzner >>8 <dreamtec at hotmail.com> Fredrick James Mulica >>8 <dstein at travel-net.com> Dan Steinberg >>8 <ellenanderson at flashemail.com> Ellen Anderson >>8 <erony at marin.k12.ca.us> Ellen Rony >>8 <focus at finearte.com> R.E. Morin >>8 <francis.gurry at wipo.int> Francis Gurry >>8 <hamidoud at ralphbunche.rbs.edu> Chris Diori >>8 <info at avantigroup.com> Chuck Scott >>8 <izumi at anr.org> Izumi Aizu >>8 <jcook at wildbirdcenter.com> John Cook >>8 <jodonnell at mailcity.com> James O'Donnell >>8 <john at jlc.net> John Leslie >>8 <krjun at sunnet.kisdi.re.kr> Dr. Chan-Mo Chung >>8 <kunkel at psi.com> PSINet Inc. >>8 <mark_johnstone at hotmail.com> Mark Johnstone >>8 <mike at arialmktg.com> Mike Adams >>8 <mike at digiserve.com> Mike Blanche >>8 <mmettler at earthlink.net> Mark Mettler >>8 <mohammad at earthcorp.com> Mohammad Masoumeh Akeem >>8 <nat at cloud9.net> Nathaniel Phillips >>8 <paganelli at technologylaw.com> Frank V. Paganelli >>8 <philteal at webave.com> Philip Teal >>8 <pittmand at att.com> Dawn Pittman >>8 <psmerdon at mail.bc.rogers.wave.ca> Pat Smerdon >>8 <reynolds at flashemail.com> Wayne Reynolds >>8 <rick at strategicsolutions.net> Rick Cipoletti >>8 <sgwhite at paranet.com> Scott White >>8 <stedman at nixonfoundation.org> Luke A. Stedman >>8 <writer at frontiernet.net> Terry Boothman >>8 <zita at isi.edu> Zita Wenzel >>8 Marc.Blanchet at viagenie.qc.ca >>8 admin at cix.org >>8 bm at malepartus.de >>8 chin at south.pc.my >>8 clint at TheBeach.ky >>8 david at speco.com >>8 dee3 at torque.pothole.com >>8 dmclane at ieee.org >>8 edelman at law.harvard.edu >>8 eta at rcp.net.pe >>8 hsin at uniandes.edu.co >>8 internet.iana.announce at lists.dbc.mtview.ca.us >>8 mitchell at eni.net >>8 montjoy at bbnplanet.com >>8 mourik at ibm.net >>8 mueller at syr.edu >>8 oportunidades at redynet.com.ar >>8 roberts at educom.edu >>8 rvh at qsun.ho.att.com >>8 sramirez at seciu.edu.uy >>8 steve at domainbank.net >>8 tpcadmin at info.tpc.int >>8 wallner at swip.net >>8 william at intergate.bc.ca >>9 <CSchmidt at EUROTEL.DE> Constanze Schmidt >>9 <Erik.Huizer at sec.nl> Erik Huizer >>9 <Havard.Eidnes at runit.sintef.no> Havard Eidnes >>9 <JROCHE at CAUSE.ORG> Jim Roche >>9 <MTraphagen at spa.org> Mark Traphagen >>9 <RACING at compuserve.com> RIS-Michael Hollander >>9 <SRiffle at tibent.com> Stuart Riffle >>9 <a.vandijk at lr.tudelft.nl> Sander van Dijk >>9 <altidor at juno.com> >>9 <b.segal at cern.ch> Ben Segal >>9 <bestsoft at twics.com> Mark Mobley >>9 <bobso at microcrafts.com> Bob Soderberg >>9 <bowker at altern.org> Jacqueline Bowker >>9 <bracasen at usa.net> Janine Bracasen >>9 <cys at cushman.com> Catherine Y. Sun >>9 <dodge at aloha.net> John Suzuki >>9 <dolive at udc.fujitsu.com> David Olive >>9 <donkramer at hotmail.com> Don Kramer >>9 <dweitzner at cdt.org> Daniel Weitzner >>9 <edfin at mailcity.com> Edward Finning >>9 <ekie.buzzard at jgsullivan.com> Ekie Buzzard >>9 <glee at netcom.com> Glee Harrah Cady >>9 <graphics at anselmio.com> Anselm Lo >>9 <greg at tanru.ussnomad.org> Greg Trotter >>9 <jackie at spungold.com> Jacqueline Olexa >>9 <jeff.muhlbock at usa.net> Jeff Muhlbock >>9 <jerms at iname.com> Jeremy Lindsay >>9 <jim at digitalgreen.com> Jim Halpern >>9 <jkraus at n2music.com> Johan Kraus >>9 <joshua at mountmadonna.org> Joshua >>9 <jpe at halcyon.com> John Elliott >>9 <kellyp at wind-river.com> Kelly Perkins >>9 <kenji.rikitake at acm.org> Kenji Rikitake >>9 <kisters at tele-net.ch> Friedrich Kisters >>9 <lmitch at atlantic.net> Lisa Mitchell >>9 <martinj at sinosa.com> James Martin >>9 <mbagnall at roweandmaw.co.uk> Mary Bagnall >>9 <mrmaster at data.sicoar.com> Andres Mayo >>9 <nick at jeeves.net> Nick >>9 <nnyh at speewak.com> Nikolaj Nyholm >>9 <patrick at namesecure.com> Patrick Greenwell >>9 <pcranbrook at netlimit.com> >>9 <renamartens at att.com> Rena Martens >>9 <rh at siteleader.com> Site Leader >>9 <richards at isa.net> Jeff B. Richards >>9 <rmraer at gte.net> The Rutherfords >>9 <ryin at limbach.com> Ronald Yin >>9 <seannadir at usa.net> >>9 <stahura at enom.com> Paul Stahura >>9 <superordinary at hotmail.com> Dave Texidor >>9 <tomspano at webspan.net> Thomas Spano >>9 <tremblay at mailtag.com> Rick Tremblay >>9 <twinter1 at ix.netcom.com> >>9 <val at netwiz.net> Val Sarabashyan >>9 Bill.Myers at usic.org >>9 D.J.L.Pare at sussex.ac.uk >>9 Rolf.Poser at sasol.com >>9 cwu at suncare.net >>9 francis_x_doyle at md.northgrum.com >>9 harter at feeding.frenzy.com >>9 hostmaster at xlink.net >>9 jdfalk at usa.net >>9 jenglund at itaa.org >>9 jkaufman at oblon.com >>9 loug at escape.com >>9 mankin at ISI.EDU >>9 mchamber at polaris.umuc.edu >>9 michael_turner at dial.pipex.com >>9 mot at codeshop.com >>9 ooblick at netpolicy.com >>9 os at mrecic.gov.ar >>9 randelld at fipltd.demon.co.uk >>9 rsarasola at caminos.recol.es >>9 sghuter at darkwing.uoregon.edu >>9 soga at iij.ad.jp >>9 stpeters at NetHeaven.com >>9 thomasleavitt at hotmail.com >>9 tonyw at slip.net >>9 tristan at corpex.com >>9 werner at axone.ch >>9 wessorh at ibd.ar.com >>9 wlee at ISI.EDU >> > > > > >Jim Fleming >Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com > > > > > -------- Logged at Tue Jul 28 23:34:57 MET DST 1998 ---------

2 1

.COMoros
by JimFleming＠unety.net 20 Jul '98

20 Jul '98

If the IANA-endorsed IAHC recommendations are followed, wouldn't the U.S. Government have to transfer the .COM TLD to the country of COMOROS ? @@@ http://www.iana.org/country-codes.txt ... COMOROS KM COM 174 ... @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ If you recall, one of the reasons that .PER was not selected by the IAHC was because they have reserved it for Peru. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Mon Jul 20 10:47:03 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

IFWP Participants - For the Record
by JimFleming＠unety.net 20 Jul '98

20 Jul '98

Because web sites and mailing lists sometimes disappear, it is important to record this information in several places. @@@@ http://www.americas.ifwp.org/participants.htm The following is a list of participants at the IFWP-Americas event in Reston, VA, USA on July 1 & 2, 1998. Brian Adkins Information Technology Industry Council ("ITI") Izumi Aizu Asia & Pacific Internet Association (APIA) Christopher Ambler Individual Susan Anthony MCI Communications Corporation Karl Auerbach Individual Mikki Barry Domain Name Rights Coalition Gabe Battista Network Solutions Kim Bayliss The Dutko Group, Inc. Steven Bellovin AT&T Jeff Black iChannel Corporation Barry Bluestein The Lapis Group Jim Bramson AOL Lorraine Brennan International Chamber of Commerce Charles Brownstein XIWT Martin Burack Internet Society Becky Burr NTIA Diane Cabell Fausett, Gaeta & Lund (Boston) Marilyn Cade AT&T Glee Harrah Cady ICG Communications Netcom Terry Calhoun Society for College and University Planning (SCUP) Jean Cantrell Dun & Bradstreet Chris Clough Network Solutions Roger Cochetti IBM Gene Crick Texas ISP Association (TISPA) Ken Crutchfield US Interactive Kenneth Cukier Communications Week International John Curran GTE Internetworking Alan Davidson Center for Democracy & Technology Alan Davidson Center for Democracy and Technology Sally Davis Coalition for Advertising Supported Information and Entertainment (CASIE) Susan Davis Internet Council of Registrars Sarah Deutsch Bell Atlantic Vikram Dhawer Motion Picture Association Jim Dixon EuroISPA Carole Dobbs USPS Sean Donelan Data Research Associates Inc. Barbara Dooley CIX Janis Doran Industry Canada Hany Elmanawy Universal Postal Union Jon Emery Network Solutions Jon Englund Information Technology Association of America(ITAA) Jose Esteves Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom, LLP Michael Fanelli Federal Trade Commission David Farber University of Pennsylvania David Fares USCIB Harold Feld Domain Name Rights Coalition Jay Fenello Iperdome Ken Fockler Tenac Consulting Paul Foldes Inter Help Inc. Richard Forman Forman Interactive Corp. Marlene Fox-McIntyre American Internet Registrants Association John Frangie Image Online Design Dr. Tamar Frankel Chair Michael Froomkin University of Miami Roberto Gaetano ETSI Paul Garrin Name.Space Chuck Gomes Network Solutions Jeffrey Graber Association of Internet Professionals Ariel Graizer CABASE David Graves Network Solutions Neal Greenfield International Trademark Association (INTA) Patrick Greenwell NameSecure Robert Hall Canadian Association of Internet Providers (CAIP) Michelena Hallie Viacom Inc. Mark Harrington House Science Committee Peter Harter Netscape Rina Hartline Texas ISP Association (TISPA) Don Heath Internet Society Steve Heflin iDomains Incorporated Jason Hendeles CNIC Corporation Paul Hilal Hilal Capital Management LLC David Holtzman Network Solutions Richard Hovey Individual Deb Howard Internet Service Providers Consortium (ISP/C) Kim Hubbard ARIN Michelle Ibave Athene, Inc. Chris Israel Time Warner David Johnson Aspen Institute Internet Policy Project Craig Johnson Transnational Data Robert Kahn Corporation for National Research Initiatives (CNRI) Paul Kane INternet ONE Ron Kawchuk CAIP Debra Kelly Povich Kelly/Associates P.C. Victor Khanna Boston University Law School Chad Kissinger Onramp Access Kathryn Kleiman Domain Name Rights Coalition Bob Korzeniewski Network Solutions Eric Lee CIX Stuart Levi Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom, LLP Adam Lim Pricewaterhouse Coopers Roxanne Loveday Internet Service Providers Consortium (ISP/C) Hal Lubsen iDomains Incorporated Dave McClure Association of Online Professionals Mark McFadden CIX Scott McMahon Qwest Scott Mitchell Epoch Internet Don Mitchell Individual John Montjoy ILPF William Morgan Dun & Bradstreet Sascha Mornell Forman Interactive Corp. Brian Morris Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom, LLP Milton Mueller Syracuse University Mike Nelson IBM Paul Niedermyer Network Soultions Drew Olsen Industry Canada Brian O'Shaughnessy Internet Alliance Adam Peake Center For Global Communications Patricia Poaletta U.S. House Committee on Commerce Michael Provance US Interactive David Quam Powell, Goldstein, Frazer & Murphy John Quarterman Matrix Information and Directory Services Juliette Raffensperger The Dutko Group, Inc. Laina Raveendran Greene APPLE Sarah Reardon Electronic Messaging Association Tricia Rimo Bellcore Greg Rixon SDI Mike Roberts EDUCAUSE Oscar Robles NIC-Mexico Edward Rodriguez Mitretek Systems Dr. Peter Rony Individual Anthony Rutkowski General Magic Neeran Saraf SARAF Software Solutions, Inc Howard Sartori AIRA Ricardo Sawon CABASE Philip Sbarbaro Hanson & Molloy Michael Schneider EuroISPA David Schutt Speco, Inc Paul Scolese U.S. House Committee on Commerce William Semich Independent TLD Association Garrett Sern EDUCAUSE Andy Sernovitz Association for Interactive Media (AIM) James Shaw Embassy of Australia Craig Simon University of Miami School of International Studies Joe Sims Jones, Day, Reavis & Pogue Charles Smith Internet Service Providers Consortium (ISP/C) Cindy Smith Internet Service Providers Consortium (ISP/C) Clint Smith UUNET Technologies Einar Stefferud Individual Megan Stein Fujitsu Limited Ken Stubbs CORE Tracy Talyor Williams & Jensen Don Telage Network Solutions Wayne Thevenot Association for Interactive Media (AIM) Haywood Torrence Bell Atlantic Corporation Bernard Turcotte CANARIE Larry Vaden Individual Peter Veeck Individual Susan Watson Jones, Day, Reavis & Pogue Eric Weisberg Individual Steve Weiss SARAF Software Solutions, Inc Dave Weitzel Mitretek Systems Danny Weitzner Center for Democracy and Technology Heather Wilde Private Sector Working Group Jim Wilson House Committee on Science Eric Wimer Individual Jenny Wodinsky Pricewaterhouse Coopers Pindar Wong Asia Pacific Internet Association (APIA) John Wood Computer Science & Services Association Jonathan Zittrain Berkman Center for Internet and Society @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com -------- Logged at Tue Jul 28 10:32:24 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

TLD Policy
by edgarn＠geocities.com 15 Jul '98

15 Jul '98

Hello! TLD administrators under RIPE I am the new TLD administrator for DO. And I am looking forward to implement new policy about the cost that will have the Domain Name Registration under our TLD. So I would like to know what are you doing about that and whish are the main points that you are taking on mind to do so. An important matter about what we are concern is the cost that most have the domain name registration for educational and non-for-fit organizations. It is important for me and my organization to know what is your policy related to this organization. Thanks very much for the attention that could receive this request. Edgar Nzqez. -------- Logged at Wed Jul 15 10:54:35 MET DST 1998 ---------

2 1

TLD Policy
by schneider＠switch.ch 15 Jul '98

15 Jul '98

On Tuesday, 14 Jul 1998, =?iso-8859-1?B?SnVhbiBFZGdhciBO+vFleg==?= writes: Hello Edgar, > I am the new TLD administrator for DO. Welcome to the club! Santo Domingo is, however, not fully in Europe (well, you never know these days) and I think an APNIC forum (try www.apng.org for a start) may be better suited for you. RIPE has also set up a DL called tldadmin at ripe.net. > And I am looking forward to implement > new policy about the cost that will have the Domain Name Registration under > our TLD. So I would like to know what are you doing about that and whish are > the main points that you are taking on mind to do so. Are you referring to a tariff structure ? Or a policy on fees ? Please clarify. > An important matter about what we are concern is the cost that most have the > domain name registration for educational and non-for-fit organizations. It > is important for me and my organization to know what is your policy related > to this organization. Many ccTLD's operate on a bona fide cost recovery basis. There is service to be performed for the Internet. But there are strong tendencies towards a split model, with a registry, performing general functions like WHOIS, name servers and possibly accounting and (multiple) registrars who directly interact with registrants. The latter may be for profit but are in competition with each other so the market should decide. The registrars share a common registry. So much to current practice and tendencies. It is difficult if not impossible to cover all aspects regarding a registry in one mail ;-). > Thanks very much for the attention that could receive this request. > Edgar Nzqez. Marcel -------- Logged at Wed Jul 15 15:26:10 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

TLD Policy
by guntis＠latnet.lv 15 Jul '98

15 Jul '98

Dear Edgar, In Latvia TLD .lv we have implemented a policy that all state funded organizations/government/institutions have the right to register one domain name for free. This is very clear principle and have virtually eliminated any conflicts about who should pay for DNS registration and who should not. More info on our policies ar www.nic.lv. Best regards, -- Guntis Barzdins, TLD .lv At 20:07 98.07.14. -0300, Juan Edgar N??ez+vFleg== wrote: >Hello! TLD administrators under RIPE > >I am the new TLD administrator for DO. And I am looking forward to implement >new policy about the cost that will have the Domain Name Registration under >our TLD. So I would like to know what are you doing about that and whish are >the main points that you are taking on mind to do so. > >An important matter about what we are concern is the cost that most have the >domain name registration for educational and non-for-fit organizations. It >is important for me and my organization to know what is your policy related >to this organization. > >Thanks very much for the attention that could receive this request. > >Edgar Nzqez. > > > -------- Logged at Wed Jul 15 20:00:31 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Singapore draft
by Dennis.Jennings＠ucd.ie 02 Jul '98

02 Jul '98

Niall, Please see the News section of the CENTR Web site for the document that is called the Singapore consensus. Note that section 9.4 was deleted in total. Please let people know about this document. More news later this afternoon from the ICANN Board. Dennis -------- Logged at Thu Mar 4 17:39:02 CET 1999 ---------

1 0

FW: Domain name and Net-governance info should be public
by JimFleming＠unety.net 30 Jun '98

30 Jun '98

---------- From: Declan McCullagh[SMTP:declan at well.com] Sent: Monday, June 29, 1998 11:37 AM To: politech at vorlon.mit.edu Subject: FC: Domain name and Net-governance info should be public [I agree that this information should be public. All of us have a stake in Internet governance. I hope all portions of this week's meeting will be open to the press. --Declan] ***** Subject: IFWP [Fwd: Conference Call Notes (fwd)] From: Einar Stefferud <stef at nma.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 15:14:25 -0700 I have obtained this though opaque channels, but I also feel that this kind of information belongs in public view, so I am pulbishing it for ORSC without permission. If anyone wishes to complain about this, the fact of the complaint, and who issues is will be very interesting data points. I suggest that the organizers of the July 1-2 meeting should themselves publish this information for open public review, and the fact that they have so far chosen not to do so is a mark against them which may in time damage the whole effort. As with secrecy in governments, such hiding of oganizing information can only breed rumors and diminish credibiliity of all participants. Best...\Stef ------- Forwarded Message Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 19:37:19 -0400 From: June Portch <admin at cix.org> To: roberts at educom.edu, burack at isoc.org, soneill at itaa.org, jenglund at itaa.org, MUncapher at itaa.org, briano at isa.net, jeff at isa.net, kawchuk at idirect.com, oportunidades at redynet.com.ar, montjoy at bbnplanet.com, jberman at cdt.org, djw at cdt.org, deb.howard at 2cowherd.net, jhhur at nuri.net, rhicks at clear.co.nz, laina at singnet.com.sg, jdd at vbc.net, sastre at anwalt.de, gidaa at perkinscoie.com, JohnW at Prince.com, akraft at association.org, rob at echelon.ca, exec at aop.org, andy at interactivehq.org, rob at echelon.ca, freedman at netaxs.com, charles.smith at ispc.org, bdooley at cix Cc: Haywood_Torrence at SMTP.NYNEX.COM, mberejka at microsoft.com, rogerc at us.ibm.com, cantrellj at mail.dnb.com, dont at netsol.com, mcade at att.com, Liz.Hogan at mci.com, mitchell at eni.net Subject: Conference Call Notes Broadening of Framework for White Paper Workshops Conference Call June 16, 1998 Participants: Andy Sernovitz AIM Laina Greene APIA Ron Kawchuk CAIP Rob Hall CAIP Mark McFadden CIX Barbara Dooley CIX June Portch CIX John Wood CSSA Mike Roberts Educom Jim Dixon EuroISPA Michael Schneider EuroISPA Andy Kraft AIP Marty Burack ISOC Don Heath ISOC Charles Smith ISP/C Sheila O'Neill ITAA Don Telage Network Solutions Scott Mitchell Epoch/CORE member Marilyn Cade ATT/PSWG Summary of Call [brackets are additional information by Barbara Dooley] The participants on the call agreed that a framework of regional meetings sponsored by associations representing diverse constituences (broadly speaking,academic/research, providers, users, Internet industry associations) would be appropriate to continue the private sector leadership called for in the White Paper. The principles of the sponsoring associations would be that the meetings would open to all interested stakeholders groups and parties a forum to work on the three primary areas left open in the White Paper: Organization of the New Corporation Dispute Resolution and gTLD Issues Security & Privacy Issues It was agreed that this must be perceived as an open process based on the White Paper and that Jon Postel, representing the current IANA and as a key participant in this process, should be encouraged to participate in all three meetings and might issue a statement supporting this framework of neutral fora. The first meeting with be held 1-2 July in the DC area--the GIAW meeting. The second will be held in Europe, with a preference for EuroISPA, CSSA and other European associations to work with ISOC/INET on that event to be held in Geneva. The third will be held in the Asia/Pacific region, a lead to be taken by APIA. It will be the responsibility of the organizers to ensure that there is an information flow and conduit regarding these meetings, to make publicly available summaries of the workshops, and to make sure that a least some representives from each region attend each event. If additional neutral legal/policy expertise is needed in context of the workshops, for example to support Dr. Frankel at the GIAW, it might be possible to ask the ILPF and APPLe (the Asia Pacific Policy and Legal Forum0 to help locate such moderators. It was agreed that all kinds of mailing lists will be used to facilitate discussion and continued work during and after the workshops. It was proposed that any association which agrees to these principles can become a sponsoring association and will be listed on the webpage(s). The GIAW website will link to European and A/P sites which will have information on those regional meetings. Those on the call agreed in principle to sponsor this framework and will be listed as such when the updated website appears [Thursday]. A Sponsoring Association can participate in the Steering Committee. The steering committee responsibilities are to make sure the events are organized, to draft and coordinate the media advisories, and to facilitate the information flow to the sponsoring associations and stakeholders. Because of the tight schedule for planning, steering committee members must commit doing the work, and supply a proxy with decision-making authority if the appointed rep is not available. The GIAW website is currently being hosted by CIX. The GIAW mailing lists are in the process of being transferred [Tuesday]. CIX has also hired an outside PR firm, Optimum, to answer media calls and be the spokesperson for the sponsors for the GIAW meeting [to be confirmed by Steering Committee]. Some companies and associations have expressed a willingness to contribute to the funding of this organization effort and this will be followed up on immediately. **************************************************************************** ****** Post-call developments Barbara has received written or verbal intention to participate in the Steering Committee from AIM, AIP, CAIP, CIX, Educom and EuroISPA. The first Steering Committee conference call will be scheduled for Thursday 12 noon EST,to give time for more associations, including those who want to participate but could not be on today's call, to join in[sorry Laina]. The call-in number will be sent out Wednesday. The purpose of that call would be to discuss the financing, prepare the elements of a media advisory, and discuss how to create a feedback process for creation of the agenda for the 1-2 July meeting. A draft of the media advisory could be prepared and sent to the sponsoring associations for comment. The steering commitee will incorporate the editorial suggestions for release Friday noon EST. Some thoughts on financing from Barbara: a suggestion would be to ask for a modest amount from the steering committee members and interested company/ad hoc group/coalition supporters, say $2000, with a goal to raise $30,000. ************************************************* June Portch Member Services Commercial Internet eXchange Association 1041 Sterling Road Suite 104A Herndon, VA 20170 Voice: 703.709.8200 Fax: 703.709.5249 ------- End of Forwarded Message -------------------------------------------------------------------------- POLITECH -- the moderated mailing list of politics and technology To subscribe: send a message to majordomo at vorlon.mit.edu with this text: subscribe politech More information is at http://www.well.com/~declan/politech/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- Logged at Wed Jul 15 02:07:40 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

The Postage Stamp Plan
by JimFleming＠unety.net 27 Jun '98

27 Jun '98

The Postage Stamp Plan is very simple: 1. Take the current 2-letter TLDs and move them to the postal authorities for the country or area the TLD supposedly covers. For the .IO TLD it might end up some where near the Indian Ocean. In the U.S. and Canada that will be "private" corporations. 2. Allow each of the 2-letter TLD authorities to select UP TO 6 additional generic TLDs much the way they create postage stamps. [As an aside, there is evidently an ELVIS stamp in the U.S. This shows that some creativity may be allowed.] 3. Have the 2-letter TLD "postel authority" contract to have the registry functions handled on an out-sourced basis to a variety of companies and government agencies. 4. Through rain, and snow and sleet...deliver the mail... For example: .US - U.S. Postal Service - subcontracted to ???? .COM - subcontracted to ???? .NET - subcontracted to ???? .ORG - subcontracted to ???? ISOC ??? .GOV - subcontracted to ???? .MIL - subcontracted to ???? DOD ??? .EDU - subcontracted to ???? .CH - Switzerland .INT - subcontracted to ???? .NOM - subcontracted to ??? CORE ??? .FIRM - subcontracted to ??? CORE ??? .SHOP - subcontracted to ??? CORE ??? .REC - subcontracted to ??? CORE ??? .INFO - subcontracted to ??? CORE ??? .CA - Canada .XXX - subcontracted to ??? .SEX - subcontracted to ??? .PER - subcontracted to ??? .??? - subcontracted to ??? .??? - subcontracted to ??? .??? - subcontracted to ??? <Over 240 additional 2-letter TLDs omitted> The U.S. Government's legacy Root Name Server Confederation then just has to declare that it only accepts "postage stamps" from Postel Authorities. Apparently, that Root Name Server Confederation will be run by the new IANA Inc. It is just one of many. Here is some info for an organization that might be able to help provide a neutral forum for resolving the details. @@@@@ http://postinfo.upu.org POST*Info is the interactive Web Site published by the UPU's Postal Technology Centre. POST*Info is aimed towards promoting postal technologies in general and the support of the UPU's Telematics Project in particular." @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ @@@@ http://postinfo.upu.org/PI_TC_Menu.htm "The objectives of the Telematics Cooperative are: to identify and fulfill the current and future postal aims and requirements in the field of information systems and electronic communications, particularly those involving Electronic Data Interchange (EDI) related products and services; to establish a common electronic infrastructure which matches the well established postal physical infrastructure; to implement systems which ensure secure information exchange, secure payments and secure deliveries between PPOs and with their customers; to implement operational and management systems which ensures rapid pick-up and delivery; to establish systems which will help PPOs become more competitive in the fields of Administration and Production and enable the development of value-added services related to basic postal products and services; to secure a stable and sufficient funding of Telematics Projects entrusted upon the International Bureau, and specifically its Postal Technology Center, in order to ensure the continuation of the deployment, maintenance, and support activities carried out in this field. The main aims of the Telematics Cooperative are: Establish strategies and instruments through which it intends to achieve its objectives; Ensure fair access to the UPU's products and services to all PPOs in general and to the Cooperative members in particular; Promote cooperation between member PPOs in order to allow them to provide their customers with a coherent set of integrated information services on a global basis; Involve member PPOs in the provision and support of Telematics products and services under the UPU's umbrella; Provide the highest quality service to its members and secure optimal organization at all times; and Help enhance the global image of the Post @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ @@@@ http://postinfo.upu.org/PI_TC_CMB.htm "The Cooperative Management Board (CMB) is the formal management structure designated to supervise the activities of the Telematics Cooperative established by the UPU to support its Telematics activities." @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ John Hurlen Norway Post Chairman, Cooperative Management Board E-Mail: john.hurlen at sentralledelsen.posten.no Christiane Herve La Poste, France Vice Chairman, Business Plans and Finance E-Mail: lapostedaei2 at magic.fr Shuji Obu Postal Bureau, Japan Vice Chairman, Mail Services E-Mail: s-obu at mpt.go.jp Dean Pope Canada Post Vice Chairman, Electronic Services E-Mail: dean.pope at mailposte.ca George Shipman United States Postal Service Vice Chairman, Financial Services E-Mail: gshipman at email.usps.gov Samuel M. Jabbour International Bureau of the UPU Head of Postal Technology Centre E-Mail: jabbour at ptc.upu.org @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ -------- Logged at Tue Jun 30 09:33:25 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Domains, names, extremism, and the law
by edd＠aic.net 23 Jun '98

23 Jun '98

I believe this article may be of interest to all of us... :-) Edgar Extremism and the Internet (EMAIN), Jenny Craven Centre for Research in Library and Information Management (CERLIM) University of Central Lancashire j.e.craven at uclan.ac.uk http://ltc.law.warwick.ac.uk/jilt/wip/98_1crav/default.htm -------- Logged at Mon Jun 29 13:15:13 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

No subject
by sam＠dfa.org.uk 22 Jun '98

22 Jun '98

1 0

Is IANA Setting NSI's Policies on Who Should Pay for Domain Names ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 22 Jun '98

22 Jun '98

In a recent discussion about the .AU domain in Australia, Robert Elz one of the administrators claimed that the IANA told ccTLD admins to ignore invoices from the InterNIC. How can the IANA (aka Jon Postel) be making the decision on who should pay an InterNIC invoice and who should not ? If the IANA tells people to ignore invoices that are sent to them does that make the debts disappear ? What does Network Solutions, Inc. do ? Does the IANA coordinate these changes with NSI ? Is this part of the reason that Jon Postel was listed as a sub-contractor to NSI on their InterNIC bid ? How does this impact the money that is supposed to go to the NSF (i.e. the U.S. Government) as part of the 30% fund ? Did the NSF approve that certain invoices could be "ignored" ? Is it true that many ISPs ignored paying invoices and nothing ever happened ? Did the IANA explicitly tell them to ignore the invoices, while other ISPs were not told this ? Was one group subsidizing the other ? Is this like parking tickets that disappear from city hall ? On Sunday, June 21, 1998 10:14 AM, Robert Elz[SMTP:kre at munnari.OZ.AU] wrote: @ @ | If your (Robert Elz) aren't getting billed, it does raise even further @ | questions. @ @No questions at all, the IANA explicitly told ccTLD admins that they should @ignore any requests for payment made by the InterNIC. They did send a few @(but never to me), but it was generally assumed to be some kind of accident. @ @kre @ Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com - 0:196 .MALL 1998 - The Year of the C+@ -------- Logged at Mon Jun 22 12:58:44 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

FW: White Paper follow up
by JimFleming＠unety.net 21 Jun '98

21 Jun '98

---------- From: laina at singnet.com.sg[SMTP:laina at singnet.com.sg] Sent: Sunday, June 21, 1998 7:21 AM To: apia-members at apia.org; apple at apnic.net; Tan Tin Wee; apnic-talk at apnic.net Subject: White Paper follow up Dear all, Please note that any AP associations which would like to be added to the Steering Committee of the initiave (see Press Release below) can do so. APIA has volunteered to act as facilitator (since we were the only AP association so far involved in the discussions) and would appreciate the involvement of others in the region. The aim of the meetings is to try and consolidate the many meetings that have been announced, including the one at INET'98 to ensure some consolidation and more importantly to ensure that as many interested parties as possible can attend and be kept informed. There is even discussion of having a fellowship fund to ensure that people who cannot afford it can also attend, and this is in an effort to ensure global participation. The Europe meeting will also reach out to the Middle East and Africa and the Asia Pacific one will hope to encourage Pacific island participation as well. The regional meetings are an attempt to reach out. The meetings are not meant to push any one agenda, but rather to solicit views of others on the White Paper and to gather views to see how we can move forward on creating this new not-for-profit entity. The meetings will invite current stakeholders including Dr Postel, etc and hopes to gather as wide base support and input as possible, We do hope to enlisten your views and support so if you have any suggestions for the regional meeting in AP, please e-mail them to me at laina at getit.org and please refer to the new International Forum on the White Paper website at www.ifwp.org. The details of the Asia meeting will be announced later on the APIA website as well as on the asiapacific.ifwp.org website (under construction), and we are targetting early August. Hope to have your support in these initiatives (please read the press release below) Regards, Laina Raveendran Greene Policy Advisor APIA ---------- News For Immediate Release Contact: Janis Langley, Optimum [phone: +1 (703) 847-0192 email: press at ifwp.org ] Internet Stakeholder Associations to Advance White Paper Process Associations Plan Coordinated International Forum Washington, DC, USA - June 19, 1998 - Responding to the U.S. Government White Paper on the Technical Management of Internet Names and Addresses, a broadly based coalition of Internet stakeholder associations is calling for an international forum to prepare for the transition from government to private management. The International Forum on the White Paper (IFWP) is an international initiative sponsored by a diverse group of associations representing numerous Internet stakeholder interests from around the world. The IFWP is sponsoring coordinated international meetings to discuss the issues of Internet technical administration of names and numbers left open in the "White Paper" and the transition to a new corporation for Internet technical administration. In a White Paper released June 5, the U.S. government announced its intention to relinquish control of the Internet to a private, non-profit organization by September 30, 2000. The new organization will be created from among the diverse parties that have a stake in how domain names, Internet numbers and other Internet identifiers for the Internet are managed. The IFWP consists of associations around the world representing diverse Internet interests. Its purpose is to provide an organizing framework for the coordinated international meetings. The preliminary work to ensure that the international meetings are coordinated is being undertaken by an international, volunteer steering committee of IFWP sponsors. The first regional IFWP meeting will be held on July 1-2, at the Hyatt Regency Reston, Reston, Virginia, USA. Chaired by Professor Tamar Frankel -- a world-renowned expert on incorporation -- of the Boston University School of Law -- the two-day event will seek to identify key issues, views and opinions on the areas left open by the White Paper to private sector development. - more - These issues include the formation of the private sector corporation for the technical administration of names and numbers; the development of a new domain name registry and dispute resolution system; and security and privacy issues associated with the Internet's technical infrastructure. Additional meetings are planned around the world during the summer in anticipation of the end of existing U.S. Government contracts that manage the current Internet name and number systems. Two other meetings are currently being planned, one in Europe in July and another in Asia in early August Further information about the International Forum on the White Paper, including a list of sponsoring associations, is available at http://www.ifwp.org. Press contact: Janis Langley, Optimum [phone: +1 (703) 847-0192 email: press at ifwp.org ] ____________________. Current IFWP Sponsoring Organizations (as of June 19, 1998): Association for Interactive Media [AIM] Association of Internet Professionals {AIP] Association of Online Professionals [AOP] Asia and Pacific Internet Association [APIA] Camara Argentina de Bases de Datos y Servicios en Linea [CABASE] Canadian Association of Internet Providers [CAIP] Commercial Internet eXchange [CIX] Computer Science and Services Association [CSSA] EDUCOM/EDUCAUSE European Internet Service Providers Association [EuroISPA] Internet Alliance [IA] Internet Law and Policy Forum [ILPF] The Internet Society [ISOC] Internet Service Providers' Consortium [ISP/C] Information Technology Association of America [ITAA] Society for College and University Planning [SCUP] US Council for International Business [USCIB] -0- -----------------End of Original Message----------------- ------------------------------------- Name: Laina Raveendran Greene E-mail: laina at singnet.com.sg Date: 21/06/98 Time: 12:21:03 This message was sent by Chameleon ------------------------------------- * APPLe: To unsubscribe, send "unsubscribe" to apple-request at apnic.net * -------- Logged at Mon Jun 22 04:52:55 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Cooperative Management Board (CMB)
by JimFleming＠unety.net 20 Jun '98

20 Jun '98

This seems like a good group to get involved in the discussions about new Top Level Domains which can be viewed like postage stamps. Hopefully, they will visit the following sites: http://www.iana.org http://www.giaw.org ...and people can visit their site... @@@@ http://postinfo.upu.org/PI_TC_CMB.htm "The Cooperative Management Board (CMB) is the formal management structure designated to supervise the activities of the Telematics Cooperative established by the UPU to support its Telematics activities." @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ John Hurlen Norway Post Chairman, Cooperative Management Board E-Mail: john.hurlen at sentralledelsen.posten.no Christiane Herve La Poste, France Vice Chairman, Business Plans and Finance E-Mail: lapostedaei2 at magic.fr Shuji Obu Postal Bureau, Japan Vice Chairman, Mail Services E-Mail: s-obu at mpt.go.jp Dean Pope Canada Post Vice Chairman, Electronic Services E-Mail: dean.pope at mailposte.ca George Shipman United States Postal Service Vice Chairman, Financial Services E-Mail: gshipman at email.usps.gov Samuel M. Jabbour International Bureau of the UPU Head of Postal Technology Centre E-Mail: jabbour at ptc.upu.org Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ -------- Logged at Sun Jun 21 06:54:56 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

3:77 - .AM TLD
by JimFleming＠unety.net 18 Jun '98

18 Jun '98

Jean-Christophe, It appears that these comments are really directed at the .AM TLD. With a subject line beginning with 3:77, we can get them circulated and filed in the G3 region. Jim Fleming ---------- From: William X. Walsh[SMTP:william at TJNS.TJ] Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 1998 11:15 AM To: DOMAIN-POLICY at LISTS.INTERNIC.NET Subject: Re: ?:? .FCN TLD Jim, Read this carefully. IPv8 has NOTHING to do with this list. Neither the IANA, or the Internic recognize that an IPv8 such as you are proposing exists, or is even in planning stages. So it cannot possibly be on topic for this list. IPv8 has NOTHING to do with the process at hand either. IPv8 is a community made up of people who have been frustrated at their failure to obtain Top Level Domain Space, and can't possibly find a way to work within the system. What I find particularly offensive is the attempt to lay claim to large chunks of namespace with no valid claim to that namespace. AURSC's memos on that IANA website show just how ridiculous a system like IPv8 can become. No where, and let me repeat that again for emphasis, NO WHERE does IANA indicate that they are accepting applications for new TLDs, or that they plan to accept applications for TLDs. Your efforts to push people into doing so is nothing short of an attempt by you to make it appear that your "community" has more support that it really does. Filing an application now provides NO protection, nor does it set ANY precedence for use. You attempts to create artificial conflicts and artificial "news reports" is nothign but a means for you to continue your spam about your IPv8 fantasy. You intentionally ask provoking questions so you have a soap box on which to talk about IPv8. Since IPv8 has NO official standing, nor any possible basis for being on topic for this list, and in the spirit of NetSol claiming that this list should police itself, I move that you show respect for those attempting REAL discourse, and CEASE your IPv8 spam/promotion on this list. I would welcome your participation in actual on topic issues that deal with the REAL internet, not your IPv8 dream. To NetSol, if you will not take action against disruptive behavior, what options will you give us, as list members, to police this list? You claim the list should police itself. Give us the tools to do so. If you cannot, or will not, do that, then you have no rational option except to do so yourself. And failure to do so could only be read as a tacit endorsement of their off topic posting, and you should change the charter of the list to make their postings on topic. Is this an IPv8 forum or not? Is this a forum that permits racial slurs to go by with no action? These are questions myself and other responsible list members are asking. You ask us to police ourselves. We have done so. The CLEAR consensus of a majority of list members is that these individuals are disruptive. Will you not even place them on notice? I for one am sick and tired of getting Jim's FlemSpam's on IPv8 every few minutes in my inbox. Yet I will not unsubscribe, since I feel this list is one of only two that provide a semi decent forum for the REAL issues facing the domain name industry. I have recently checked out your http://www.DOT.am site. I find many things on this site that are of questionable legality under disclosure laws in the United States. Do your customers get full disclosure of the non-existant status of IPv8? Do they understand that it carries NO official endorsements by any known policy making body who deals with Internet Standards? Do they get fully informed that IPv8 and the .am registry are really worth nothing if it wasn't for the fact that the .am registry permits you to resell their namespace? I also find it QUITE amusing in light of your comments about ccTLD's being used outside the Country of Origin. Can we say hypocritical comments Jim? Also, I find your attempt to make http://www.dot.am look like a "Co-operative Registry" amusing. I wonder how long it will last when a long conversation with iDomains reveals to them the same terms we are negotiating to process domain registrations in the .am registry, and how being indepedent of you would be of so much more value to them. Why do they need you, Jim? The REAL .AM registry accepts registrations from anyone, and at their listed prices. Why the need to even use your service, Jim? Or are you attempting to exploit the ignorance of the public for financial gain? Seems like the entire IPv8 system is nothing but your attempt to place yourself in control of some resource so that you can boost your own ego. I found rather amusing your "application" to become the Caribbean Regional Registry. What interests you in the IPv4 internet, Jim? Since you are so busy with IPv8 I can't possibly see how you could have the time to provide IPv4 registry service. Or is this another attempt for you to legitimize yourself in a system that refuses to recognize your IPv8? I guess you want to have your cake and eat it too. Too bad it doesn't work that way. Take IPv8 to a forum where it is on topic. And stop your disruptive and inflammatory behaviors. --William Date sent: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 09:31:24 -0500 Send reply to: Jim Fleming <JimFleming at UNETY.NET> From: Jim Fleming <JimFleming at UNETY.NET> Subject: ?:? .FCN TLD Originally to: "bob at wtv.net" <bob at wtv.net> To: DOMAIN-POLICY at LISTS.INTERNIC.NET > Bob, > > Can you give everyone a summary of who the TOP 8 people > in the world would be with respect to the .FCN TLD ? > > ?:? .FCN > 5 ____________________ > 3 ____________________ > 6 ____________________ > 1 - Bob Allisat - bob at wtv.net > 2 ____________________ > 7 ____________________ > 4 ____________________ > 8 ____________________ > > Also, > Do you plan to apply to be included in the Root > Name Servers controlled by the NEW IANA ? > > http://www.iana.org/comments-mail/maillist.html > > > > Jim Fleming > Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com > 1998 - The Year of the C+@ > IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM > > > -- > DOMAIN-POLICY administrivia should be sent to <listserv at lists.internic.net> > To unsubscribe send a message with only one line "SIGNOFF DOMAIN-POLICY" > For more help regarding Listserv commands send the one line "HELP" > -- William X. Walsh, Director, Network Operations TJ Network Services william at tjns.tj http://www.tjns.tj Domain Name Services at http://www.fastnames.tj Email Services coming soon! -- DOMAIN-POLICY administrivia should be sent to <listserv at lists.internic.net> To unsubscribe send a message with only one line "SIGNOFF DOMAIN-POLICY" For more help regarding Listserv commands send the one line "HELP" -------- Logged at Thu Jun 18 12:17:44 MET DST 1998 ---------

2 1

.MALL TLD Application
by JimFleming＠unety.net 16 Jun '98

16 Jun '98

0a. (N)ew (M)odify (D)elete....: New 0b. Auth Scheme................: 0c. Auth Info..................: 1. Comments...................: Application for Top Level Domain 2. Complete Domain Name.......: .MALL Organization Using Domain Name 3a. Organization Name..........: Unir Corporation 3b. Street Address.............: One Naperville Plaza 3c. City.......................: Naperville 3d. State......................: IL 3e. Postal Code................: 60563 3f. Country....................: USA Administrative Contact 4a. NIC Handle (if known)......: JF553 4b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: I 4c. Name (Last, First).........: Fleming, Jim 4d. Organization Name..........: Unir Corporation 4e. Street Address.............: One Naperville Plaza 4f. City.......................: Naperville 4g. State......................: IL 4h. Postal Code................: 60563 4i. Country....................: USA 4j. Phone Number...............: 630-505-5801 4k. Fax Number.................: 630-717-1072 4l. E-Mailbox..................: JimFleming at unir.com Technical Contact 5a. NIC Handle (if known)......: JF553 5b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: I 5c. Name (Last, First).........: Fleming, Jim 5d. Organization Name..........: UNETY Systems, Inc. 5e. Street Address.............: 184 Shuman Blvd. #100 5f. City.......................: Naperville 5g. State......................: IL 5h. Postal Code................: 60563 5i. Country....................: USA 5j. Phone Number...............: 630-306-0600 5k. Fax Number.................: 630-305-3277 5l. E-Mailbox..................: JimFleming at unety.net Billing Contact 6a. NIC Handle (if known)......: 6b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: I 6c. Name (Last, First).........: Cooney, Virginia 6d. Organization Name..........: Unir Corporation 6e. Street Address.............: One Naperville Plaza 6f. City.......................: Naperville 6g. State......................: IL 6h. Postal Code................: 60563 6i. Country....................: USA 6j. Phone Number...............: 630-505-5801 6k. Fax Number.................: 630-717-1072 6l. E-Mailbox..................: gcooney at unir.com Prime Name Server 7a. Primary Server Hostname....: NS.UNIR.COM 7b. Primary Server Netaddress..: 207.32.159.1 Secondary Name Server(s) 8a. Secondary Server Hostname..: NS.UNETY.NET 8b. Secondary Server Netaddress: 207.32.128.1 Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Wed Jun 17 11:06:31 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Imagine the IAB as a CEO and 15 Person Board
by JimFleming＠unety.net 16 Jun '98

16 Jun '98

Here is another way to look at the IAB and the situation that is developing after the unfortunate decision on the part of the U.S. Government to toss the DNS hot potatoe back to Jon Postel. The U.S. Government's White Paper calls for a CEO and a 15 person Board. Let's imagine that Jon Postel is the "CEO" and the other 15 members of the IAB are the Board. Let's also imagine that this has been the structure of the IANA Inc. for years and that fair and impartial decisions have been made about new TLDs and /8 allocations. NOW...imagine that a transition is taking place. Imagine that each stakeholder is required to line up behind one of the Board members to vote on two things: 1. The new replacement for that Board member 2. The selection of a new CEO Imagine that people lined up as follows...with some imaginary reasons shown in the parenthesis. Imagine that everyone has to fit somewhere under the 15 Board members. <http://www.isi.edu/iab/members.html> "Hypothetical CEO" - Jon Postel -- postel at isi.edu -- IANA -- RFC Editor 1. Brian Carpenter -- brian at hursley.ibm.com -- IAB Chair 2. Steve Bellovin -- smb at research.att.com 3. Jon Crowcroft -- J.Crowcroft at cs.ucl.ac.uk Jim Dixon - jdd at matthew.uk1.vbc.net United Kingdom 4. Steve Deering -- deering at cisco.com 5. Ned Freed -- Ned.Freed at innosoft.com 6. Tony Hain -- tonyhain at microsoft.com Chris Ambler - cambler at iodesign.com (Microsoft employee) Bill Gates and the Remainder of Microsoft 7. Tim Howes -- howes at netscape.com 8. Erik Huizer -- Erik.Huizer at sec.nl 9. Cyndi Jung -- cmj at 3Com.com 10. John Klensin -- klensin at mail1.reston.mci.net -- Liaison to the IESG Vinton Cerf - vcerf at mci.net (MCI) Don Heath - heath at isoc.org (ex-MCI) 11. Robert Moskowitz -- rgm at icsa.net 12. Charlie Perkins -- charles.perkins at sun.com Jeff Williams - jwkckid1 at IX.NETCOM.COM (Java Programmer) 13. Fred Baker -- fred at cisco.com -- IETF/IESG Chair Einar Stefferud - stef at nma.com (IETF) 14. Keith Moore -- "moore at cs.utk.edu -- Liaison from the IESG Craig Simon - cls at flywheel.com (PhD Student) 15. Abel Weinrib -- AWeinrib at ibeam.jf.intel.com -- IRTF Chair, IAB Executive Director OK....I hope you made it this far...given the entire world lined up behind the 15 Board members plus Jon Postel, how would you evolve the system ? I hope this encourages people to think about specific plans and not hypothetical, meta-physical, plans. Now is the time to get down to details... Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Tue Jun 16 11:02:13 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

An Open Discussion With the IAB ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 16 Jun '98

16 Jun '98

The statement below was recently released by the Internet Architecture Board (IAB). The members of the IAB are shown below and here: <http://www.isi.edu/iab/members.html> In my opinion, the best way to hold an open discussion about this announcement is with the IAB on the Internet. If these people are really interested in open discussions about Internet Governance they can easily post their views to the lists that seem to attract people from around the world. No one needs to fly to Washington, D.C. to participate in these discussions. The discussions can happen at any time. It is up to the IAB to enter these open discussions. To date, they have hardly participated. As more and more discussions open up and as people begin to look at alternative Internet architectures, one would think that the IAB members would be interested in helping to shape these discussions. It will be interesting to see if they participate in the growing, global Internet in open discussions with people other than themselves. They have the opportunity, it is sitting in front of them. Jim Fleming Brian Carpenter -- brian at hursley.ibm.com -- IAB Chair Steve Bellovin -- smb at research.att.com Jon Crowcroft -- J.Crowcroft at cs.ucl.ac.uk Steve Deering -- deering at cisco.com Ned Freed -- Ned.Freed at innosoft.com Tony Hain -- tonyhain at microsoft.com Tim Howes -- howes at netscape.com Erik Huizer -- Erik.Huizer at sec.nl Cyndi Jung -- cmj at 3Com.com John Klensin -- klensin at mail1.reston.mci.net -- Liaison to the IESG Robert Moskowitz -- rgm at icsa.net Charlie Perkins -- charles.perkins at sun.com EX OFFICIO Fred Baker -- fred at cisco.com -- IETF/IESG Chair Keith Moore -- "moore at cs.utk.edu -- Liaison from the IESG Abel Weinrib -- AWeinrib at ibeam.jf.intel.com -- IRTF Chair, IAB Executive Director Jon Postel -- postel at isi.edu -- IANA -- RFC Editor On Monday, June 15, 1998 7:31 AM, Kent Crispin[SMTP:kent at SONGBIRD.COM] wrote: @posted to the ietf list: @ @-----Forwarded message from Brian E Carpenter <brian at hursley.ibm.com>----- @Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 09:16:36 +0100 @From: Brian E Carpenter <brian at hursley.ibm.com> @Organization: IBM Internet Division @To: ietf at ietf.org @Subject: IAB statement on US Government White Paper @ @ @The Internet Architecture Board (IAB) has reviewed the US Government @White Paper at @http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/6_5_98dns.htm @and welcomes it, especially the emphasis on self-governance @for the Internet. In our view it is rather urgent to build @international consensus around the new IANA corporation, and @the IAB will strive to do so as quickly as possible. In particular, @the IAB believes that the new corporation must be built out @from the existing IANA function hosted by the Information Sciences @Institute of the University of Southern California under the @direction of Jon Postel. @ @The IAB is an oversight committee of the Internet Engineering Task @Force (IETF). For further details, please see the Web site @http://www.iab.org/iab . @ @ @ Brian Carpenter (IAB Chair) June 15, 1998 @ @-----End of forwarded message----- @ @-- @Kent Crispin, PAB Chair "No reason to get excited", @kent at songbird.com the thief he kindly spoke... @PGP fingerprint: B1 8B 72 ED 55 21 5E 44 61 F4 58 0F 72 10 65 55 @http://songbird.com/kent/pgp_key.html @ @ @-- @DOMAIN-POLICY administrivia should be sent to <listserv at lists.internic.net> @To unsubscribe send a message with only one line "SIGNOFF DOMAIN-POLICY" @For more help regarding Listserv commands send the one line "HELP" @ @ @ Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Tue Jun 16 06:06:59 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Is IANA.ORG the White Paper Organization ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 13 Jun '98

13 Jun '98

Does anyone know what the difference will be in IANA.ORG and IANA.COM ? Bill Manning attended the meetings held in the Asia Pacific region with Ira Magaziner. Apparently, he is "owner" of IANA.COM. As some people know, when I asked questions about the Asia/Pacific situation, the people in that region censored the communication. Jim Fleming @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA-DOM) c/o USC-ISI Suite 1001 4676 Admiralty Way Marina del Rey, CA 90292 Domain Name: IANA.ORG Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact: Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA) iana at iana.org (310) 822-1511 Billing Contact: Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA) iana at iana.org (310) 822-1511 Record last updated on 06-Apr-98. Record created on 05-Jun-95. Database last updated on 13-Jun-98 04:01:32 EDT. Domain servers in listed order: VENERA.ISI.EDU 128.9.0.32 128.9.176.32 NS.ISI.EDU 128.9.128.127 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Internet Assigned Numbers Authority (IANA3-DOM) 4676 Admiralty Way MDR, CA 90292 US Domain Name: IANA.COM Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact: Manning, Bill (WM110) bmanning at ISI.EDU 310-322-8102 Record last updated on 18-Dec-96. Record created on 29-Jul-96. Database last updated on 13-Jun-98 04:01:32 EDT. Domain servers in listed order: NS.ISI.EDU 128.9.128.127 ORB.ISI.EDU 128.9.160.66 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ -------- Logged at Sun Jun 14 01:07:33 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

IANA Applications for TLDs
by JimFleming＠unety.net 13 Jun '98

13 Jun '98

I suggest that ANY company serious about being a REGISTRY for a Top Level Domain send the following form to <comments at iana.org>. This will help to time-stamp people's intentions on the web site. http://www.iana.org/comments-mail/maillist.html 0a. (N)ew (M)odify (D)elete....: New 0b. Auth Scheme................: 0c. Auth Info..................: 1. Comments...................: Application for Top Level Domain 2. Complete Domain Name.......: Organization Using Domain Name 3a. Organization Name..........: 3b. Street Address.............: 3c. City.......................: 3d. State......................: 3e. Postal Code................: 3f. Country....................: Administrative Contact 4a. NIC Handle (if known)......: 4b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: 4c. Name (Last, First).........: 4d. Organization Name..........: 4e. Street Address.............: 4f. City.......................: 4g. State......................: 4h. Postal Code................: 4i. Country....................: 4j. Phone Number...............: 4k. Fax Number.................: 4l. E-Mailbox..................: Technical Contact 5a. NIC Handle (if known)......: 5b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: 5c. Name (Last, First).........: 5d. Organization Name..........: 5e. Street Address.............: 5f. City.......................: 5g. State......................: 5h. Postal Code................: 5i. Country....................: 5j. Phone Number...............: 5k. Fax Number.................: 5l. E-Mailbox..................: Billing Contact 6a. NIC Handle (if known)......: 6b. (I)ndividual (R)ole........: 6c. Name (Last, First).........: 6d. Organization Name..........: 6e. Street Address.............: 6f. City.......................: 6g. State......................: 6h. Postal Code................: 6i. Country....................: 6j. Phone Number...............: 6k. Fax Number.................: 6l. E-Mailbox..................: Prime Name Server 7a. Primary Server Hostname....: 7b. Primary Server Netaddress..: Secondary Name Server(s) 8a. Secondary Server Hostname..: 8b. Secondary Server Netaddress: Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Sat Jun 13 23:17:06 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Every Active Member Deserves A Paycheck!
by 197N08ul3＠1botl3e.ar 13 Jun '98

13 Jun '98

Every Active Member Deserves A Paycheck! No Sponsoring Required To Get A Paycheck! ***The True Network Marketers Dream.*** Simple And Unbelievably Lucrative! Click Here For More Information> http://www.gwc1.com/members/dv77/gwc1.htm To be removed - remove58 at hotmail.com or call 904-282-0945 -------- Logged at Mon Jun 15 15:04:21 MET DST 1998 ---------

1 0

Global Incorporation Alliance Workshop?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 12 Jun '98

12 Jun '98

On Friday, June 12, 1998 4:41 AM, Karl Auerbach[SMTP:karl at CaveBear.com] wrote: @ @> C. Launch the new IANA with a 15 person board appointed as follows: @ @> Karl Auerbach, attorney @ @Yeah, mea culpa. @ @http://www.cavebear.com/ and follow the links to me and to CaveBear. @ @Thanks for the nomination. @ @By-the-way, I do consider myself more of a techie with legal training @rather than an attorney with technical expertise: @ @I tend to spend most of my time designing real-time, near-broadcast @quality, IP multicast, audio/video systems for the Internet. (I was @employee #1 at Precept Software which was recently merged into Cisco.) @ @And I also help design, build, and operate the big show network for @Networld+Interop (It's the worlds largest mobile/trade-show network -- @talk about a place to play with all kinds of new gear in a big way!) At @the recent Las Vegas show I put together a multivendor group where we did @RSVP/QoS interoperability testing [one of the RSVP implementations was @mine.] @ @Plus I've put together what many consider to be the best network @troubleshooting tool, which I give away. [This was a result of one hard, @painful lesson on how to not run a business.] @ @(But I did get a "cum laude" on my law degree. ;-) [Wow, I bet that @sentence triggers a bunch of e-mail filters.] @ @ --karl-- @ Thanks for the reply. I guess this takes you out of the "running" on the newdom list. :-) Also, maybe you can help the other people in the GIAW movement to come up with 3 more people. Also, it may be difficult to get the other major groups to appoint 3 people. They seem to want to focus on name calling. C. Launch the new IANA with a 15 person board appointed as follows: 3 - http://www.iana.org and "newdom" discussions Rick Wesson Chris Ambler John Frangie Jay Fenello Ellen Rony Eugene Kashpureff Steve Heflin Dave Crocker Marc Hurst Jean-Christophe Praud 3 - http://www.gtld-mou.org and mail lists Here are the people that I feel are MOST responsible for the IAHC/CORE plan. Maybe all of them should be nominated to be an IANA Inc. Director. 1. Jon Postel - IANA/USC/ISI 2. Don Heath - ISOC 3. Dave Crocker - IMC 4. Robert Shaw - ITU 5. George Strawn - NSF 6. David Maher - McDonalds 7. John Gilmore - EFF 8. Vinton Cerf - MCI 9. Michael Dillon - Priori 10. Gordon Cook - Cook Report 11. Perry Metzger - NY 12. Bill Manning - USC/ISI 13. Scott Bradner - ISOC 14. Ken Crispin - LBL 15. Rick Wesson - SF/CA 3 - http://www.giaw.org meeting in July and open-rsc lists Tony Rutkowski Richard Sexton Prof. Tamar Frankel, Boston Univ. Law School Prof. Vic Khanna, Boston Univ. Law School Prof. Claire Hill, George Mason Univ. Law School David R. Johnson, Aspen Institute Einar Stefferud, NMA Associates Laina Raveendran Greene, attorney Karl Auerbach, attorney Prof. David Farber, U Penn Prof. A. Michael Froomkin, U. Miami School of Law Carl Oppedahl, attorney Dan Steinberg, attorney John R Mathiason, attorney Milton Mueller, attorney Craig Simon, researcher 3 - http://www.ripe.net dns & tld working groups @@@ http://www.ripe.net/meetings/ripe/ripe-30/attend.html ?? Antonio Marquez Rediris AT Christian Panigl VUCC/ACOnet AT Gerhard Winkler VUCC / ACOnet AT Herbert Schoefbaenker Council Systems AT Wilfried Woeber UniVie - ACOnet BE Igor Sportmans Belgacom BE Pascal Delmoitie BELNET BE Patrick De Groote Unisource Belgium BE Stefano Previdi cisco Systems CH Felix Kugler SWITCH CH Marcel Schneider SWITCH CH Roger Gottsponer SWITCH CH ivan communod digital CM Denis Akam INTELCAM CM Jean Ernest Bikoe INTELCAM CM Raphael Tientcheu INTELCAM CZ Ingrid Ledererova InWay, a.s. CZ Petr Kral InWay, a.s. DE Andrea Kolek Deutsche Telekom AG DE Andreas Schachtner eco e.V. DE Anton Zur Evolution Systems DE Bernhard Kroenung regio[.NET] GmbH DE Berthold Paffrath Deutsche Telekom AG DE Bettina Kauth DFN-NOC DE Carsten Schiefner TCP/IP GmbH - Contrib.Net DE Christian Braun DENIC DE Christoph Gaertner o.tel.o communications DE David Pratt VIAG Interkom DE Dhouha Houssi DENIC DE Gerd Dopjans o.tel.o communications GmbH & Co DE Gert Doering SpaceNet DE Greg Cipollone Twinwave GmbH DE Ingo Stampe mediaWays DE Jan Czmok IPF.NET Service Provider GmbH DE Joachim Schmitz America Online Inc DE Jonas Luster easynet DV GmbH DE Kai Siering IS Internet Services GmbH & Co DE Klaus Landefeld Nacamar Group PLC DE Ludger Bornhorst Deutsche Telekom DE Martin Sieler Fraunhofer IIS-A DE Michael Beckmann POP Point of Presence DE Michael Froelich ECRC Network Services GmbH DE Michael van Elst Xlink Internet Consulting GmbH DE Oliver Doll UUNET Deutschland GmbH DE Peter Juffernholz Teleglobe GmbH DE Ruediger Kladt IPF.NET DE Ruediger Volk Deutsche Telekom AG DE S. Petra Zeidler Xlink Internet Service GmbH DE Stefan Maly MultiNET Services DE Thomas Trede Nacamar DE Volkmar Juergens POP Point of Presence DE Wolfgang Tremmel Xlink DE Wolfram Becker ECRC Network Services GmbH DK Frode Greisen Ebone DK Morten Christensen Tele Danmark Internet DK Sean Doran Ebone A/S DK Torben Bajlum Tele Danmark ES Daniel Diaz RedIRIS ES Javier Gonzalez Telefonica Transmision de Datos ES Manuel Garcia Acceso Sistemas de Informacion, s.a. EU Ambrose Magee RIPE NCC EU Bettina Schroeder RIPE NCC EU Chris Fletcher RIPE NCC EU Daniel Karrenberg RIPE NCC EU Eamonn McGuinness RIPE NCC EU Fay Howard RIPE NCC EU Graca Carvalho Cisco Systems Europe EU Henk Uijterwaal RIPE NCC EU James Aldridge EUnet EU Joao Damas RIPE NCC EU John Crain RIPE NCC EU Lee Wilmot RIPE NCC EU Maldwyn Morris RIPE NCC EU Mandy Jonkers RIPE NCC EU Mirjam Kuehne RIPE NCC EU Monica Cortes RIPE NCC EU Naomi de Bruyn RIPE NCC EU Paula Caslav RIPE NCC EU Pepa Tejedor RIPE NCC EU Sabrina Waschke RIPE NCC FI Arttu Laine EUnet Finland Oy FI Jorma Mellin Telia Finland Ltd FI Juha Oinonen CSC/FUNET FI Juha Paananen Telia Finland Oy FI Kristian Rastas Sonera Corporation FI Marko Memonen CSC-Tieteellinen Laskenta Oy FI Patrik Andersin Clinet Oy FI Petteri Helin Clinet Oy FI Sami Koskinen Clinet Oy FI Vesa Ruokonen Telia Finland Oy FR Alexandre Provost Groupe Ecritel France FR Annie Renard AFNIC (NIC France) FR Arnaud Lejeune Graphnet FR Beatrice Faure Groupe Ecritel France FR Christophe Cachat CEGETEL ENTREPRISES FR Daniele Bovio America Online, Inc. FR Etienne Ruch Siris FR Francis Dupont GIE DYADE FR Lionel GARENNE CEGETEL Entreprises FR Marc PICHON CEGETEL Entreprises FR Michael Hallgren Graphnet FR Nelly Denise SIRIS FR Paul Rolland Oleane FR Sylvain Kouda Siris GB Asquith Bonaparte JIPS NOSC (ULCC) GB Duncan Rogerson TEN-34 NOC GB Kevin Hoadley JANET GB Richard Sloan UUNET UK GR Manolis Chatzakis ICS-FORTH GR HU Attila Nyari Westel900 GSM. Mobile Teleco. HU Balazs Martos Hungarnet HU Janos Zsako BankNet IE Mike Norris HEAnet IS Marius Olafsson INTIS IT Andrea Mattasoglio CILEA IT Antonio-Blasco Bonito University of Pisa IT Daniele Vannozzi CNR IT Gian Luca Mattu Telecom Italia SpA IT Stefano Suin University of Pisa IT Vittore Casarosa CNR - IAT LU Thierry Coutelier Entreprise des P&T NL Armand Verstappen Demon Internet NL Boudewijn Nederkoorn SURFnet NL Diederik van Diggelen AT&T-Unisource NL Erik Lohr IBM Global Services NL Erwin d' Hont Demon Internet NL Hans van Duijne AT&T-Unisource NL Hans van der Molen AT&T-Unisource NL John Martin TERENA NL Marian Kruydenhof Unisource Business Networks b.v. NL Rob Blokzijl RIPE/NIKHEF NL Ronald van der Pol SURFnet NL Thomas Telkamp AT&T-Unisource NL henk smit cisco systems NO Hans Petter Holen SOL System AS NO Havard Eidnes UNINETT/NORDUnet NO Hogne Solvoll Telenor Nextel NO Steinar Grotterod Telia Registry Norge NZ Patrick O'Brien Domainz -- The New Zealand Internet Registry Ltd PL Konrad Plich TP S.A. - CST PL Maciej Kozlowski NASK PL Miroslaw Luc Research and Academic Network in Poland PL Wojtek Malek TP S.A. - CST PL Wojtek Sylwestrzak ICM PT Armando Domingues FCCN PT Rui Azevedo Matos Telepac RU Andrew Romanov RIPN RU Maria Stepanova RIPN SE Anders Hedlund Telia AB SE Anders Honkamaa pi.se AB SE Andreas Haggander Telia Network Services SE Anna Skyllberg Telia AB SE Bjorn Carlsson EBONE inc SE Carl Hamacher Telenordia SE Carl Moberg Telia Network Services SE Catherine Exelby FCI Telecommunications Corporation SE David Kvarnberg pi.se AB SE Dennis Wennstrvm Telenordia SE Eden Akhavi FCI Telecommunications Corporation SE Eric Ostberg Telenordia AB SE Eva Froelich NIC-SE SE Fredrik Nyman SwipNet SE Fredrik Widell Global One SE Gabrielle Eklund pi.se AB SE Gunilla Malmqvist Telenordia AB SE Gunnar Lindberg Chalmers University of Technology SE Hakan Hansson Telia Network Services SE Hans Niklasson SwipNet SE Helen Dagerus SwipNET SE Jan Guldborg Ebone Inc. SE Jorgen Larsson Telia AB Sektor Datakom SE Klara Rank pi.se AB SE Kurt Erik Lindqvist EUnet Sverige AB SE Lotta Flyman Telia Network Services SE Madeleine Gustafsson Telenordia AB SE Magnus Ahltorp Aladdin SE Michael Skutnabba Telenordia AB SE Mikael Eriksson KTH/IT SE Nisse Steen SwipNet SE Ola Winberg FMV SE Ove Landberg Swedish Armed Forces SE Patric Ostman Global One SE Per Lundberg Telecom Finland AB, SONERA AB SE Per-Olof Haettner FMV SE Peter Lothberg Stupi AB SE Peter Nilsson Global One SE Pontus Ekman pi.se AB SE Ragnar Lvnn Telenordia SE Rikard Hoglund Telia Network Services SE Sofia Hymnelius Telia AB SE Tomas Ahlstrvm Telia Ab SE Tomi Kortelainen KTH/IT SE Uno Staver FMV SE stockman bernhard Telianet SI Avgust Jauk ARNES SI Barbara Povse Golob ARNES SK Lubos Elias SANET SK Marian Durkovic CVTSTU/SANET SK Miroslav Vallo TELENOR Slovakia UA Alexander Milutin INFOCOM UA Yuri Demchenko Global Ukraine JV UK Anthony Turner Netcom UK Ltd. UK Darren Byrne Demon Internet Ltd. UK Darren Taylor Demon Internet Ltd. UK Denesh Bhabuta Demon Internet Ltd. UK Dr William Black Nominet UK UK Elliott Atkins REDNET Limited UK Geoffrey Sisson Nominet UK UK Ivan Beveridge Demon Internet Ltd. UK Keith Mitchell LINX UK Michael Behringer DANTE UK Paul Thornton LINX UK Peter Emptage Cisco Systems UK Richard Almeida Internet Network Services UK Sam Critchley UUNET UK Stephen Burley UUNET UK Steve Foster Global High Street Ltd US Carl Malamud Internet Multicasting Service US Craig Labovitz Merit Network, Inc. US David Kessens ISI US Dawn Martin ARIN US Deibler Danielle L. DIGEX, Incorporated US Dorian Kim Verio US Ed Kern DIGEX US Jake Khuon Merit Network, Inc. US Kim Hubbard ARIN US Mark McFadden Commercial Internet eXchange US Randy Bush Verio, Inc. US Robert C. Noland III UUNET Technologies US Robert Hinden Nokia US Tom Spindler Merit Network, Inc. US rekhter yakov Sisco systems @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ 3 - APNIC & Australian DNS discussions dns at iia.net.au Jun Murai David Conrad Laina Raveendran Greene, attorney Adam Todd Robert Elz Geoff Huston Leni Mayo @@@@@@@@@@ My apologies for any misspelled names. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Sat Jun 13 02:23:01 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Door Number 1, 2, or 3 ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 12 Jun '98

12 Jun '98

On Thursday, June 11, 1998 7:14 PM, Craig Simon[SMTP:cls at flywheel.com] wrote: @I'm not sure I'll be able to afford to attend, but I was able to get @myself added to the participant list pretty easily, which I take as a @reasonably good indication that the GIAW is open. If I can get in then @I'm sure you others can. @ The number of casual observers to the domain name debates is clearly growing. There are now at least three directions that these people can head, plus several other forums and lists that have been around for years. 1. IANA (New) - http://www.iana.org 2. ITU/ISOC/IAHC/PAB/POC/CORE - http://www.gtld-mou.org 3. Network Solutions, Inc. - http://www.giaw.org I suggest that people get behind the people forming the new IANA (#1 above) and take the following steps: A. Join the recently re-opened "newdom" mailing list for an open discussion on how to bring the serious stakeholders together ONLINE, via the Internet. Send a "subscribe" message body to majordomo at ar.com. B. Help the current IANA "staff" incorporate as a non-profit company. C. Launch the new IANA with a 15 person board appointed as follows: 3 - http://www.iana.org and "newdom" discussions 3 - http://www.gtld-mou.org and mail lists 3 - http://www.giaw.org meeting in July and open-rsc lists 3 - http://www.ripe.net dns & tld working groups 3 - APNIC & Australian DNS discussions dns at iia.net.au D. Deploy a NEW robust collection of RFC 2010 Root Name Servers E. Delegate .US, .COM, .NET and .ORG to the legacy NSI servers F. Deploy THREE new TLDs from the CORE choices for Switzerland (.CH) G. Allow ALL other existing country code TLD registries to select 3 more TLDs H. Select a 16 person IANA Inc. Advisory Committee by Choosing 2 people from each of the IPv8 regions shown here: http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/130dftmail/unir.txt This proposal should be easy for people following #2 to adopt. In my opinion, it will be the shortest path to introducing new TLDs to the general public. The 80+ CORE Registrars should be able to compete in the OPEN market place against the people that are trying to organize #3 above, behind closed doors in Washington, D.C. In my opinion, those people should be asked to supply 3 board members to the new IANA Inc. which should be well on its way to incorporation by July 4, 1998. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Fri Jun 12 18:16:55 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Door Number 1, 2, or 3 ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 11 Jun '98

11 Jun '98

Casual observers to the Domain Name Debates might now conclude that there are three choices or paths to follow: 1. IANA (New) - http://www.iana.org 2. ITU/ISOC/IAHC/PAB/POC/CORE - http://www.gtld-mou.org 3. Network Solutions, Inc. - http://www.giaw.org I suggest that people get behind the people forming the new IANA (#1 above) and take the following steps: 1. Incorporate the IANA as a non-profit company 2. Deploy a NEW robust collection of Root Name Servers 3. Delegate .COM, .NET and .ORG to the legacy InterNIC servers 4. Deploy TWO new TLDs from the CORE choices for Switzerland (.CH) 5. Allow other existing country code TLD registries to select 2 more TLDs 6. Select a 16 person IANA Inc. Board of Directors by Choosing 2 people from each of the IPv8 regions shown here: http://www.ntia.doc.gov/ntiahome/domainname/130dftmail/unir.txt This proposal should be easy for people following #2 to adopt. In my opinion, it will be the shortest path to introducing new TLDs to the general public. The 80+ CORE Registrars should be able to compete in the OPEN market place against the people that are trying to organize #3 above, behind closed doors in Washington, D.C. Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.com 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Thu Jun 11 09:08:56 MET DST 1998 ---------

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Can countries select ANY code letters they desire ?
by JimFleming＠unety.net 09 Jun '98

09 Jun '98

"Can countries select ANY code letters they desire ? ...since, according to the NEW IANA, it is "not in the business of deciding...what code letters are appropriate for a particular country" @@@@@ http://www.iana.org/cctld.html "The codes IANA uses are two-letter codes from the ISO 3166 standard. IANA is not in the business of deciding what is and what is not a country, nor what code letters are appropriate for a particular country." @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://207.32.159.1 1998 - The Year of the C+@ IS Coordinator for the AM Radio Station Registry - http://www.DOT.AM -------- Logged at Tue Jun 9 14:00:23 MET DST 1998 ---------

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