- Ris-int - mailman.ripe.net

Re: URGENT Re: Heads up: Long AS-sets announced in the next few days
by Lorenzo Colitti 04 Mar '05

04 Mar '05

[ris in CC field changed to ris-int to avoid replies being ticketized. Also CCing my co-authors in Rome] Daniel Karrenberg wrote: > If there is resistance like that, even uninformed resistance, we > cannot push things like this. I agree. Obviously the NCC is the least appropriate entity to push anything in the face of the community, since its charter is to do what the community wants it to do. And since it will be AS12654 doing the announcements, the buck stops here. I do think that Henk's message lacked finesse though. This is not me being overenthusiastic, this is a serious research project from a group with a proven record in the field of network discovery and a history of providing useful services to the community. Of course you can debate whether it is a good idea or not; every new technique has its fair share of detractors. And we wouldn't have gone ahead with the experiments in the face of such resistance either. But writing this off with a simple "On this occasion, he became a bit overenthusiastic though" is a little demeaning of the group's work. Anyway, with that behind us: > I beleive you should compose a very well drafted message explaining exactly > > - what we are proposing to do > - what effects we expect > - why the effects people are concerned about will not occur > > and ask for comments. This message should be OKed by Henk and maybe it > would be good to have it signed by both Henk and Lorenzo. We should do > this relatively quickly but without loosing the "well drafted". I would be happy to do this if you think it stands a chance. The issue I fear is that people in favour or neutral to these experiments won't reply to the thread and only a (possibly small number of) more conservative and/or uninformed people will be quick to criticize and opt-out. How much detail do you think we need? Do you think that to convince people we need to describe all our algorithms (some of which we haven't even fully developed yet), or do you think a more general description would be enough? Of course we would still provide much more detail on the principles we want to use and how we are trying to accomplish it. Cheers, Lorenzo

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Re: [ris-int] Re: NCC#2005024029 query parameters missing from RIS cgi URLs
by Rene Wilhelm 03 Mar '05

03 Mar '05

> > indeed, a good and easy way to get the URL, but perhaps a few extra words > > that the copy should be done via browser's popup menu? > I have not introduced pop-up menus for the RIS, by now. I prefer to > leave it like that, later if we will get any feedback or questions > about it, then we could add pop up or more explanation either help > pages or the form itself. no, no, I was not talking about pop ups done by RIS website; only about the menu that appears when right clicking on a URL, the one where you can choose "copy link location". I thought of mentioning something like "copy ... using right mouse button" But then again, this is only my view; now that I know how to copy, it's fine with me. Maybe other users don't have problems and are already experienced in copying URLs this way? -- Rene

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Re: [ris-int] Re: NCC#2005024029 query parameters missing from RIS cgi URLs
by Rene Wilhelm 03 Mar '05

03 Mar '05

>> but _how_ do you copy the link from the bottom? the left mouse button >> just takes me to a new risearch-result.html page. Am I overlooking something? > I do not know how to copy from the bottom of the page, I do not think > here is a way to do .. > was talking to go "Copy the link" and click "the link" with left button > and choose "Copy link location" option and copy the URL. ah, but that's the *right* button for me! :) indeed, a good and easy way to get the URL, but perhaps a few extra words that the copy should be done via browser's popup menu? -- Rene

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Re: [ris-int] Re: NCC#2005024029 query parameters missing from RIS cgi URLs
by Rene Wilhelm 03 Mar '05

03 Mar '05

>> The links to IPv6 RIS DB queries from RISwhois work like a charm, >> even when cookies were still blocked :-) >> > Hm, I'm using another module WWW::Mechanize to run risearch for > riswhois. It looks it's doing something strange. isn't it that in the case of riswhois, the query is done by halfweg, so no need to set a cookie in user's browser? >> The risearch-result page includes the line "Copy the link ..." >> and when you point the mouse to it, you see first part of the URL >> in the bottom of netscape's window, but when you click on it, >> the query gets executed and you again get a risearch-result page. > With Firefox it looks ok, gives all the URL at the bottom. I thought > it would be more convenient for user just click left mouse button, > and copy the link if they like to get the URL. but _how_ do you copy the link from the bottom? the left mouse button just takes me to a new risearch-result.html page. Am I overlooking something? -- Rene

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Re: NCC#2005024029 query parameters missing from RIS cgi URLs
by Rene Wilhelm 03 Mar '05

03 Mar '05

Hi Arife, > I made those changes you asked for including RISwhois and Cookie check. > Please have a look and let me know if you would have any comments. The results in the case blocked cookies is short and to the point. perhaps the standard header and footer should be added to the page, but the message itself is clear, no confusion possible. The links to IPv6 RIS DB queries from RISwhois work like a charm, even when cookies were still blocked :-) As for the referencing URL, that's still a bit problematic. The risearch-result page includes the line "Copy the link ..." and when you point the mouse to it, you see first part of the URL in the bottom of netscape's window, but when you click on it, the query gets executed and you again get a risearch-result page. Persistent users can find the URL by checking the source of the page (so a big improvement already!), but perhaps it's a bit more user friendly if the "copy the link" part would take you to a page which lists the /risearch.do URL instead of executing it? -- Rene P.S. Don't forget to announce the new CGIs when you're finished; Some folk out there will be happy to see IPv6 queries to the RIS DB are now possible!

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Re: NCC#2005024029 query parameters missing from RIS cgi URLs
by RIPE SW Bugs 03 Mar '05

03 Mar '05

Hi Rene, I made those changes you asked for including RISwhois and Cookie check. Please have a look and let me know if you would have any comments. Arife Link for URL with args, cookie check and On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:10:36 +0100, Rene Wilhelm wrote: > Hi, > > The new CGIs on www.ris.ripe.net have one important thing missing: > they do not support entering parameters via the URL and they do > not report the entered parameters either. > > For example, something like > > http://www.ris.ripe.net/perl-risapp/risearch.html?net=192.228.79.201&prefty… > > no longer works, it just comes back with the default form. > > This makes it impossible to discuss RIS results via e-mail, something we > will need and have used in the past when reporting on routing incidents > (e.g. triggered by users' request to explain DNSMon or TTM observations). > In the absence of URLs with query params, it is also difficult for network > engineers to share RIS observations with their colleagues. > > So, could you have a look and fix the CGIs? might be as trivial as > adding a method="get" to the html code. > > Thanks, > > -- Rene > > P.S. and while you're at it, you might want to run your pages through > the validator at http://validator.w3.org/ Currently, risearch.html > is not valid XHTML 1.0 Transitional.

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[Fwd: Heads up: Long AS-sets announced in the next few days]
by Lorenzo Colitti 01 Mar '05

01 Mar '05

FYI: Here is a copy of the announcement I sent out to NANOG, the routing-wg, and ris-users warning them of impending long AS-sets. After discussion we felt that it was best to proceed with a little more caution. :-) Cheers, Lorenzo -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Heads up: Long AS-sets announced in the next few days Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 19:49:50 +0100 From: Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo(a)ripe.net> To: nanog(a)merit.edu, routing-wg(a)ripe.net, ris-users(a)ripe.net Hi, as announced to the RIPE routing working group mailing list [1] and elsewhere, over the next few days the Computer Networks research group at Roma Tre University, in collaboration with the RIPE NCC RIS project, will be performing experiments involving announcements with large AS-sets in the AS-path. We are doing this to test innovative network discovery methodologies we developed to allow ISPs to determine how their prefixes are seen by the rest of the Internet. The announcements will be for prefixes 84.205.73.0/24 and 84.205.89.0/24 and will originate in AS12654. We have been performing similar experiments over IPv6, in collaboration with the NAMEX internet exchange, since December 2004 with no ill effects; furthermore, our announcements are standard BGP, so conformant implementations should be able to process them, and very long AS-sets have already been observed in the past (e.g. [2], [3]). However, we want to be careful to avoid router bugs on legacy devices, old firmware versions and the like, so we are first sending out test announcements with progressively longer AS-sets. Should you encounter a problem with these advertisements, please let us know and we will withdraw them. The proposed timetable of the test announcements is as follows. 2005-03-04: 14:00 UTC: 10-element AS-set 14:30 UTC: withdrawal 16:00 UTC: 25-element AS-set 16:30 UTC: withdrawal and, if there are no problems: 2005-03-07: 14:00 UTC: 50-element AS-set 14:30 UTC: withdrawal 16:00 UTC: 100-element AS-set 16:30 UTC: withdrawal Note: For reference, the AS-sets already observed in [2] and [3] contained 123 and 124 ASes respectively. For questions/comments, please contact compunet(a)dia.uniroma3.it or lorenzo(a)ripe.net. Regards, Lorenzo Colitti On behalf of the Roma Tre Computer Networks Research group [1] http://www.ripe.net/ripe/maillists/archives/routing-wg/2005/msg00021.html [2] http://www.ripe.net/projects/ris/Talks/0101_RIPE38_AA/sld003.html [3] http://www.ripe.net/maillists/ncc-archives/ris-users/2002/msg00044.html -- --------------------------------------------------------- Lorenzo Colitti Ph.D student Computer Networks research group Roma Tre University colitti(a)dia.uniroma3.it +39-0655173215 ---------------------------------------------------------

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Announcement: Changes to RIS Routing Beacons
by James Aldridge 25 Feb '05

25 Feb '05

------- Blind-Carbon-Copy To: ris-users(a)ripe.net, ops(a)linx.net, sfinx(a)ml.renater.fr, tech-l(a)ams-ix.net, announce(a)nl-ix.net, tech-users(a)lists.gn-ix.nl, vixoper(a)vix.at, peer.tech(a)mix-it.net Reply-To: ris(a)ripe.net Subject: Announcement: Changes to RIS Routing Beacons From: James Aldridge <james(a)ripe.net> X-Organization: RIPE Network Coordination Centre X-Phone: +31 20 535 4444 X-Fax: +31 20 535 4445 Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:56:38 +0100 Sender: james(a)x34.ripe.net [Apologies for duplicate messages] The RIPE Routing Information Service has made some alterations to our BGP Routing Beacon announcements. The main changes (since 3 February 2005) are: * Beacon prefixes now come from a new, larger address range 84.205.64.0/19 (instead of 195.80.224.0/20); * We now announce an "anchor prefix" corresponding to each beacon; * For each beacon and anchor prefix there is a "pingable" target at the first address in the range (beaconNN.ris.ripe.net, anchorNN.ris.ripe.net). All prefixes announced by the RIS (AS12654) are listed in the AS12654:RS-RIS 'route-set' and individual 'route' objects in the RIPE Database and are described in more detail at http://www.ripe.net/projects/ris/docs/beaconlist.html RIS peers should set any maximum prefix limit to at least the number of entries listed in the route-set (although it is unlikely that any one RRC will ever advertise more than a small subset of these prefixes). We would also like our peers to treat these prefixes in the same way that they would a customer's prefix and announce them to their other peers and upstream providers. If you have any questions, please contact the RIS team at ris(a)ripe.net. Regards, The RIPE NCC RIS Team ------- End of Blind-Carbon-Copy

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Re: [NCC#2005024029] RIS CGIs are online
by Rene Wilhelm 25 Feb '05

25 Feb '05

Hi Arife, >> I also have a request: once the prefix cgi is returning v6 results >> as expected, could you modify the riswhois cgi to also put up >> a "Query RIS database" button for IPv6 queries? >> James did the first versions of the riswhois cgi, but I guess that after >> the restructuring this is now SED responsibility. > Yes, you're right. I put into ToDo list. > About ETA, I can not say something definite this week. I'm second line > support for RIPE DBM, and it's bit busy. Next week I will get back to you. OK, that's perfectly fine. > Those CGIs are implemented Mason and Perl. One CGI has more than one > components. Form, result, and errors are printed by seperate html/cgi > files. We can easily pass the ARGS from one to another, but the result > page is not the one which is executing CGIs. That means if you copy and > paste and send somebody the result page with arguments, it will not work. > Since the CGI that executes the code is different than the one that > produce the results. Because of that I do not think it's not so useful > to have the ARGs in URL. > When I had a chat with Kevin about it, he suggested to add a link somewhere > on the page giving the URL. I do not know what you think about that. If > you want we can go for that. The most important thing is that by exchanging URLs people can point each other to results of a specific RIS query. Usually, you would go to the top of the browser and copy the URL there, but if that's not possible a link on the results page, something like "The URL for this query is $url" would work too. BTW, nice to see the query form is repeated on the results page! -- Rene

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RIS meeting agenda for Monday
by Arife Vural 25 Feb '05

25 Feb '05

Hi guys, Does anybody have any agenda item for Monday? I do not have any particular agenda item other than RRC13. For RRC13, maybe Gerard will give us short update by e-mail. Arife

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