Hello all, Can someone post the LED status and its meaning of the RIPE probes? Some probes take forever to register and we keep power cycling them interrupting I don't know what. Regards Durga Prasad Datasoft Comnet Pvt. Ltd. Cisco Premier Certified Partner VMware Enterprise Partner ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Find more about us at <http://www.datasoftcomnet.com> www.datasoftcomnet.com Datasoft Comnet Pvt. Ltd. 48-12-14, Flat Nos. 103 & 104, Vanitha Residency, Janakirama Street. (Old City Cable Lane) Srinagar, Visakhapatnam Pin. 530016. Ph. 2726942, 2525225. Mobile: 9849111010. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Branches: Mumbai, Hyderabad <https://www.linkedin.com/company/datasoft-comnet-private-limited> https://www.linkedin.com/company/datasoft-comnet-private-limited
On 25 Dec 2015, at 13:22, DurgaPrasad - DatasoftComnet <dp@datasoftcomnet.com> wrote:
Hello all, Can someone post the LED status and its meaning of the RIPE probes?
do you mean : https://atlas.ripe.net/about/faq/#what-do-the-lights-on-the-side-of-the-prob.... ?
Some probes take forever to register and we keep power cycling them interrupting I don’t know what.
many things may affect probe from registering. there's enough detail here to make an intelligent guess. i would probably start with : * not randomly power cycling them * checking if the dhcp process assigns them an ip address properly * checking to see if you are providing them with enough power * looking for ip filters ... beyond that, the atlas@ team have been very helpful and can probably suggest more things for you to check. --n.
Now that is something useful to start. Still the blink for network activity and more discrete assignment of LED's is something I look for :) Thank you. Regards, M. Tajbakhsh Lecturer, Advisor, On Fri, 12/25/2015 09:25 AM, Nishal Goburdhan <nishal@controlfreak.co.za> wrote:
do you mean : https://atlas.ripe.net/about/faq/#what-do-the-lights-on-the-side-of-the-prob.... ?
As a side note to reinforce random unplugging of the probes, I have done so with my first non-Ambassador probe and managed to brick it. The general advice I give when handing out is simply to leave the probes for an extended period of time and be patient. For the power concern, we are usually lucky enough for participants to have USB ports on their home routers which works well. On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 at 8:11 AM M. Tajbakhsh <tajbakhsh@shirazu.ac.ir> wrote:
Now that is something useful to start. Still the blink for network activity and more discrete assignment of LED's is something I look for :)
Thank you.
Regards, M. Tajbakhsh
Lecturer, Advisor,
On Fri, 12/25/2015 09:25 AM, Nishal Goburdhan <nishal@controlfreak.co.za> wrote:
do you mean :
https://atlas.ripe.net/about/faq/#what-do-the-lights-on-the-side-of-the-prob.... ?
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Well, . But the situation is a bit different here in Iran. We're going through different changes in economy and energy consumption. Aside from bandwidth costs, people are advised to keep their unused electronics off. I have to be picky to find those who are mostly connected and do not care much about leaving their routers on all the time. Yet, the use of USB host routers for network sharing is not a widespread option, and people prefer to do have storage installed on their computers and go for an average/minimum featured router, if not mobile services. Believe me or not, I am in a lab which is literally a 2-decade museum of networking history, yet I had difficulties to find a permanently free USB port among the devices. Thanks for your kind attention, M. Tajbakhsh Lecturer, Advisor, Network & Security Expert, On Fri, 12/25/2015 10:23 AM, Denys Stroebel <denyss@faircape.co.za> wrote:
As a side note to reinforce random unplugging of the probes, I have done so with my first non-Ambassador probe and managed to brick it. The general advice I give when handing out is simply to leave the probes for an extended period of time and be patient.
Hello, Instead of a free USB port, you can also plug the cable in a converter USB to power. http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-UK-EU-Plug-Wall-Car-Charger-Adapter-5V-2A-Dual-US... Kind regards, Roderick On Dec 25, 2015, at 12:13 AM, M. Tajbakhsh <tajbakhsh@shirazu.ac.ir> wrote:
Well, .
But the situation is a bit different here in Iran. We're going through different changes in economy and energy consumption. Aside from bandwidth costs, people are advised to keep their unused electronics off.
I have to be picky to find those who are mostly connected and do not care much about leaving their routers on all the time. Yet, the use of USB host routers for network sharing is not a widespread option, and people prefer to do have storage installed on their computers and go for an average/minimum featured router, if not mobile services.
Believe me or not, I am in a lab which is literally a 2-decade museum of networking history, yet I had difficulties to find a permanently free USB port among the devices.
Thanks for your kind attention, M. Tajbakhsh
Lecturer, Advisor, Network & Security Expert,
On Fri, 12/25/2015 10:23 AM, Denys Stroebel <denyss@faircape.co.za> wrote: As a side note to reinforce random unplugging of the probes, I have done so with my first non-Ambassador probe and managed to brick it. The general advice I give when handing out is simply to leave the probes for an extended period of time and be patient. _______________________________________________ RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors mailing list RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors@ripe.net https://www.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ripe-atlas-ambassadors
Dear Roderick, That was a really sweet reply! Gave me some good moments. I am both a network zealot and an engineer. I believe I can do many things (including hardware hacks & surgery) to bring my probe into life. :) I was writing on behalf of my probe hosts. I doubt e-bay delivers to Iran. Thanks for your comment and the useful link anyways. Keep in touch. M. Tajbakhsh Lecturer, Advisor, Network & Security Expert On Fri, 12/25/2015 11:56 AM, Roderick <roderick.fanou@imdea.org> wrote:
Instead of a free USB port, you can also plug the cable in a converter USB to power. http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-UK-EU-Plug-Wall-Car-Charger-Adapter-5V-2A-Dual-US...
On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 12:24:24 +0330 "M. Tajbakhsh" wrote:
I was writing on behalf of my probe hosts. I doubt e-bay delivers to Iran.
My last set of handouts fortunately did have the power supplies included. While I understand why RIPE would remove the power supplies - weight and volume - as someone who has muled probes a few times on his trips I prefer to have the power supplies included so it is a set that is known to be working well, instead of some of the supplies you'd find on the street. (I actually had an "asia-special" power supply explode in the AfNOG-NOC a few years ago. The explosion fortunately ejected the smoldering remains from the power socket, leaving just the charger power pins in the socket. The charger did not have a fuse but had very thin wires that acted as fuse; the wall socket fuse did not pop. But I can tell you that such an explosion just 3 meter away definitely does wake you up!. Anyway...) At the AIS meeting in Tunis there were probes available with and without power supply. The ones with supply were definitely preferred by the to-be-host, and I understand why. Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared, making the inclusion of the supplies an ambassador option? I'm perfectly happy to take the additional weight/volume hit, but I'd understand if not everyone can do this. This does leave the problem that the power supply and micro-USB cable can also be used to charge mobiles, which means that the probe would be disconnected after all. One just can't win.. Season's greetings to all, Geert Jan
Dear Geert, Your point reminds me of environmental concerns of all of us. I am sure power supplies are not required in all locations and we should be taking care of the situation. For that I personally interview the hosts if they can or cannot find some power source for the piece. So your suggestion on power supplies being optional is valuable. So is mentioning the risk that they maybe used for other tasks. May I suggest half of the probes to have poewr supplies, only on the ambassador/host's request? PS, yea the power supplies are not under embargo, yet we have painstaking deliveries which take too long as well. I myself had to pay to release my free(!) shipment from the post office after a weeks of walking through this and that office :( I would have started my mission weeks earlier otherwise. I appreciate the hard work you guys doing out there and I hope we can make internet a better community. Cheers, M. Tajbakhsh Lecturer, Advisor, Network & Security Expert
Geert Jan de Groot wrote:
Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared
What plug fitting, though?
USB type A is probably the most portable micro-power supply format in existence and locally compatible adapters are easily available in almost all countries in the world. Requesting that the RIPE NCC provide PSUs is turning a minor quibble on the part of Atlas users into a major stocking and expense headache for the RIPE NCC. Also, most switches, routers and home CPEs have USB type A sockets in them, which are ideal for powering probes. Personally I've never connected up a probe on its own dedicated power supply. Nick
On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 12:18:41 +0000 Nick Hilliard wrote:
What plug fitting, though?
In my experience, not a problem. At least my experiences in Africa have learned that many places mix different plug standards anyway. Also, the round pins of the power supply do fit in British square-pin sockets; many friends are very fast with this and don't even need a pen (which I still need) to defeat the "safety shield" British sockets have, to plug in a round-pin adapter.
Requesting that the RIPE NCC provide PSUs is turning a minor quibble on the part of Atlas users into a major stocking and expense headache for the RIPE NCC.
All I'd be asking is that for probes I'd ambassador, to have the option of having the power supply that it came with, be included. While USB power supplies are available on the street, quality varies and the whole discussion started with poor-quality power supplies causing trouble for probes.. Geert Jan
Hopefully you're not advising people to plug EU-style plugs in UK-style sockets. And even more hopefully you wouldn't as an ambassador for the RIPE Atlas program suggest such an act? Using an EU-plug in the UK-style socket without a proper converter/adapter is illegal... 2015-12-25 15:00 GMT+01:00 Geert Jan de Groot <GeertJan.deGroot@xs4all.nl>:
On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 12:18:41 +0000 Nick Hilliard wrote:
What plug fitting, though?
In my experience, not a problem. At least my experiences in Africa have learned that many places mix different plug standards anyway. Also, the round pins of the power supply do fit in British square-pin sockets; many friends are very fast with this and don't even need a pen (which I still need) to defeat the "safety shield" British sockets have, to plug in a round-pin adapter.
Requesting that the RIPE NCC provide PSUs is turning a minor quibble on the part of Atlas users into a major stocking and expense headache for the RIPE NCC.
All I'd be asking is that for probes I'd ambassador, to have the option of having the power supply that it came with, be included.
While USB power supplies are available on the street, quality varies and the whole discussion started with poor-quality power supplies causing trouble for probes..
Geert Jan
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On 25 December 2015 at 14:30, Johan Bogg <johan@bogg.nu> wrote:
Hopefully you're not advising people to plug EU-style plugs in UK-style sockets. And even more hopefully you wouldn't as an ambassador for the RIPE Atlas program suggest such an act? Using an EU-plug in the UK-style socket without a proper converter/adapter is illegal...
Being in the UK, I generally don't ask for PSUs to be supplied with my probes. If the NCC have shipped me power supplies which usually have a Type C "Europlug" pinout, I don't distribute them with probes at a UK meeting.
See inline On Fri, Dec 25, 2015 at 2:18 PM, Nick Hilliard <nick@netability.ie> wrote:
Geert Jan de Groot wrote:
Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared
What plug fitting, though?
If you look at this list: http://www.worldstandards.eu/electricity/plugs-and-sockets/ which is a more practical resource, you will see that many sockets are compatible with plug type C. in fact, only the following plugs needs to be provided: A, C, D, G, I, M. perhaps in your country it's not a problem, but you really need to take a world view if you want to have world-view coverage of probes. more on that below.
USB type A is probably the most portable micro-power supply format in existence and locally compatible adapters are easily available in almost all countries in the world. Requesting that the RIPE NCC provide PSUs is turning a minor quibble on the part of Atlas users into a major stocking and expense headache for the RIPE NCC.
I disagree - considering the already large expense and stocking of probes, adding PSUs when bought in bulk should not be a major increase and will help get more coverage in some remote places that need it. this in return may well be worth some increase of system abuse. at the very least this should be strongly considered in countries which suffer from a sub-par probe-to-eyeball ratio.
Also, most switches, routers and home CPEs have USB type A sockets in them, which are ideal for powering probes. Personally I've never connected up a probe on its own dedicated power supply.
This is exactly where the problem starts - you inferring from your own personal experiences and casting it unto others. so let me entertain you about this: I live in a modern OECD country but there is a duopoly on internet infrastructure (split from ISPs), and 3 major consumer ISPs. The selection of routers or STB-router combos you will find at homes tends be relatively uniform. as it happens the cable company routers either lack the USB ports or have them unpowered. I would wager this situation can be even worse in other countries where there is an even tighter hold on the market - so if ambassadors ask for it, I would at the very least listen to their concerns and not dismiss them. here's a good (and related) read: http://sietch-tabr.tumblr.com/post/126738515322/installing-atlas-probe-in-mo... can you guess the number of active probes in mongolia right now? 4 disconnected and 1 abandoned probe.
Nick
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Thanks Gil for your insight. I live in high-multi-provider country (Ukraine) and only distributed probes to ISP employees and like - and yet some probes left unpowered. As a geek I always have more hardware than I need, for for others it is not always a case. For example, I don't know electrical power guidance for probe power supply - is 1A ok? Sticking it to random 700 mA phone power supply may not be a good idea. So, either a list of compatibles supplies, or even available at cost to ambassador is better (if that cost would be then split between each host.) Of course we can ask RIPE NCC to stock supplies but I wonder if supply chain management and shipping is their strong suit. -- dk@
On 25 груд. 2015, at 22:48, Gil Bahat <gil@magisto.com> wrote:
See inline
On Fri, Dec 25, 2015 at 2:18 PM, Nick Hilliard <nick@netability.ie> wrote: Geert Jan de Groot wrote:
Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared
What plug fitting, though?
If you look at this list: http://www.worldstandards.eu/electricity/plugs-and-sockets/ which is a more practical resource, you will see that many sockets are compatible with plug type C. in fact, only the following plugs needs to be provided: A, C, D, G, I, M.
perhaps in your country it's not a problem, but you really need to take a world view if you want to have world-view coverage of probes. more on that below.
USB type A is probably the most portable micro-power supply format in existence and locally compatible adapters are easily available in almost all countries in the world. Requesting that the RIPE NCC provide PSUs is turning a minor quibble on the part of Atlas users into a major stocking and expense headache for the RIPE NCC.
I disagree - considering the already large expense and stocking of probes, adding PSUs when bought in bulk should not be a major increase and will help get more coverage in some remote places that need it. this in return may well be worth some increase of system abuse. at the very least this should be strongly considered in countries which suffer from a sub-par probe-to-eyeball ratio.
Also, most switches, routers and home CPEs have USB type A sockets in them, which are ideal for powering probes. Personally I've never connected up a probe on its own dedicated power supply.
This is exactly where the problem starts - you inferring from your own personal experiences and casting it unto others. so let me entertain you about this: I live in a modern OECD country but there is a duopoly on internet infrastructure (split from ISPs), and 3 major consumer ISPs. The selection of routers or STB-router combos you will find at homes tends be relatively uniform. as it happens the cable company routers either lack the USB ports or have them unpowered. I would wager this situation can be even worse in other countries where there is an even tighter hold on the market - so if ambassadors ask for it, I would at the very least listen to their concerns and not dismiss them.
here's a good (and related) read: http://sietch-tabr.tumblr.com/post/126738515322/installing-atlas-probe-in-mo... can you guess the number of active probes in mongolia right now? 4 disconnected and 1 abandoned probe.
Nick
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Dimitry
On 27 Dec 2015, at 04:30, Dmitry Kohmanyuk <dk@hostmaster.ua> wrote:
Of course we can ask RIPE NCC to stock supplies but I wonder if supply chain management and shipping is their strong suit.
The NCC has already outsourced this to a fulfilment house. Last box of probes I received came with EU power supplies but I am mostly in the UK/USA so they have to be removed before I distribute them. The weight of the PSUs is an issue when taking a large number to a meeting, it can make the difference between checking ( and paying for ) a bag or going hand luggage only. Cheers f
I have been purchasing power supplies for all of the RIPE Atlas nodes I have distributed in the Pacific Islands. I find that if I do not, the probes will not be installed or powered. For the last month I have had four probes stuck in Fiji Customs because of the power supplies I purchased in New Zealand and included in the shipment. Fiji Customs has assessed them for taxes as they're commercial, off the shelf items that could be re-sold. I am not permitted to directly pay the tax and my recipient was not expecting to pay around $50 USD for their probes. My vote is for including power supplies with (or inside) future probes. Exchangeable plugs are a common thing these days. -JB On 25 December 2015 at 23:50, Geert Jan de Groot <GeertJan.deGroot@xs4all.nl
wrote:
On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 12:24:24 +0330 "M. Tajbakhsh" wrote:
I was writing on behalf of my probe hosts. I doubt e-bay delivers to Iran.
My last set of handouts fortunately did have the power supplies included. While I understand why RIPE would remove the power supplies - weight and volume - as someone who has muled probes a few times on his trips I prefer to have the power supplies included so it is a set that is known to be working well, instead of some of the supplies you'd find on the street.
(I actually had an "asia-special" power supply explode in the AfNOG-NOC a few years ago. The explosion fortunately ejected the smoldering remains from the power socket, leaving just the charger power pins in the socket. The charger did not have a fuse but had very thin wires that acted as fuse; the wall socket fuse did not pop. But I can tell you that such an explosion just 3 meter away definitely does wake you up!. Anyway...)
At the AIS meeting in Tunis there were probes available with and without power supply. The ones with supply were definitely preferred by the to-be-host, and I understand why.
Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared, making the inclusion of the supplies an ambassador option? I'm perfectly happy to take the additional weight/volume hit, but I'd understand if not everyone can do this.
This does leave the problem that the power supply and micro-USB cable can also be used to charge mobiles, which means that the probe would be disconnected after all. One just can't win..
Season's greetings to all,
Geert Jan
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Fascinating reading the complexity of deploying RIPE Probes in some parts of the world. Looks like the "one size fits all" approach that works well in some parts, needs some more nuanced options around IP addresses, power supplies etc. Maybe the RIPE NCC should consider some special deployment options for the probes, which although at a higher cost, would enable measurement at the extreme edge of the internet and thus the "value" of the measurements obtained are quite valuable compared to, say, "just another" measurement in the USA where I live. Is it worth having a discussion at the meeting in Copenhagen about the trade offs here? MMC On Sun, Dec 27, 2015 at 3:07 PM, Jonathan Brewer <jon.brewer@gmail.com> wrote:
I have been purchasing power supplies for all of the RIPE Atlas nodes I have distributed in the Pacific Islands. I find that if I do not, the probes will not be installed or powered.
For the last month I have had four probes stuck in Fiji Customs because of the power supplies I purchased in New Zealand and included in the shipment. Fiji Customs has assessed them for taxes as they're commercial, off the shelf items that could be re-sold. I am not permitted to directly pay the tax and my recipient was not expecting to pay around $50 USD for their probes.
My vote is for including power supplies with (or inside) future probes. Exchangeable plugs are a common thing these days.
-JB
On 25 December 2015 at 23:50, Geert Jan de Groot < GeertJan.deGroot@xs4all.nl> wrote:
On Fri, 25 Dec 2015 12:24:24 +0330 "M. Tajbakhsh" wrote:
I was writing on behalf of my probe hosts. I doubt e-bay delivers to Iran.
My last set of handouts fortunately did have the power supplies included. While I understand why RIPE would remove the power supplies - weight and volume - as someone who has muled probes a few times on his trips I prefer to have the power supplies included so it is a set that is known to be working well, instead of some of the supplies you'd find on the street.
(I actually had an "asia-special" power supply explode in the AfNOG-NOC a few years ago. The explosion fortunately ejected the smoldering remains from the power socket, leaving just the charger power pins in the socket. The charger did not have a fuse but had very thin wires that acted as fuse; the wall socket fuse did not pop. But I can tell you that such an explosion just 3 meter away definitely does wake you up!. Anyway...)
At the AIS meeting in Tunis there were probes available with and without power supply. The ones with supply were definitely preferred by the to-be-host, and I understand why.
Perhaps we can ask RIPE whether or not to include the supplies when a set of ambassador-probes is prepared, making the inclusion of the supplies an ambassador option? I'm perfectly happy to take the additional weight/volume hit, but I'd understand if not everyone can do this.
This does leave the problem that the power supply and micro-USB cable can also be used to charge mobiles, which means that the probe would be disconnected after all. One just can't win..
Season's greetings to all,
Geert Jan
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 matches my experience with power supplies. The ones i have given without power supplies don't tend to get powered up for a long time. I got a bunch of USB power supplies, with different plugs, from 'Sim Lim' (electronics market in Singapore) to hand out with the probes. they are all sold as phone chargers. This was more effective - but then with every country in Asia with different plugs, had to amass all sorts of plug. Thankfully, they sell every types in Singapore. :) It may be worthwhile to ask Ambassadors if they need power supplies to go with the probes, and of what type. But if the choice is to just send the Euro plugs with the probes, then I think it's a waste. - -gaurab -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2 iEYEARECAAYFAlaCxQEACgkQSo7fU26F3X0G8ACcDoE2hJAp2AxUxB0i3Z0vRlWy fewAoJvvFI9rjJzY8ahaJ7YHSGAbe3Ff =RszL -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Here in Nigeria facing Same issues wih power and some To my surprise thinking the probe could be a means of security breach, but I have acquired some USB chargers and will add them to my distribution, thank God we import every type of electronic "Junk" I could find all sorts of plugs. Bashir Yusuf CTO- VP Operations First Wave Networks Suite 22, 1st Avenue Gwarimpa, Abuja, Nigeria +2347031986969 www.firstwave.ng On 29 Dec 2015 18:38, Gaurab Raj Upadhaya <gaurab@lahai.com> wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
matches my experience with power supplies. The ones i have given without power supplies don't tend to get powered up for a long time.
I got a bunch of USB power supplies, with different plugs, from 'Sim Lim' (electronics market in Singapore) to hand out with the probes. they are all sold as phone chargers. This was more effective - but then with every country in Asia with different plugs, had to amass all sorts of plug. Thankfully, they sell every types in Singapore. :)
It may be worthwhile to ask Ambassadors if they need power supplies to go with the probes, and of what type. But if the choice is to just send the Euro plugs with the probes, then I think it's a waste.
- -gaurab
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The security angle isn't a silly one. There was a talk at Kiwicon recently (no video or presso unfortunately) which detailed what you could do to a server if you were a malicious USB device. https://www.kiwicon.org/the-con/talks/#e197 Not that the ATLAS probe is malicious, but does RIPE certify their entire supply chain? Dean On Wednesday, 30 December 2015, Bashir Yusuf <y.bashir@firstwave.ng> wrote:
Here in Nigeria facing Same issues wih power and some To my surprise thinking the probe could be a means of security breach, but I have acquired some USB chargers and will add them to my distribution, thank God we import every type of electronic "Junk" I could find all sorts of plugs.
Bashir Yusuf CTO- VP Operations First Wave Networks Suite 22, 1st Avenue Gwarimpa, Abuja, Nigeria +2347031986969 www.firstwave.ng
On 29 Dec 2015 18:38, Gaurab Raj Upadhaya <gaurab@lahai.com <javascript:;>> wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
matches my experience with power supplies. The ones i have given without power supplies don't tend to get powered up for a long time.
I got a bunch of USB power supplies, with different plugs, from 'Sim Lim' (electronics market in Singapore) to hand out with the probes. they are all sold as phone chargers. This was more effective - but then with every country in Asia with different plugs, had to amass all sorts of plug. Thankfully, they sell every types in Singapore. :)
It may be worthwhile to ask Ambassadors if they need power supplies to go with the probes, and of what type. But if the choice is to just send the Euro plugs with the probes, then I think it's a waste.
- -gaurab
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-- Regards, Dean
Dear RIPE Atlas ambassadors, Thank you very much for your feedback. We see that you take your task very seriously and with a lot of enthusiasm by reporting this issue to us. At this point in time we cannot come back with a definite reply about including a power supply to the probes shipments, but we will be looking into it after the holidays. We will consider the logistical factors alongside the advantages and disadvantages you have highlighted. Thank you again for your participation and support. Best wishes for 2016! Michela on behalf of the RIPE Atlas Team
On 30 Dec 2015, at 10:18, Dean Pemberton <dean@deanpemberton.com> wrote:
The security angle isn't a silly one. There was a talk at Kiwicon recently (no video or presso unfortunately) which detailed what you could do to a server if you were a malicious USB device.
https://www.kiwicon.org/the-con/talks/#e197
Not that the ATLAS probe is malicious, but does RIPE certify their entire supply chain?
Dean
On Wednesday, 30 December 2015, Bashir Yusuf <y.bashir@firstwave.ng> wrote:
Here in Nigeria facing Same issues wih power and some To my surprise thinking the probe could be a means of security breach, but I have acquired some USB chargers and will add them to my distribution, thank God we import every type of electronic "Junk" I could find all sorts of plugs.
Bashir Yusuf CTO- VP Operations First Wave Networks Suite 22, 1st Avenue Gwarimpa, Abuja, Nigeria +2347031986969 www.firstwave.ng
On 29 Dec 2015 18:38, Gaurab Raj Upadhaya <gaurab@lahai.com <javascript:;>> wrote:
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matches my experience with power supplies. The ones i have given without power supplies don't tend to get powered up for a long time.
I got a bunch of USB power supplies, with different plugs, from 'Sim Lim' (electronics market in Singapore) to hand out with the probes. they are all sold as phone chargers. This was more effective - but then with every country in Asia with different plugs, had to amass all sorts of plug. Thankfully, they sell every types in Singapore. :)
It may be worthwhile to ask Ambassadors if they need power supplies to go with the probes, and of what type. But if the choice is to just send the Euro plugs with the probes, then I think it's a waste.
- -gaurab
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-- Regards,
Dean _______________________________________________ RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors mailing list RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors@ripe.net https://www.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ripe-atlas-ambassadors _______________________________________________ Mcb-staff mailing list Mcb-staff@ripe.net https://intlists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/mcb-staff
On 2015-12-30 10:18, Dean Pemberton wrote:
The security angle isn't a silly one. There was a talk at Kiwicon recently (no video or presso unfortunately) which detailed what you could do to a server if you were a malicious USB device.
https://www.kiwicon.org/the-con/talks/#e197
Not that the ATLAS probe is malicious, but does RIPE certify their entire supply chain?
Dean
We don't "certify their entire supply chain" -- that's quite impossible for anyone and anything, really. The combination of off-the-shelf hardware and our own firmware (instead of just patching whatever is on the device when we get it) is sufficient against most adversaries. Hopefully :-) Robert
On 28 Dec 2015, at 03:07, Jonathan Brewer <jon.brewer@gmail.com> wrote:
My vote is for including power supplies with (or inside) future probes. Exchangeable plugs are a common thing these days.
I have heard similar requests from operators in the Middle East. Hisham
Dear Colleagues, As some folks mentioned, some networks need some sort of authentication to let the users get to the internet. I must add that of hotspots, be it by cookie, MAC, https, etc. Others may need a PPPoE connection to be established beforehand (home routers usually can do this, but not everyone can configure that, and that is not an option at work of course). At least in one location, I myself had to trick the hotspot by putting my probe behind a mikrotik router to do nat. Other users do not necessarily have that level of knowledge or resources. Even in the case of nat-router, any sudden logouts, power recycle or RAS kicks from ISP or IT department, may lead to disconnection of the probe(s) from atlas network for undetermined period of time. The worst case happens when the host is not around to re-login, e.g. at midnight or weekends or when you are long gone for vacation. I am not going to conclude that probes should have direct interfaces to resolve this, but this matter should be addressed in some way (maybe similar to the static address configuration) in the next firmware updates. Regards, M. Tajbakhsh Lecturer, Advisor
Hello,
I am not going to conclude that probes should have direct interfaces to resolve this, but this matter should be addressed in some way (maybe similar to the static address configuration) in the next firmware updates.
The probes are specifically designed to be headless -- ie. they expect that the network, or the operator of the network instructs them about local configuration (such as IP, DNS resolvers, ...). This works well. (And as Philip explained, they even support static configs ;-) Technically it's possible to add all kinds of smart heuristics in various failure scenarios. But the expected benefit (ie. how many probes become connected because of these features) is very likely low, while the amount of work to make these happen is probably substantial. I strongly prefer to keep them simple network clients, as much as possible. Regards, Robert
But all should consider any issues or delays in Customs if power suppliers are added. I have heard cases where consignments being held up for months. Since this is community / CSR effort no one would have the time or patience to pursue. Regards Durga Prasad +919849111010 From: RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors [mailto:ripe-atlas-ambassadors-bounces@ripe.net] On Behalf Of Hisham Ibrahim Sent: 28 December 2015 13:15 To: Jonathan Brewer Cc: RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors@ripe.net Subject: Re: [RIPE Atlas Ambassadors] power supplies On 28 Dec 2015, at 03:07, Jonathan Brewer <jon.brewer@gmail.com> wrote: My vote is for including power supplies with (or inside) future probes. Exchangeable plugs are a common thing these days. I have heard similar requests from operators in the Middle East. Hisham
Hello I agree with Mr. Tajbakhsh. It's a little bit difficult to distribute probes without power supply and specially a catalog. Also There is no centralized and updated information, presentation, catalog in ripe atlas website. Yesterday I was searching for a presentation about RIPE Atlas but there were a few and all of them were not update. volunteers have to pay about 6$ to the post office and about 2$ for the power supply and also 2$ per month for bandwidth, they need to know what do they get in return. On Fri, Dec 25, 2015 at 12:54 AM, M. Tajbakhsh <tajbakhsh@shirazu.ac.ir> wrote:
Dear Roderick,
That was a really sweet reply! Gave me some good moments. I am both a network zealot and an engineer. I believe I can do many things (including hardware hacks & surgery) to bring my probe into life. :)
I was writing on behalf of my probe hosts. I doubt e-bay delivers to Iran. Thanks for your comment and the useful link anyways.
Keep in touch. M. Tajbakhsh
Lecturer, Advisor, Network & Security Expert
On Fri, 12/25/2015 11:56 AM, Roderick <roderick.fanou@imdea.org> wrote:
Instead of a free USB port, you can also plug the cable in a converter USB to power.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-UK-EU-Plug-Wall-Car-Charger-Adapter-5V-2A-Dual-US...
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-- Shahin Gharghi
On 25 Dec 2015, at 14:53, Denys Stroebel <denyss@faircape.co.za> wrote:
As a side note to reinforce random unplugging of the probes, I have done so with my first non-Ambassador probe and managed to brick it. The general advice I give when handing out is simply to leave the probes for an extended period of time and be patient.
+1.
For the power concern, we are usually lucky enough for participants to have USB ports on their home routers which works well.
...and even when you think you have things running, its a great idea to still ping the atlas team if something does't look right. the probe at my home is connected to the usb port on a 2011/12 mac mini and, after 3 months or so after initial setup, i started receiving random messages about the probe being offline (even when external pings showed otherwise). some digging by the dev team (thanks robert!) showed that the mac usb port wasn't delivering enough power. plugin the second port of the usb power cable, into another usb port on the mini, and its been silent ever since... --n.
Hi, On 2015-12-25 8:35, Nishal Goburdhan wrote:
On 25 Dec 2015, at 14:53, Denys Stroebel <denyss@faircape.co.za> wrote:
As a side note to reinforce random unplugging of the probes, I have done so with my first non-Ambassador probe and managed to brick it. The general advice I give when handing out is simply to leave the probes for an extended period of time and be patient.
+1.
Something that can help here to understand what's going on: When we prepare (initialise) the probes, we put the latest available firmware on them. But firmware development is ongoing, so by the time a user gets the probe -- whether from us or from an ambassador -- chances are we have released a newer one. Now, the very first thing that happens after a probe is plugged in (assuming successful network connections) is that it's checking for firmware updates, so in most cases it immediately upgrades itself. This, with all the steps involved, can take a while: depending on network speeds, number of retries, etc. it can be anything between 10-30 minutes. Then the probe needs to reconnect, which can also be flakey in remote areas. All in all, the first actual connection is not guaranteed to be immediate. Now, we're going to add some features to the probe page to guide the users about what's going on. At a minimum stuff like "DNS works" and such. Hopefully, we can add more useful guidance later, like "your probe seems to be plugged in now, stand by!" or "your probe is now upgrading its firmware".
For the power concern, we are usually lucky enough for participants to have USB ports on their home routers which works well.
...and even when you think you have things running, its a great idea to still ping the atlas team if something does't look right.
the probe at my home is connected to the usb port on a 2011/12 mac mini and, after 3 months or so after initial setup, i started receiving random messages about the probe being offline (even when external pings showed otherwise). some digging by the dev team (thanks robert!) showed that the mac usb port wasn't delivering enough power. plugin the second port of the usb power cable, into another usb port on the mini, and its been silent ever since...
Indeed, unreliable power seems to be the number 1 issue nowadays. It's a hard one to solve, and I'm beginning to think that we should advise *all* users to use *both* type A ends of the cable if they can... Regards, Robert
--n. _______________________________________________ RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors mailing list RIPE-Atlas-Ambassadors@ripe.net https://www.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ripe-atlas-ambassadors
participants (21)
-
Bashir Yusuf -
Dean Pemberton -
Denys Stroebel -
Dmitry Kohmanyuk -
DurgaPrasad - DatasoftComnet -
Fearghas McKay -
Gaurab Raj Upadhaya -
Geert Jan de Groot -
Gil Bahat -
Hisham Ibrahim -
Johan Bogg -
Jonathan Brewer -
M. Tajbakhsh -
Matthew Moyle-Croft -
Michela Galante -
Mike Hughes -
Nick Hilliard -
Nishal Goburdhan -
Robert Kisteleki -
Roderick -
Shahin Gharghi