Dear RIPE NCC members, I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions. RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse. This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C. My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database. I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further. -- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
Sergey, One challenge with this proposal is attribution. What if someone spoofs a broker's email address to send spam advertising IPv4 sales? (to get rid of competitor). The core problem is that it's difficult to prove whether spam was actually ordered by a particular broker, or whether it's a malicious attempt to frame them. I suspect this is precisely why RIPE NCC hasn't acted more aggressively - without solid, verifiable evidence tying the spam directly to a member, any sanctions risk punishing innocent parties. On Mon, 2025-12-08 at 12:57 -0500, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members- discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Denys, There should be more complex investigations before any actions of course. I used to bring a solid evidence, call logs, e-mail headers, follow-up e-mails with the broker reps to RIPE NCC... and got nothing. Do you remember the story when one company holding AS number less than 200 was caught with spam and cold phone calls by an RIR? -- Best, Sergey
On Dec 9, 2025, at 04:22, Denys Fedoryshchenko <nuclearcat@nuclearcat.com> wrote:
Sergey,
One challenge with this proposal is attribution. What if someone spoofs a broker's email address to send spam advertising IPv4 sales? (to get rid of competitor).
The core problem is that it's difficult to prove whether spam was actually ordered by a particular broker, or whether it's a malicious attempt to frame them. I suspect this is precisely why RIPE NCC hasn't acted more aggressively - without solid, verifiable evidence tying the spam directly to a member, any sanctions risk punishing innocent parties.
On Mon, 2025-12-08 at 12:57 -0500, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members- discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Hi, I do not think this would help as long the unprotected email address is part of the database. I prefer a link to a contact form from RIPE where everyone can leave a message, but this form is protected against spam (for example with some capture code). Michael -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> Gesendet: Montag, 8. Dezember 2025 18:57 An: members-discuss@ripe.net Betreff: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse Dear RIPE NCC members, I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions. RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse. This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C. My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database. I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further. -- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details. Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription. Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Michael, Thanks, I think separating public organsation email from the one for the RIPE NCC communication will be helpful. -- Best, Sergey
On Dec 9, 2025, at 05:47, cowmedia.de <info@cowmedia.de> wrote:
Hi,
I do not think this would help as long the unprotected email address is part of the database. I prefer a link to a contact form from RIPE where everyone can leave a message, but this form is protected against spam (for example with some capture code).
Michael
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> Gesendet: Montag, 8. Dezember 2025 18:57 An: members-discuss@ripe.net Betreff: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
I can’t see how that would work. It’d make a lot more sense to look at ways to make it harder for people to harvest the email addresses en masse, but either way I think you’re just going to waste everyone’s time with this. Every public email address I or any of the companies I’m involved with gets hit with spam. The only “fix” is to improve the spam filters and possibly pursue the spammers directly. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains https://www.blacknight.com/ https://blacknight.blog/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072<tel:+353599183072> Personal blog: https://michele.blog/ Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. From: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> Date: Tuesday, 9 December 2025 at 08:32 To: members-discuss@ripe.net <members-discuss@ripe.net> Subject: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources. Dear RIPE NCC members, I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions. RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse. This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C. My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database. I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further. -- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details. Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription. Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Michele, WHOIS/RDAP data of domain admins was cleaned up of personal data and e-mail addresses long time ago. Shall we follow this way maybe? -- Best, Sergey
On Dec 9, 2025, at 06:19, Michele Neylon - Blacknight via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> wrote:
I can’t see how that would work. It’d make a lot more sense to look at ways to make it harder for people to harvest the email addresses en masse, but either way I think you’re just going to waste everyone’s time with this. Every public email address I or any of the companies I’m involved with gets hit with spam. The only “fix” is to improve the spam filters and possibly pursue the spammers directly.
Regards
Michele
-- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains https://www.blacknight.com/ https://blacknight.blog/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Personal blog: https://michele.blog/ Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. From: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> Date: Tuesday, 9 December 2025 at 08:32 To: members-discuss@ripe.net <members-discuss@ripe.net> Subject: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse
[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources.
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas
To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
* Sergey wrote:
WHOIS/RDAP data of domain admins was cleaned up of personal data and e-mail addresses long time ago. Shall we follow this way maybe?
It was not cleared. Quiet contrary the personal data is now required and much more intensively checked for correctness. Only the access to anonymous or ordinary users - like those, which are on charge to solve acute technical problems - was restricted. For anybody, who is able to pay for or provide a legitimate interest, the access was streamlined - ignoring local law -, bulky, and sped up considerably. You are welcome.
While I could probably argue to remove some email addresses that are for people (natural persons) the bulk of email addresses that I see in the DB are role accounts and they need to be public for a variety of reasons. As others have mentioned, for example, the abuse-c needs to be public. And I sincerely doubt that removing email addresses from anything run by RIPE will stop me or anyone else being spammed by IPv4 brokers etc., Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains https://www.blacknight.com/ https://blacknight.blog/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072<tel:+353599183072> Personal blog: https://michele.blog/ Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. From: Sergey Myasoedov <kaa@net-art.cz> Date: Wednesday, 10 December 2025 04:13 To: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele@blacknight.com> Cc: members-discuss@ripe.net <members-discuss@ripe.net> Subject: Re: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources. Michele, WHOIS/RDAP data of domain admins was cleaned up of personal data and e-mail addresses long time ago. Shall we follow this way maybe? -- Best, Sergey > On Dec 9, 2025, at 06:19, Michele Neylon - Blacknight via members-discuss wrote: > > I can’t see how that would work. > It’d make a lot more sense to look at ways to make it harder for people to harvest the email addresses en masse, but either way I think you’re just going to waste everyone’s time with this. Every public email address I or any of the companies I’m involved with gets hit with spam. The only “fix” is to improve the spam filters and possibly pursue the spammers directly. > > Regards > > Michele > > > -- > Mr Michele Neylon > Blacknight Solutions > Hosting, Colocation & Domains > https://www.blacknight.com/ > https://blacknight.blog/ > Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 > Personal blog: https://michele.blog/ > Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/ > ------------------------------- > Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 > I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. > From: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss > Date: Tuesday, 9 December 2025 at 08:32 > To: members-discuss@ripe.net > Subject: [members-discuss] Systematic RIPE DB abuse > > [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources. > > Dear RIPE NCC members, > > I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions. > > RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse. > > This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C. > > My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database. > > I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further. > > > -- > Best regards, > Sergey Myasoedov > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > > From: "HostM" > > Subject: Quick question about IPv4 > > Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST > > To: > > > > Hello, > > my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time. > > > > I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. > > I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block. > > > > The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean. > > > > The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service. > > > > If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail. > > > > Regards, > > Zydrunas > > To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your > RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: > https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details. > > Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription. > > Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription > can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ > To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your > RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: > https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details. > > Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription. > > Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription > can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
On 10/12/2025 17:11, Michele Neylon - Blacknight wrote:
the bulk of email addresses that I see in the DB are role accounts and they need to be public for a variety of reasons. As others have mentioned, for example, the abuse-c needs to be public. And I sincerely doubt that removing email addresses from anything run by RIPE will stop me or anyone else being spammed by IPv4 brokers etc.
Technically, the DB is required to give contact info to whoever wants to use it *then and there*. Allowing that info to have a *limited lifetime* would sour spammers' activities at least *some* (data would cease to be *collectible*). (Example implementation: LIR registers a secret key with RIPE DB, DB lookup causes a HMAC being computed from secret and timestamp and the result being folded into "plussed user addresses" (which Exchange supports these days, too), recipient can filter out HMACs according to whatever timeout period they prefer.) Kind regards, -- Jochen Bern Systemingenieur Binect GmbH https://www.binect.de/
Hi, Simply use email address you can have as spam box - or use that data as a signal. YOUR OWN antispam protection hardly falls on the RIPE. This is the reality we live in; Any (semi)public email address WILL get spam. If RIPE starts taking measures on that, it means RIPE is spending resources on something which is not part of their mission. Only thing it leads to is increased RIPE membership costs, more complicated operation for all legit operators (friction), and _zero_ protection from nefarious actors who do not care about your little T&C or little friction for antispam, they will simply circumvent whatever means were used if it is valuable enough. Further, the emails are already in public, any action now will take decades for full effect. I hate spam probably just as much as you do, but just sending this reply means my email address "leaked" to many people, some of which will add it to their mailing lists. This is simply the world we live in. Instead, turn this into a victory; Any operator which spams you -> Never buy from them. This works far better than anything RIPE could do. Blacklist them. Before buying IPv4 addresses from spammer, check if they ever spammed you. Then find a seller who did not spam. Best Regards, Aleksi MCX On 08/12/2025 19.57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Aleksi, I understand that any action will cause expenses. But the same database e-mails are used by spammers and by the RIPE NCC, and spammer e-mails will cause expenses for NCC members. So I guess this initiative will be in the best interests of the RIPE NCC membership.
Further, the emails are already in public, any action now will take decades for full effect.
I create a new e-mail addresses for every occasion. It's easy to replace the address in the database. -- Best, Sergey
On Dec 9, 2025, at 08:09, Aleksi <aleksi@magnacapax.fi> wrote:
Hi,
Simply use email address you can have as spam box - or use that data as a signal. YOUR OWN antispam protection hardly falls on the RIPE.
This is the reality we live in; Any (semi)public email address WILL get spam.
If RIPE starts taking measures on that, it means RIPE is spending resources on something which is not part of their mission. Only thing it leads to is increased RIPE membership costs, more complicated operation for all legit operators (friction), and _zero_ protection from nefarious actors who do not care about your little T&C or little friction for antispam, they will simply circumvent whatever means were used if it is valuable enough.
Further, the emails are already in public, any action now will take decades for full effect.
I hate spam probably just as much as you do, but just sending this reply means my email address "leaked" to many people, some of which will add it to their mailing lists. This is simply the world we live in.
Instead, turn this into a victory; Any operator which spams you -> Never buy from them. This works far better than anything RIPE could do. Blacklist them. Before buying IPv4 addresses from spammer, check if they ever spammed you. Then find a seller who did not spam.
Best Regards, Aleksi MCX
On 08/12/2025 19.57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
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Hi, Yes, the expense of running antispam, just like (almost?) everyone already does. If you already create new email address for every thing, you already solved it for yourself. Br, Aleksi MCX On 10/12/2025 6.19, Sergey Myasoedov wrote:
Aleksi,
I understand that any action will cause expenses. But the same database e-mails are used by spammers and by the RIPE NCC, and spammer e-mails will cause expenses for NCC members.
So I guess this initiative will be in the best interests of the RIPE NCC membership.
Further, the emails are already in public, any action now will take decades for full effect. I create a new e-mail addresses for every occasion. It's easy to replace the address in the database.
-- Best, Sergey
On Dec 9, 2025, at 08:09, Aleksi <aleksi@magnacapax.fi> wrote:
Hi,
Simply use email address you can have as spam box - or use that data as a signal. YOUR OWN antispam protection hardly falls on the RIPE.
This is the reality we live in; Any (semi)public email address WILL get spam.
If RIPE starts taking measures on that, it means RIPE is spending resources on something which is not part of their mission. Only thing it leads to is increased RIPE membership costs, more complicated operation for all legit operators (friction), and _zero_ protection from nefarious actors who do not care about your little T&C or little friction for antispam, they will simply circumvent whatever means were used if it is valuable enough.
Further, the emails are already in public, any action now will take decades for full effect.
I hate spam probably just as much as you do, but just sending this reply means my email address "leaked" to many people, some of which will add it to their mailing lists. This is simply the world we live in.
Instead, turn this into a victory; Any operator which spams you -> Never buy from them. This works far better than anything RIPE could do. Blacklist them. Before buying IPv4 addresses from spammer, check if they ever spammed you. Then find a seller who did not spam.
Best Regards, Aleksi MCX
On 08/12/2025 19.57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Am Mittwoch, 10. Dezember 2025, 05:19:40 UTC+00:00:01 schrieb Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss:
Aleksi,
I understand that any action will cause expenses. But the same database e-mails are used by spammers and by the RIPE NCC, and spammer e-mails will cause expenses for NCC members.
As a Email ISP byself i just wonder why so many (at least business) email users try to hide their technical / business emails from the public. From my prospective, email addresses are out to be findable to anyone potentially want to contact them. Our abuse / hostmaster / contact addresses are out now since ~30 years and so listed in many spammer databases and the amout of spam which is not handable per our spam blocking (we have no spam folders which would need additional user awareness again...) filters is relatively low (up to a hand full a day for 30-40 of our addresses). It should be the work of your email isp to held any real spam to your inbox as low as possible (without compromising your expected communication).. Most spammers today do not rely on public accessible data sources - they use compromised email clients and the archived emails on it to gain fresh address lists including "known" communication partners etc. which are much more of value to them then just some addresses. SO even if you try to "hide" your addresses -. it is just a question of time when they will be grabbed by the smappers industry. hth cheers, niels. -- --- Niels Dettenbach Syndicat IT & Internet https://www.syndicat.com PGP: https://syndicat.com/pub_key.asc ---
I fully agree that something must change. Another idea: Just introduce mandatory login to see contact data and limit it to 3 per day. Problem solved. On 12/8/25 18:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
This does not solve the problem that you can use whois/RDAP to get a abuse contact email, for example: [16:34:11] ben@metropolis:~$ whois AS51786 | grep contact % Abuse contact for 'AS51786' is 'ripe-eoseeR8x@velder.li' [16:34:12] ben@metropolis:~$ And I don't think whois/RDAP is going anywhere any time soon... Such whois fetches are already rate limited (so much that it already causes problems, for example it's hard to onboard to Microsoft's postmaster tools because RIPE's whois server has perma banned their IPs...), so I dont think tightening these will help On Tue, 9 Dec 2025 at 16:18, <lists@velder.li> wrote:
I fully agree that something must change.
Another idea: Just introduce mandatory login to see contact data and limit it to 3 per day. Problem solved.
On 12/8/25 18:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
You can hide it in whois, like the "changed" attribute a few years ago. On 12/9/25 17:36, Ben Cartwright-Cox wrote:
This does not solve the problem that you can use whois/RDAP to get a abuse contact email, for example:
[16:34:11] ben@metropolis:~$ whois AS51786 | grep contact % Abuse contact for 'AS51786' is 'ripe-eoseeR8x@velder.li' [16:34:12] ben@metropolis:~$
And I don't think whois/RDAP is going anywhere any time soon...
Such whois fetches are already rate limited (so much that it already causes problems, for example it's hard to onboard to Microsoft's postmaster tools because RIPE's whois server has perma banned their IPs...), so I dont think tightening these will help
On Tue, 9 Dec 2025 at 16:18, <lists@velder.li> wrote:
I fully agree that something must change.
Another idea: Just introduce mandatory login to see contact data and limit it to 3 per day. Problem solved.
On 12/8/25 18:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Moin, On Tue, Dec 09, 2025 at 05:37:37PM +0100, Patrick Velder wrote:
You can hide it in whois, like the "changed" attribute a few years ago.
Hiding abuse contacts sounds like a very good approach to make sure abuse reports are not sent :-) My inbox would welcome this proposal. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Karin Schuler, Sebastian Cler Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279
There definitely needs to be some more enforcement on this than what there is. There is a lot of spam emails that come around from "IPv4 Brokers". Rate limits should be tightened for showing contact information in whois On Tue, 9 Dec 2025 at 16:18, <lists@velder.li> wrote:
I fully agree that something must change.
Another idea: Just introduce mandatory login to see contact data and limit it to 3 per day. Problem solved.
On 12/8/25 18:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt [info@hostmaster.lt]> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz [for-spammers@net-art.cz]>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details [https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details].
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members -discuss-subscription-options/ [https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/] To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details [https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details].
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ [https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/]
[data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAP///wAAACwAAAAAAQABAAACAkQBADs=3D]
And.... No one can find our email addresses for more than 3 organizations per day? Are you sure that the reference book is published for this purpose? And if the authorities need it, for example? We (RIPE NCC) are an open organization, and every member of the community should understand that his email is open information. Therefore, we need to protect our public email ourselves. If someone doesn't do this, it's the IT department's problem, not RIPE NCC's. Any serious organization has a public email address, and there is spam in it. For me, the best solution is to block the transfer of new IP addresses to LIRs, which transmit their networks to spammers, without any reaction and feedback on abuse! Dmitry Serbulov.
I fully agree that something must change.
Another idea: Just introduce mandatory login to see contact data and limit it to 3 per day. Problem solved.
On 12/8/25 18:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
-- Best regards, Sergey Myasoedov
Begin forwarded message:
From: "HostM" <info@hostmaster.lt> Subject: Quick question about IPv4 Date: December 8, 2025 at 04:54:23 EST To: <for-spammers@net-art.cz>
Hello, my apologies if this message has arrived at an inconvenient time.
I wanted to check whether you might be interested in acquiring an IPv4 /24 sub-net registered with RIPE. I also have IPv6 resources and an ASN available, which can be included (for free) if you are interested in the IPv4 block.
The ipv4 sub-net is currently unused and fully clean.
The transfer can be completed securely via an escrow service.
If this could be of interest, please feel free to reply to this email, and we can discuss the next steps in more detail.
Regards, Zydrunas To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/ To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Hi, If the IPv4 market is the main source of spam, and you want the spam to stop, stop making IPv4 addresses so valuable. Around half of the people in this thread so far have A but not AAAA on their domain. It's 2025. You are part of the true problem here. Sasha
On 2025-12-08 12:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
Compared to other sources, our RIPE contact address gets a tiny amount of spam, and all of it from IPv4 brokers. I've now received more emails in this single thread in the past 24 hours than I have spam to our RIPE contact address in the past 5 years. No action from RIPE is required here. Tighten your spam controls if this is a problem for you, and lets move on. Cheers, Brett -- Brett Sheffield (he/him) Gladserv
Hi I agree entirely NCC should not do anything. A registry’s role is administrative, not enforcement. Asking a bookkeeping-type institution to police behavior is simply outside its mandate and purpose. There are countless legitimate ways to address concerns or resolve disputes. But withholding a fundamental registry service—such as assigning an address—because someone “did or did not do X” is irrational and unprecedented. It is the equivalent of a government refusing to give a home an address instead of contacting law enforcement or using proper legal channels. No responsible system operates that way, and no credible governance framework treats essential registry functions as a tool for punishment or leverage. A registry should remain neutral, predictable, and strictly procedural. Using it as an enforcement mechanism undermines trust in the entire system. -- Kind regards. Lu On Wed, Dec 10, 2025 at 14:38 Brett Sheffield <ripe@gladserv.com> wrote:
On 2025-12-08 12:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
Compared to other sources, our RIPE contact address gets a tiny amount of spam, and all of it from IPv4 brokers.
I've now received more emails in this single thread in the past 24 hours than I have spam to our RIPE contact address in the past 5 years. No action from RIPE is required here.
Tighten your spam controls if this is a problem for you, and lets move on.
Cheers,
Brett -- Brett Sheffield (he/him) Gladserv To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Lu Sorry but I cannot agree with your position on this. By your logic RIPE NCC would have zero right to take action against a member who was in breach of the policies, rules etc., Trust in the system is only possible when the system is stable and predictable, which you seem to agree with, however if there are no rules then any system will be abused by somebody at some point. Regards Michele -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains https://www.blacknight.com/ https://blacknight.blog/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072<tel:+353599183072> Personal blog: https://michele.blog/ Some thoughts: https://ceo.hosting/ ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. From: Lu Heng <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> Date: Wednesday, 10 December 2025 at 13:15 To: Brett Sheffield <ripe@gladserv.com> Cc: Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> Subject: [members-discuss] Re: Systematic RIPE DB abuse [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources. Hi I agree entirely NCC should not do anything. A registry’s role is administrative, not enforcement. Asking a bookkeeping-type institution to police behavior is simply outside its mandate and purpose. There are countless legitimate ways to address concerns or resolve disputes. But withholding a fundamental registry service—such as assigning an address—because someone “did or did not do X” is irrational and unprecedented. It is the equivalent of a government refusing to give a home an address instead of contacting law enforcement or using proper legal channels. No responsible system operates that way, and no credible governance framework treats essential registry functions as a tool for punishment or leverage. A registry should remain neutral, predictable, and strictly procedural. Using it as an enforcement mechanism undermines trust in the entire system. -- Kind regards. Lu On Wed, Dec 10, 2025 at 14:38 Brett Sheffield <ripe@gladserv.com<mailto:ripe@gladserv.com>> wrote: On 2025-12-08 12:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
Compared to other sources, our RIPE contact address gets a tiny amount of spam, and all of it from IPv4 brokers. I've now received more emails in this single thread in the past 24 hours than I have spam to our RIPE contact address in the past 5 years. No action from RIPE is required here. Tighten your spam controls if this is a problem for you, and lets move on. Cheers, Brett -- Brett Sheffield (he/him) Gladserv To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details. Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription. Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
Michele, Let me clarify, because this is not a question of “no rules.” My position is straightforward: A registry is a registry. Its mandate is to maintain accurate records—nothing more. You do not use an address book as an instrument of punishment. When a registry begins using essential administrative functions to reward or punish individuals, the system becomes unpredictable and open to abuse. This is, in fact, a major reason the RIR environment has struggled with instability and governance issues: registries have, at times, stepped outside their neutral role and attempted to use resource administration as leverage. Rules absolutely must exist, and compliance is essential. But those rules are defined and enforced by sovereign law—courts, regulators, and proper authorities—not by a voluntary address book. A registry cannot impose its own rules above nations, nor can it act as police, prosecutor, and judge. Punishment, when warranted, must come through established legal channels. A registry that assumes enforcement powers beyond its mandate ultimately undermines its own legitimacy and the trust of the global community. That is the core of my position. Regards, Lu On Wed, Dec 10, 2025 at 16:19 Michele Neylon - Blacknight < michele@blacknight.com> wrote:
Lu
Sorry but I cannot agree with your position on this.
By your logic RIPE NCC would have zero right to take action against a member who was in breach of the policies, rules etc.,
Trust in the system is only possible when the system is stable and predictable, which you seem to agree with, however if there are no rules then any system will be abused by somebody at some point.
Regards
Michele
--
Mr Michele Neylon
Blacknight Solutions
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Personal blog: *https://michele.blog/ <https://michele.blog/>*
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I have sent this email at a time that is convenient for me. I do not expect you to respond to it outside of your usual working hours. *From: *Lu Heng <h.lu@anytimechinese.com> *Date: *Wednesday, 10 December 2025 at 13:15 *To: *Brett Sheffield <ripe@gladserv.com> *Cc: *Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss <members-discuss@ripe.net> *Subject: *[members-discuss] Re: Systematic RIPE DB abuse
*[EXTERNAL EMAIL]* Please use caution when opening attachments from unrecognised sources. Hi
I agree entirely NCC should not do anything. A registry’s role is administrative, not enforcement. Asking a bookkeeping-type institution to police behavior is simply outside its mandate and purpose.
There are countless legitimate ways to address concerns or resolve disputes. But withholding a fundamental registry service—such as assigning an address—because someone “did or did not do X” is irrational and unprecedented. It is the equivalent of a government refusing to give a home an address instead of contacting law enforcement or using proper legal channels. No responsible system operates that way, and no credible governance framework treats essential registry functions as a tool for punishment or leverage.
A registry should remain neutral, predictable, and strictly procedural. Using it as an enforcement mechanism undermines trust in the entire system.
-- Kind regards. Lu
On Wed, Dec 10, 2025 at 14:38 Brett Sheffield <ripe@gladserv.com> wrote:
On 2025-12-08 12:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
Dear RIPE NCC members,
I’d like to raise the topic of introducing and applying administrative anti-spam measures against RIPE NCC members who deliberately violate Article 4 of the RIPE Database Terms and Conditions.
RIPE NCC requires members to publish up-to-date contact email addresses in the RIPE DB. However, these publicly listed addresses are actively harvested and used for spam by IPv4 brokers and address traders, while RIPE NCC does not take any measures to protect members from this type of abuse.
This issue has been around since the IPv4 market appeared, and although it’s well known, at some point the RIPE NCC staff chose not to act against members who don’t follow the RIPE Database T&C.
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
Compared to other sources, our RIPE contact address gets a tiny amount of spam, and all of it from IPv4 brokers.
I've now received more emails in this single thread in the past 24 hours than I have spam to our RIPE contact address in the past 5 years. No action from RIPE is required here.
Tighten your spam controls if this is a problem for you, and lets move on.
Cheers,
Brett -- Brett Sheffield (he/him) Gladserv To unsubscribe or manage your subscription, log in to the LIR Portal with your RIPE NCC Access account and go to the LIR Account page: https://my.ripe.net/#/account-details.
Scroll down to Membership Mailing Lists to update your 'members-discuss' subscription.
Having issues unsubscribing? More information about managing your subscription can be found at: https://www.ripe.net/s/members-discuss-subscription-options/
On 2025-12-10 13:16, Brett Sheffield wrote:
On 2025-12-08 12:57, Sergey Myasoedov via members-discuss wrote:
My proposal is to freeze transfer operations for members who are repeatedly abusing the RIPE Database.
I’d be glad to hear your thoughts and discuss this further.
Compared to other sources, our RIPE contact address gets a tiny amount of spam, and all of it from IPv4 brokers.
I've now received more emails in this single thread in the past 24 hours than I have spam to our RIPE contact address in the past 5 years. No action from RIPE is required here.
Tighten your spam controls if this is a problem for you, and lets move on.
If, however, RIPE wanted to drop subscribers from this list who allow autoresponders to list mail, I would support that ;-) -- Brett Sheffield (he/him) Gladserv
participants (17)
-
Aleksi -
Ben Cartwright-Cox -
Brett Sheffield -
cowmedia.de -
Denys Fedoryshchenko -
Gert Doering -
Jochen Bern -
lists＠velder.li -
Lu Heng -
Lutz Donnerhacke -
Michele Neylon - Blacknight -
Niels Dettenbach -
Patrick Velder
-
Samuel Cosgrove -
Sasha Romijn -
sdy＠a-n-t.ru -
Sergey Myasoedov