On Friday, May 15, 1998 5:30 AM, Mike Norris[SMTP:Mike.Norris@heanet.ie] wrote: @ @> Are the "highly competitive" LIRs "for profit" or "non profit" ? @ @Most, but not all, would be 'for profit'. The main exceptions would be @national A&R networks (such as HEAnet). @ In your opinion, how can ARIN qualify for non-profit status with the U.S. Government's Internal Revenue Service when clearly this is an industry "ordinarily carried on for profit". === http://www.irs.ustreas.gov/prod/bus_info/eo/index.html http://www.irs.ustreas.gov/prod/bus_info/eo/bus-orgs.html @@@@ http://www.irs.ustreas.gov/prod/bus_info/eo/bl-req.html "No part of its net earnings may inure to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual and it may not be organized for profit or organized to engage in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit (even if the business is operated on a cooperative basis or produces only sufficient income to be self-sustaining)." @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Also, a company can not qualify with the IRS just because they are a "cooperative" and spend all of the money they bring in. This is not the definition of non-profit, yet some people seem to think it is. When revenues go up they raise their salaries, buy larger computers, add higher bandwidth connections and take more trips, first-class, around the world. Non-profits are supposed to spend their time and money on community out reach, to inclusive processes. They are supposed to be educating people. They should be working to help employ the handicap and other socially beneficial activities which a for-profit company may not want to support. There are hundreds of things non-profit companies should be doing. Raking in money to pay high salaries to people should not be the primary goal, especially when the company is granted a virtual monopoly on a large part of the marketplace that has been locked-in with no place to go, at least in the U.S. It is good to see that RIPE in Europe appears to be more mature in its development. I have a feeling that the U.S. Government is going to help sort these issues out in the U.S. in the coming weeks. Just because the NSF helped to create a structure that does not appear to conform to IRS regulations does not mean that it is cast in stone. In a democracy like the U.S. the people get to have input on the final arrangements that are made. The Internet is a great place for people to circulate their views. One of these days people in the U.S. Government may start to use it more actively. Until that happens, we have to live with the current inefficient situation where people fly around the world to hold a 2 hour meeting. That is one of the reasons that the decisions take so long. Hopefully that will change as more people use the Internet. - Jim Fleming Unir Corporation - http://www.unir.net IPv8 - Designed for the Rest of the Human Race AM Radio Stations ---> http://www.DOT.AM