- db-wg - mailman.ripe.net

ORGANISATION objects in the RIPE Whois Database
by DB-News 19 Apr '04

19 Apr '04

Dear Colleagues, (apologies for duplicate messages) The RIPE NCC is pleased to announce that as of 17, April 2004, a new type of object, the ORGANISATION object, is available in the RIPE Whois Database. You can find more information about the ORGANISATION object at: http://www.ripe.net/db/organisation.html As part of the transition process, the RIPE NCC has: - created ORGANISATION objects for LIRs (around 4000 ORGANISATION objects) - updated LIR allocation objects to include "org:" attributes pointing to these new ORGANISATION objects (around 6500 INETNUM/INET6NUM objects) LIRs can update parts of their ORGANISATION objects through the ORGANISATION Object Editor available through the LIR Portal: https://lirportal.ripe.net/lirportal/index.html Please contact <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net> for any questions. Best Regards, -- Engin Gunduz RIPE NCC Software Engineering Department

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ANNOUNCEMENT Maintenance on Whois Server Regarding ORGANISATION Object
by DB-News 15 Apr '04

15 Apr '04

Dear Colleagues, [apologies for duplicate messages] On Saturday April 17, 2004, the RIPE NCC will perform maintenance work on the whois server. The aim of the maintenance is to upgrade the whois server to add support for a new object type, the organisation object. The maintenance is scheduled to start at 8:00 UTC (10:00 Amsterdam time) and expected to last around 10 hours. During the maintenance: - e-mail updates to <auto-dbm(a)ripe.net> will be queued to be processed after the maintenance - webupdates and syncupdates interfaces will NOT be available - whois query service will NOT be interrupted The maintenance work will consist of: - upgrading the whois software - creating ORGANISATION objects for LIRs - updating LIRs' allocation objects to have "org:" attributes pointing to these new ORGANISATION objects. We are sorry for any inconvenience this may cause. Please contact <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net> for any questions. Best regards, -- Engin Gunduz RIPE NCC Software Engineering Department

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Re: [db-wg] Action item 47.2: Proposal for Adding Abuse Contact
by Wilfried Woeber, UniVie/ACOnet 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

>To be sure, last meeting I had the count on the number of inet(6)num >objects having a mnt-irt and the number having a remarks: *abuse* >attribute. > >The request is to extend this on the actual number of IP-addresses covered >by both methods ? Correct, 'cause the single entry you can obtain by asking for > whois -h whois.ripe.net -cr 193.171.2.3 inetnum: 193.170.0.0 - 193.171.255.255 [ ... ] status: ALLOCATED UNSPECIFIED mnt-by: RIPE-NCC-HM-MNT mnt-lower: ACONET-LIR-MNT mnt-irt: IRT-ACOnet-CERT [ ... ] actually covers a /15 range... > I will try to extend my script (grep | wc -l) a bit to >get this info, hopefully during next weekend but at least in time for the >next meeting. thanks! >Grtx, > >MarcoH Wilfried.

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call for agenda items, DB-WG, RIPE48 @AMS
by Wilfried Woeber, UniVie/ACOnet 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

Dear DB WG! Our next meeting is scheduled for less than a month from today, so it is time to ask for agenda items for the draft agenda. Support items for the logistics will be provided by Nigel T. and myself, the meet on the bones should be suggested from "your" end:-) Looking forward to meet many of you in Amsterdam! Wilfried ( https://cert.aco.net/ ) _________________________________:_____________________________________ Wilfried Woeber : e-mail: Woeber(a)CC.UniVie.ac.at UniVie Computer Center - ACOnet : Tel: +43 1 4277 - 140 33 Universitaetsstrasse 7 : Fax: +43 1 4277 - 9 140 A-1010 Vienna, Austria, Europe : RIPE-DB: WW144, PGP keyID 0xF0ACB369 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ...there's no place like 127.0.0.1 (or is it ::1 ?)

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new release of ripe_wrap
by TAYON, Julien 06 Apr '04

06 Apr '04

Hello, I am pleased to annouce a release of a new version of neuf-telecom ripe_wrap tool. The use is to actually see if you are between 50% & 100% of the IPv4 assingment request you made to the RIPE, and to help you spot netname for which you have declared more than the AW (to some limitations though). It gives you a synthetic view of your use per inetnums & netnames & registrar... It crosses Lirportal information on IPv4 assignement, with direct query on the whois database. There is now : - a home page ; - a mailing-list ; - a CVS ; - a quite explicit documentation... http://ripe.est-unique.net I just created the domain, and it has not yet been propagated worldwide :) It is not perfect and can be largely improved. Friendly, -- julien.tayon(a)neuf.com +33 (0)1 70 18 14 45 Gestion des adresses IPs, BU Data n9uf telecom 40 - 42 Quai du Point du Jour 92659 Boulogne Billancourt

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Beta release of Whois S/W with organisation object
by Engin Gunduz 06 Apr '04

06 Apr '04

Dear Colleagues, [Apologies for duplicate mails] We have made available the beta version of RIPE Whois Software that supports the organisation object. You can find it at ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/dbase/software/ripe-dbase-3.2.0-org-obj-beta.tar.gz Plese note that the software has been tested only on Solaris 8 environment. Please contact me at <engin(a)ripe.net> for any questions/comments. Best regards, -- Engin Gunduz RIPE NCC Software Engineering Department

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New database Features
by Denis Walker 25 Mar '04

25 Mar '04

Dear Colleagues, [Apologies for duplicate mails] We have recently installed an updated version of the Whois software and Database update software. As well as some bug fixes there are three new features in the Database software. X.509 ----- This is now fully implemented. You are able to create the new X.509 KEY-CERT objects and reference these in the "auth:" lines of a maintainer. You can now use X.509 authentication with all our update methods: mail, syncupdates and webupdates. There is a link to the X.509 enabled webupdates script from the RIPE Whois Database page of the RIPE NCC web site: http://www.ripe.net/db/index.html The direct link is: https://www.ripe.net/perl/webupdates-x509.pl For documentation please refer to: http://www.ripe.net/db/x509.html You may also wish to check some other updated documents on security of objects: http://www.ripe.net/db/security.html http://www.ripe.net/db/Maintainer_Creation_Procedure.html http://www.ripe.net/db/pgp.html CIDR notation for inetnum creation. ---------------------------------- We now allow the use of CIDR notation when creating INETNUM objects. The CIDR string is replaced by the expanded range notation before the object is processed. This feature is ONLY permitted when creating an object. For example if the following object is submitted to the RIPE Database: inetnum: 1.2.0.0/16 before any further processing is done it will be converted to: inetnum: 1.2.0.0 - 1.2.255.255 A warning message will be added to the acknowledgement reply. It is now standard policy to add a warning if any changes are made to the submitted data. Prefix range lists for "mnt-routes:" ---------------------------------- The "mnt-routes:" attribute's syntax has been extended to allow prefix range lists. This will enable people to specify which maintainer has to authorise the creation of the specific routes. As an example: mnt-routes: MY-MNT { 20.34.0.0/1617-18, 20.34.0.0/16^- } mnt-routes: NOT-MY-MNT { ANY } Support for the previous syntax is unchanged. The extended syntax complies with RFC2725 which can be found at: ftp://ftp.ripe.net/rfc/rfc2725.txt For questions and comments please contact <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net>. Best regards, -- Denis Walker RIPE NCC Software Engineering Department

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Announcement: Changes to the ripe-dbm and auto-dbm acknowledgments
by Timur Bakeyev 23 Mar '04

23 Mar '04

Dear Colleagues, After 24 of March acknowledgments will be sent to all incoming mails send to <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net>. This feature was promised to the community on the last RIPE meeting. Addition of this new feature has required changes to the way how acknowledgments are sent from <auto-dbm(a)ripe.net>. We realize that such a change may have an impact to the way how mails are processed by our customers, so here is the short description of the key changes: * All the acknowledgments will be sent with the 'Return-Path:' set to <>. * 'From:' field will point to the unattended mail address <unread(a)ripe.net>. This should protect us from the replies of the automated mail tools and mailer daemons. We are using the 'Auto-Submitted:' field to denote auto generated mail responses, as it is proposed in the draft RFC "Recommendations for Automatic Responses to Electronic Mail", available at: ftp://ftp.ripe.net/internet-drafts/draft-moore-auto-email-response-05.txt The widely recognized 'Precedence: bulk' mail header is used as well. There are two types of acknowledgments - ACK and NOTIFY, that are send by <auto-dbm(a)ripe.net>. ACKs are sent as the direct result of the updates of the Whois data. NOTIFYs are sent in the case when the updated object has 'notify:' or 'mnt-by:' fields or when an update fails to pass authorization check. Please consult the RIPE Database Reference Manual for farther details: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/docs/databaseref-manual.html#3.5 For the mail of ACK type: * The 'Reply-To:' field will be set to the <auto-dbm(a)ripe.net>. * 'Auto-Submitted:' will be set to the 'auto-replied' value. For mails of NOTIFY type: * The 'Reply-To:' field will be set to <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net>. * 'Auto-Submitted' field will be set to the 'auto-generated' value. With best regards, Timur Bakeyev RIPE NCC

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IRT object creation is easy
by Jeroen Massar 17 Mar '04

17 Mar '04

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, For the sake of promotion of the IRT object and for checking out if it really is easy creating it I requested an IRT object from RIPE, who have assigned it without much problems. The main problem was me not filling the form in correctly and after that being so stupid not having added the correct PGP key *whistle* and indeed it won't authenticate if the mnt-irt authentication is not satisified, thus that part is now also succesfully tested. Anyhow, it *is* easy getting it and if we (SixXS) can get it, then any ISP should be able to get it. Almost all the inet6nums assigned to the SixXS project now have a mnt-irt on their /40's, the other POPs will follow. Thus I can now say that: $ lftp ftp://ftp.ripe.net/ripe/dbase/split $ ls - -rw-r--r-- 1 ftpuser ftpgroup 176490 Mar 16 01:42 ripe.db.inet6num.gz $ get ripe.db.inet6num.gz $ gunzip ripe.db.inet6num.gz $ grep -cE inet6num ripe.db.inet6num 4206 $ grep -cE "mnt-by:.*SIXXS-MNT" ripe.db.inet6num 1872 1872/4206*100% ~= 44.50% of the inet6num's is now protected by the IRT-SIXXS object by adding about 10 mnt-irt attributes to 10 different objects. $ grep -c "mnt-irt:" ripe.db.inet6num ripe.db.inet6num 102 Add 6 to that at the moment, as the updated objects are not in this splitted file yet. For that matter, there are also other ISP's adding mnt's: $ cat ripe.db.inet6num |grep -E mnt-irt | sort | uniq -c 21 mnt-irt: IRT-AA 1 mnt-irt: IRT-ACOnet-CERT 49 mnt-irt: IRT-DFN-CERT 5 mnt-irt: IRT-ITGATE 2 mnt-irt: IRT-SPEEDKOM1 1 mnt-irt: IRT-UK 23 mnt-irt: irt-CERT-NL It would also be quite fast to deploy more mnt-irt's by making the field mandatory for new allocations forcing ISP's to make use of the object. Because of the above I don't see a reason for a abuse-c or similar object. If there is a need for adding things like 'spam' or 'ddos' etc then these should be added to the IRT object and not to a new one. Now everybody go request an IRT object and get it over with. In total it will probably cost you a max of 2 hours and I think that can be really worth it as when it is being used we can then tell abuse tool writers where to look. Handy docs: http://www.ripe.net/ripe/meetings/ripe-47/presentations/ripe47-db-irt.pdf http://www.ripe.net/ripe/docs/irt-object.html Greets, Jeroen -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: Unfix PGP for Outlook Comment: Jeroen Massar / http://unfix.org/~jeroen/ iQBGBAERAgAQCRApqihSMz58IwUCQFZd8QAAxRMAn22KiziDgieySrdDQele+peb DXCPAJ9FwYSfaZy9XeU3SPK0gqkYM2a5LA== =ZDFN -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Re: [db-wg] IRT object creation is easy
by Wilfried Woeber, UniVie/ACOnet 17 Mar '04

17 Mar '04

>I wouldn't say this. I sent request day ago and unil now I didn't >get any response from people approving it. "... didn't get ANY response ..." I guess you should have got an automatic reply, with a ticket number?! Wilfried.

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person objects update
by Pieterjan d'Hertog 17 Mar '04

17 Mar '04

Dear all, Just a sugestion Could it be possible to include the full name of the person in the detailed explanations of the ripe-dbm robot when creating new person objects in the ripe database ? If I remember well, in the previous version this was done ? This will be very usefull to more easily parse the results of an update and to import them in our own database. Example : The following object(s) were processed SUCCESSFULLY: --- Create SUCCEEDED: [person] CS2321-RIPE ***Info: Authorisation for [person] CS2321-RIPE using mnt-by: authenticated by: SKYNETBE-MNT Could be : Create SUCCEEDED: [person] Chris Sanders NEW nic-hdl : CS2321-RIPE Thanks, --- Pieterjan d'Hertog, Belgacom ANS/ROC Internet Expertise Center

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SUCCESS: [New person: Test User]
by ripe-dbm＠ripe.net 16 Mar '04

16 Mar '04

> From: "Robert S. Plaul" <robert(a)plaul.de> > Subject: [New person: Test User] > Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:12:55 +0100 (CET) > Reply-To: robert(a)plaul.de > Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58.0403161611570.3525(a)klendathu.crossline.org> SUMMARY OF UPDATE: Number of objects found: 1 Number of objects processed successfully: 1 Create: 1 Modify: 0 Delete: 0 No Operation: 0 Number of objects processed with errors: 0 Create: 0 Modify: 0 Delete: 0 Syntax Errors: 0 DETAILED EXPLANATION: ***Warning: Invalid keyword(s) found: [New, person:, Test, User] ***Warning: All keywords were ignored ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The following object(s) were processed SUCCESSFULLY: --- Create SUCCEEDED: [person] TU107-RIPE ***Info: Authorisation for [person] TU107-RIPE using mnt-by: authenticated by: CROSSLINE-MNT ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ For assistance or clarification please contact: RIPE Database Administration <ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net> Regards, Robert S. Plaul -- RSP-RIPE

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person objects update
by Pieterjan d'Hertog 16 Mar '04

16 Mar '04

Dear all, Just a sugestion Could it be possible to include the full name of the person in the detailed explanations of the ripe-dbm robot when creating new person objects in the ripe database ? If I remember well, in the previous version this was done ? This will be very usefull to more easily parse the results of an update and to import them in our own database. Example : The following object(s) were processed SUCCESSFULLY: --- Create SUCCEEDED: [person] CS2321-RIPE ***Info: Authorisation for [person] CS2321-RIPE using mnt-by: authenticated by: SKYNETBE-MNT Could be : Create SUCCEEDED: [person] Chris Sanders NEW nic-hdl : CS2321-RIPE Thanks, --- Pieterjan d'Hertog, Belgacom ANS/ROC Internet Expertise Center

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 16 Mar '04

16 Mar '04

Niall O'Reilly wrote: > On 13 Mar 2004, at 03:33, der Mouse wrote: > >> >>> A low blow.... and also one that is incorrect. Look again, >>> "serenaders" rhymes (or is more strictly an assonance) with "made >>> us". >> >> Only in UK English. > > No; only in certain dialects of British English. This rhyme won't > work too well in Glasgow, or in the Welsh valleys. > > 8-) Niall Well, as I said, its really an assonance rather than a rhyme, the "a" in "serenaders" is an assonance with the "a" in "made us". It's a perfectly valid poetic device and very common in ballads, although possibly fights slightly shy of the RIPE database definition of a limerick. Nigel -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 14 Mar '04

14 Mar '04

Shane Kerr wrote: > Titley, Nigel wrote: >> >> Does the RIPE NCC have a view >> On provision of objects haiku? >> Are you bored and depressed >> And in need of a rest? >> Is this just too much extra to do? > > I think that I shall never see, > A class as lovely as a tree. > Trees like ash and bitternut, > May be only made by God but, > Objects are made by fools like me. > > [ With apologies to Alfred Joyce Kilmer ] > > > Anyway, we are certainly willing to implement any feature that the > community thinks is necessary, including but not limited to new > classes, attributes, access methods, etc. > > > Having said that, we have some problems with the current limerick > class. > > First, we are having trouble coming up with a good way to detect > whether limerick contents match the rhyming scheme. We can implement > this, although we will probably limit it to English (even though > there are Dutch, French, German, and other limericks), and will have > to make it a warning rather than an error, to allow for artistic > leave (to help people who think that "serenaders" rhyme with "join > us", like in LIM-NT13-1). A low blow.... and also one that is incorrect. Look again, "serenaders" rhymes (or is more strictly an assonance) with "made us". The last line "join in" rhymes with "the din". Some sort of soundex scheme would possibly have found this... however I agree that this is not an easy problem. > > Second, it is difficult for us to enforce the requirement that the > poem is humorous. I tried various algorithms, but none of the > software I came up with seemed to find any of the limericks funny at > all. Actually, I thought my computer was angry enough to swear at > me, until I remembered that I had tried Perl, and the punctuation > symbols were just the program itself. Well, as you know, I'm not at all sure that limericks are *required* to be humourous. I agree that the database definition says they are, but I feel that this is too limiting. I would propose modification of the specification to be "usually humourous". Of course if the verse-form proposal below is adopted, this can be dealt with in the descriptive limerick. > Anyway, I find the haiku an interesting proposal, but I do like the > generality of the poem proposal. I also agree that limiting the > types of poems to a pre-defined set of types. Therefore I suggest we > use the database to self-document the types of poems using a > meta-poem object. So poems would look like this: > > poem: [mandatory] [single] [primary/look-up key] > descr: [optional] [multiple] [ ] > form: [mandatory] [single] [inverse key] > text: [mandatory] [multiple] [ ] > admin-c: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > author: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > remarks: [optional] [multiple] [ ] > notify: [optional] [multiple] [inverse key] > mnt-by: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > changed: [mandatory] [multiple] [ ] > source: [mandatory] [single] [ ] > > The "form:" attribute will reference a poetic-form object: > > poetic-form: [mandatory] [single] [primary/look-up key] > descr: [optional] [multiple] [ ] > admin-c: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > tech-c: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > remarks: [optional] [multiple] [ ] > notify: [optional] [multiple] [inverse key] > mnt-by: [mandatory] [multiple] [inverse key] > changed: [mandatory] [multiple] [ ] > source: [mandatory] [single] [ ] > > The "descr:", "admin-c:", "tech-c:", "remarks:", "notify:", "mnt-by:", > "changed:", and "source:" attributes are required in all RPSL objects > according to RFC 2622. > > Initially we would have: > > poetic-form: VERSE-LIMERICK > desr: A limerick object represents a humorous poem that has > five lines and the rhyme scheme "aabba". > admin-c: LIM1-RIPE > tech-c: LIM1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > > poetic-form: VERSE-HAIKU > descr: A haiku object represents a poem that usually has three > lines with 5, 7 and 5 units. In languages other than > Japanese units are generally applied as syllables. > There is no rhyme scheme at all. > admin-c: HIKU1-RIPE > tech-c: HIKU1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > > We would restrict new poetic-form objects to creation by RIPE DBM, but > adding additional forms for sonnets, free verse, blank verse, and so > on, should be easy. If the community feels that identifying and > documenting poetic forms falls out of the scope of the RIPE NCC > activities, we can consider an alternative mechanism. Perhaps ICANN > would be able to perform this activity? I personally wouldn't trust ICANN to create any verse-form other than a writ, although in mitigation, we have an ex-speaker for the secret working group embedded as a mole within the organisation, and now may be the time to activate him. > In any case, we would need a conversion project to change the existing > limerick objects into poem objects. There are currently 152 of > these, so we need to be careful not to interfere with these in a way > that affect the production services that depend on them. Oh quite. Perhaps the RIPE NCC could come up with a migration plan. I think the above is an excellent proposal, and I further endorse the later suggestion that the description be in the verse form itself. Best regards -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by TAYON, Julien 11 Mar '04

11 Mar '04

Titley, Nigel <mailto:NTitley@flagtelecom.com> wrote: > Olaf M. Kolkman wrote: >> I'd suggest the descr: field to be in the poetic form itself. > >> >> Looking at the VERSE-SONNET we may have a problem. There are several >> subclasses that people may wish to use. The Italian Sonnet, The >> English Sonnet and more modern varieties. How do we indicate >> possible sub-classes in the object? >> >> poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET >> variety: ENGLISH >> descr: (Somebody needs to write an English Sonnet) I would propose to Keep It Simple Poetic form: MAJOR-[MINOR][-SUBMINOR][-...] Example : poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET-ITALIAN poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET-ENGLISH ex : Venitian variety of Italian Sonnet could be : >> poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET-ITALIAN-VENITIAN This way we can extend as much as we want the poetic form. This is based on the assumption that Poetric form are homothetic to a tree structure. Which cannot be proven according to Goedel's theorem however I would say it is sufficiently close to reality for me. We will let the work of demonstrating the tree like structure of poetic form to the mathematicians if you don't mind. Regards, -- julien.tayon(a)neuf.com +33 (0)1 70 18 14 45 Gestion des adresses IPs, BU Data n9uf telecom 40 - 42 Quai du Point du Jour 92659 Boulogne Billancourt

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 11 Mar '04

11 Mar '04

Olaf M. Kolkman wrote: > I'd suggest the descr: field to be in the poetic form itself. > > > poetic-form: VERSE-LIMERICK > desr: The object consists of a verse > in a format that is far from terse > a-a-b-b-a scheme > around a humorous theme > and is sometimes extremely perverse > > admin-c: LIM1-RIPE > tech-c: LIM1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > > poetic-form: VERSE-HAIKU > descr: The haiku object > only seven syllables > in its density > admin-c: HIKU1-RIPE > tech-c: HIKU1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > > > Looking at the VERSE-SONNET we may have a problem. There are several > subclasses that people may wish to use. The Italian Sonnet, The > English Sonnet and more modern varieties. How do we indicate possible > sub-classes in the object? > > poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET > variety: ENGLISH > descr: (Somebody needs to write an English Sonnet) I'm happy to take an action to write an English Sonnet > poetic-form: VERSE-SONNET > variety: ITALIAN > descr: (Somebody needs to write an Italian Sonnet) -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by TAYON, Julien 11 Mar '04

11 Mar '04

Olaf M. Kolkman <mailto:olaf@ripe.net> wrote: > I'd suggest the descr: field to be in the poetic form itself. > > > poetic-form: VERSE-LIMERICK > desr: The object consists of a verse > in a format that is far from terse > a-a-b-b-a scheme > around a humorous theme > and is sometimes extremely perverse > > admin-c: LIM1-RIPE > tech-c: LIM1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > > poetic-form: VERSE-HAIKU > descr: The haiku object > only seven syllables > in its density > admin-c: HIKU1-RIPE > tech-c: HIKU1-RIPE > mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT > changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 > source: RIPE > poetic-form: PROSE descr: Don't let the structure tie your tongue ; if you hate the masochism of verses, remember that you can feel free to use prose, and feel free because you are. admin-c: LIM1-RIPE tech-c: LIM1-RIPE mnt-by: RIPE-DBM-MNT changed: ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net 20040401 source: RIPE

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 11 Mar '04

11 Mar '04

Robert S. Plaul wrote: > On Wed, 10 Mar 2004, Titley, Nigel wrote: > >> All poems are limericks, true. >> There are no need for objects haiku >> This thread is amusing >> It set us all musing >> But we plainly have little to do >> >> Nigel > > The RIPE Database > Guardian of the limericks > Now needs the haiku > > The haiku object - > Greater flexibility > The virtue is clear Does the RIPE NCC have a view On provision of objects haiku? Are you bored and depressed And in need of a rest? Is this just too much extra to do? Nigel -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by TAYON, Julien 10 Mar '04

10 Mar '04

Titley, Nigel <mailto:NTitley@flagtelecom.com> wrote: > And I, as usual, having sent the email, and gone off to make a cup of > tea, realised that there was a humorous interpretation of your > reply..... > Pssst RTFM (RFC 1855) Regarding Mailing lists it is written : - Remember that the recipient is a human being whose culture, language, and humor have different points of reference from your own. Remember that date formats, measurements, and idioms may not travel well. Be especially careful with sarcasm. Therefore remember to be deadly serious. PS is it possible to have a web page with all limmericks from the RIPE whois DB ? PPS march the 31st +-1 day is a good day for a RFC :) Jul

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by TAYON, Julien 10 Mar '04

10 Mar '04

>> All poems are limericks, true. >> There are no need for objects haiku >> This thread is amusing >> It set us all musing >> But we plainly have little to do >> >> Nigel > > The RIPE Database > Guardian of the limericks > Now needs the haiku > > The haiku object - > Greater flexibility > The virtue is clear > > Robert Without Haiku, I pity that all verses are lame. Still, this thread is fun for a flame, misunderstanding is to blame it is all the same ... with poems Julien

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 10 Mar '04

10 Mar '04

Robert S. Plaul wrote: > On Tue, 9 Mar 2004, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > >> I can only say that I find it extremely unsporty that have not made >> the case for this new database object in haiku form then... > > That's because I first tried it in limerick form. These tries were so > exhausting (because of the restrictions of the limerick I described > before), that I did't even had the nerves to write haikus... Well, being a fan of the limerick form, as my previous posting has made clear, I present my argument in limerick form ;-) All poems are limericks, true. There are no need for objects haiku This thread is amusing It set us all musing But we plainly have little to do Nigel -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 09 Mar '04

09 Mar '04

Now I can certainly agree that March 31st + 1 would be a good day for an RFC As regards the web page, suggest you ask Bert's secretary. Titley, Nigel < mailto:NTitley@flagtelecom.com <mailto:NTitley@flagtelecom.com> > wrote: > And I, as usual, having sent the email, and gone off to make a cup of > tea, realised that there was a humorous interpretation of your > reply..... > Pssst RTFM (RFC 1855) Regarding Mailing lists it is written : - Remember that the recipient is a human being whose culture, language, and humor have different points of reference from your own. Remember that date formats, measurements, and idioms may not travel well. Be especially careful with sarcasm. Therefore remember to be deadly serious. PS is it possible to have a web page with all limmericks from the RIPE whois DB ? PPS march the 31st +-1 day is a good day for a RFC :) Jul ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 08 Mar '04

08 Mar '04

And I, as usual, having sent the email, and gone off to make a cup of tea, realised that there was a humorous interpretation of your reply..... Nigel -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 -----Original Message----- From: Robert S. Plaul [mailto:robert@plaul.de] Sent: 08 March 2004 15:49 To: db-wg(a)ripe.net Subject: RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object On Mon, 8 Mar 2004, Titley, Nigel wrote: > Anyone with even a meagre grasp of English should have been able to realise > that my response was intended humorously..... sigh.... no matter Sure. I possibly forgot to put some smilies in my answer. :) Robert > Nigel -- RSP-RIPE ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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RE: [db-wg] proposal: haiku object
by Titley, Nigel 08 Mar '04

08 Mar '04

Robert S. Plaul wrote: > On Mon, 8 Mar 2004, Titley, Nigel wrote: > >> Whilst agreeing that the limerick is possibly restricted in its >> metrical form, I cannot agree with the statement that it is >> restricted to humorous subjects, and hence at least one of the >> objections to its general use is fallacious. > > $ whois -v limerick > [...] > The limerick class: > > The limerick object represents a humorous poem that has five > lines and the rhyme scheme "aabba". > [...] > text > > Text of the limerick. Must be humorous, but not malicious or > insulting. > [...] > > Although IMHO the limerick _is_ considered a humorous poem in > literature, the limerick object is not. > >> My solution to the lack of alternative metrical objects would simply >> be to redefine all poetry as limericks. > > I think, this is a poor solution. Haikus (and Sonnets, etc. > respectively) are no limericks and never will be. Do you want the > whole world to laugh about the RIPE NCC for not knowing what a > limerick is? > >> Also it has the merit of offering increased >> employment opportunities for poets, who would see their services >> called upon to rewrite all existing poetry in the limerick form. > > Sometimes. Maybe. But not every haiku can be rewritten into a > limerick. Sometimes a haiku can say more than a thousand words. > >> Nigel > > Robert Anyone with even a meagre grasp of English should have been able to realise that my response was intended humorously..... sigh.... no matter Nigel -- Nigel Titley Peering Coordinator, FLAG Telecom +44 20 7478 9579 ********************************************************************** This e-mail message is confidential and is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above and contains information which is or may be confidential, non-public or legally privileged. Any dissemination or distribution of this message other than to its intended recipient is strictly prohibited. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose the contents to any other person. If you have received this message in error, please notify us by email to postmaster(a)flagtelecom.com immediately and delete the original message and all copies from all locations in your computer systems. This e-mail has been swept by Mailsweeper TM for viruses. However, FLAG Telecom cannot accept liability for any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. ********************************************************************** This message has been scanned for viruses by MailControl - www.mailcontrol.com

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