- db-wg - mailman.ripe.net

New NWI for geofeed?
by denis walker 14 Apr '22

14 Apr '22

Colleagues [Apologies for the length of this email...] The chairs would like to suggest creating a new NWI for the "geofeed:" attribute and suggest the following draft Problem statement and Solution definition. If there is agreement on this the RIPE NCC will do an impact assessment including legal review and summary of what the other RIRs are doing. There has already been quite a discussion in the WG on this issue with a lot of support. So hopefully we can reach a consensus quickly, at least on setting up the NWI and starting the impact assessment. Having read the latest draft IETF docs, there are some outstanding questions. Comments and changes are welcome... cheers denis co-chair DB-WG Problem statement Associating an approximate physical location with an IP address has proven to be a challenge to solve within the current constraints of the RIPE Database. Over the years the community has chosen to consider addresses in the RIPE Database to relate to entities in the assignment process itself, not the subsequent actual use of IP addresses after assignment. The working group is asked to consider whether the RIPE Database can be used as a springboard for parties wishing to correlate geographical information with IP addresses by allowing structured references in the RIPE Database towards information outside the RIPE Database which potentially helps answer Geo IP Location queries The IETF is currently discussing an update to RPSL to add a new attribute "geofeed: url". The url will reference a csv file containing location data. Some users have already started to make use of this feature via the "remarks: geofeed: url". It is never a good idea to try to overload structured data into the free format "remarks:" attribute. This has been done in the past, for example with abuse contact details before we introduced the "abuse-c:" attribute. There is no way to regulate what database users put into "remarks:" attributes. So even if the new "geofeed:" attribute is not agreed, the url data will still be included in the RIPE Database. Currently there are 24,408 INETNUM and 516,354 INET6NUM objects containing a "remarks: geofeed: url" attribute in the database. These have 7,731 distinct values in the INETNUMs and 1,045 distinct values in the INET6NUMs. Solution definition Implement a new "geofeed:" attribute according to the IETF's definition. Although the IETF has not yet concluded discussions on this attribute we can still implement it in the RIPE Database RPSL data definition. The RIPE Database already has many local differences to the RPSL standard. As expressed in the Problem statement, users are already using the geofeed data by overloading the "remarks:" attribute. That is a dirty hack which should be avoided. An invalid formated url will be a syntax error. The RIPE NCC will perform a one time conversion of the existing data to convert "remarks: geofeed: url" to "geofeed: url". If an update then contains a "remarks: geofeed: url" attribute, the update will be successful and the response should include an appropriate Warning message. At some point in the (near) future, this could be changed to an update failure as a syntax error. An update containing a "geofeed:" and a "remarks: geofeed:" attribute or more than one "remarks: geofeed:" will be a syntax error. The resource holder should be able to create, modify, delete the "geofeed:" attribute in allocation objects. Questions: -Should the database software do any checks on the existence/reachability of the url as part of the update with an error if the check fails? -Should the RIPE NCC do any periodic repeat checks on the continued existence/reachability of the url? -Should the RIPE NCC do any periodic checks on the content structure of the csv file referenced by the url? -Should the Solution definition define how this will be adopted into RDAP or should we simply ask the RIPE NCC to define this in their impact assessment? -The RIPE Database contains hierarchical address space objects. Should it be acceptable for "geofeed:" attributes to exist at multiple levels within a specific hierarchy? -Suppose a geofeed csv file referenced by a /16 INETNUM object contains location data for the whole /16. Then a more specific /24 INETNUM object references another geofeed csv file that contains conflicting location data for this /24. Should this be a concern for the RIPE Database? -Should geofeed data be inherited? If you query for a /24 that does not contain a "geofeed:" attribute, but a less specific /16 does contain a "geofeed:" attribute, should this data be returned? In other words could it be used in a similar way to "abuse-c:"? -Thinking ahead to how people will actually deploy this data and what short cuts they could make. It is said that when reading a geofeed csv file, consumers of the data should ignore all data within that file not directly concerning the address space queried in the RIPE Database. Could you therefore create a single csv file with location data for all your address space and reference the same file in all your RIPE Database address objects? The address space owner could rely on the data consumer to pick out the correct piece of data for the relevant address space. The manager of the csv file then only has to work with one file. If this is possible and does happen (which the IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' seems to suggest is possible for unsigned geofeed data), would it therefore make sense to apply "geofeed:" hierarchically as with "abuse-c:"? Allow a single, default "geofeed:" attribute in the ORGANISATION object to be applied to all that organisations address space, with the option of specific localised "geofeed:" attributes in address space objects. That could be a neater solution, and easier to setup, than applying thousands of references to the same geofeed file at a more specific level in the database. -Relating to the above 3 questions, should geofeed data only be considered applicable if returned by a specific geofeed locater application which takes into account the hierarchical nature of address space in the database? Otherwise do the standard database query mechanisms have to take into account this hierarchy and locate the most specific "geofeed:" attribute from the less specific objects? -Should/could the RIPE Database return the csv file as part of the query? If so should the file be cached (for how long?) to avoid too many downloads? -Should we only allow HTTPS urls? (Which the IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' seems to suggest) -Should the RIPE NCC go ahead and implement this now, with our own set of RIPE rules? Or should we try to coordinate this and agree a set of common rules between all the RIRs before any deployment in the RIPE Database? -For the legal review, there are 2 statements in the IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' which may be of concern: *[RFC8805] geofeed data may reveal the approximate location of an IP address, which might in turn reveal the approximate location of an individual user. Unfortunately, [RFC8805] provides no privacy guidance on avoiding or ameliorating possible damage due to this exposure of the user. In publishing pointers to geofeed files as described in this document the operator should be aware of this exposure in geofeed data and be cautious. All the privacy considerations of [RFC8805] Section 4 apply to this document. *It is significant that geofeed data may have finer granularity than the inetnum: which refers to them. It is clear that the RIPE NCC cannot prevent this data being referenced by objects in the RIPE Database. It is already being referenced from "remarks:" attributes. Perhaps the RIPE NCC should require (as part of their service agreement) that it's members obtain written consent from their customers to publish this location data, or at least inform the customers in writing that it will be published. Also, although RFC8805 says postcode is deprecated it is still provided for in the csv files. So anyone can still enter location data to this detail. -The IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' suggests that geofeed information 'will be' available in bulk accessed whois data. In view of the privacy concerns above, is this likely? -The IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' says "To minimize the load on RIR whois [RFC3912] services, use of the RIR's FTP [RFC0959] services SHOULD be the preferred access." Is the RIPE NCC expected to download all the geofeed files and make them available through their FTP service? -The IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds' states that consumers of the geofeed data MUST NOT access this data in real time via the RPSL servers 'too frequently' or at 'magic times like midnight'. Some users will do whatever they want to do if they are able to do, regardless of any statements to the contrary. Should the RIPE NCC enforce such access rules by some means? References The IETF doc 'Finding geofeeds': https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-finding-geofeeds/?includ… geofeed file format: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc8805.html

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Future of "geoloc:"
by denis walker 13 Apr '22

13 Apr '22

Colleagues Now we have the "geofeed:" attribute, what should we do with "geoloc:"? Right now far more people are using "geoloc:" than "geofeed:". denis$ zgrep "^geofeed:" ~/Desktop/ripe.db.inetnum.gz | wc -l 289 denis$ zgrep "^remarks:\s*geofeed" ~/Desktop/ripe.db.inetnum.gz | wc -l 13 Although from the 289 there are only 161 unique organisations. denis$ zgrep "^geoloc:" ~/Desktop/ripe.db.inetnum.gz | wc -l 35453 cheers denis co-chair DB-WG

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Decision on NWI-4 INETNUM status values
by denis walker 11 Apr '22

11 Apr '22

Colleagues For many years people have been asking for a way to assign a whole allocation without having to create 2 smaller assignments. The situation is more relevant now with so many /24 allocations. After the RIPE NCC rejected the idea of a dual primary key, for technical reasons, there were two options on the table. Making the "status:" attribute multiple or creating a new status value 'ALLOCATED-ASSIGNED PA'. No one has objected to either of these options. The co-chairs therefore recommend the option put forward by the RIPE NCC to add a new status value 'ALLOCATED-ASSIGNED PA'. Of the two options, this is probably the simplest and likely to cause less problems with user's scripts that parse objects. If there are no objections to this, the co-chairs now ask the RIPE NCC to produce an impact/implementation report to add this new status value and include the business rules to restrict it's use. We will then seek a final approval from the community on the report. cheers denis co-chair DB-WG

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Whois Release 1.102.3
by Edward Shryane 31 Mar '22

31 Mar '22

Dear Colleagues, We have deployed Whois release 1.102.3 to production to fix a vulnerability in the Spring Framework library (Spring4Shell). The only change from the current Whois release 1.102.2 is to update the spring dependency from 5.3.13 to 5.3.18. Whois is not vulnerable to the already known exploit, but we updated in case further exploits appear. Regards Ed Shryane RIPE NCC

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RIPE Database Quarterly Planning Q2 2022
by Edward Shryane 31 Mar '22

31 Mar '22

Dear colleagues, We have published our quarterly plan for Q2 2022 for the RIPE Database: https://www.ripe.net/manage-ips-and-asns/db/quarterly-planning This quarter we are working on usability improvements to the website, and we will announce on the list when this has finished. Our goals here are to make it clear what we are working on in the coming months, and also to get discussion around those plans so we can make developments based on community input. If you have comments or questions around our plans, we hope you'll discuss with us on the list or you can always contact us directly at ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net. Regards, Ed Shryane RIPE NCC

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Protecting References to Objects in the RIPE Database
by Edward Shryane 29 Mar '22

29 Mar '22

Dear Colleagues, Currently the "mnt-ref:" attribute only protects references to organisation objects in the RIPE database, by specifying which maintainer(s) can authorise the reference. This means it is possible to make references to other object types without any authorisation, for example: * Refer to another organisation's maintainer * Refer to another organisation's abuse-c contact * Refer to any technical contact, admin contact, zone contact Since these references do not need authorisation, it is open to misuse, creating the impression that an unrelated party is responsible for that object. I propose that the "mnt-ref:" attribute be added (as an optional attribute) to other object types to allow references to be authorised: * person * role * mntner * irt This proposal does not eliminate misuse (e.g. contact information can still be copied into a separate object), but protects references to existing objects. If the DB-WG agrees to this proposal, I will prepare a more detailed impact analysis for review. Regards Ed Shryane RIPE NCC

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RIPE NCC Open House: Feedback on our Unified User Interface
by Michela Galante 28 Mar '22

28 Mar '22

Dear colleagues, On Wednesday 6 April from 10:00 to 11:30 UTC, we invite users of RIPE Atlas, RIPE Database, RIPE Labs, RIPE NCC Academy, LIR Portal, RPKI and RIPEstat to give us feedback on our unified user interface. This Open House session will focus on the user interface that was launched in 2020. Our goal is to unify the user experience across all platforms to make it easier and faster for users to navigate our services. You can register for the event at: https://meeting-registration.ripe.net/meeting-pub/registration?0&meetingId=… More information is available on our website: https://www.ripe.net/participate/meetings/open-house/ripe-ncc-open-house-fe… Best regards, Michela Galante RIPE NCC

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Last call and final reminder for nominations to the 2022 Rob Blokzijl Award
by Carsten Schiefner 14 Mar '22

14 Mar '22

[Apologies for cross-posting to various RIPE lists] Dear DB WG members - this is the last call and final reminder for nominations to the 2022 Rob Blokzijl Award that will be accepted until this Friday, 18th March, at 23:59 UTC. In seeking nominations for this prestigious award, which was created to celebrate Rob's contributions to the development of the Internet, the Award Committee (https://rob-blokzijl-foundation.org/2021/11/22/2022-award-committee/) is interested to receive nominations of those who have reflected Rob's approach in either a technical or operational capacity. Please give some consideration to nominating individuals - but also teams and groups of people! - in your own community and/or the wider industry in the RIPE region who, in your opinion, deserve to be recognised for their work to make the internet and/or internet community better. To specifically have this emphasised again after some according queries: nominations of teams and groups of people are very well possible and wished for as well in case their collective work would match the criteria of the call as laid out! The Award Committee is particularly interested to receive nominations of contributors who, in addition to their own contributions, have also supported and enabled others anywhere in the world. Also, the Award Committee would like to encourage those making nominations to consider not only the community members in the later stages of their careers or who are widely known but also those who may have contributed greatly in the springtime of their career or discreetly for the greater good or who may be considered to be part of an unrepresented group. And last but not least: those of you who previously have made a nomination other than Wilfried Woeber, the 2018 awardee, may want to consider resubmitting a nomination. The complete details of the call and the nomination process can be found at: https://rob-blokzijl-foundation.org/2021/11/25/call-for-nominations-2022/ Best wishes and kind regards Carsten (on behalf of the Award Committee)

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Removing Apache Proxy Servers from DB Services
by Edward Shryane 02 Mar '22

02 Mar '22

Dear Colleagues, Next Tuesday, 1st March, the DB team plan to remove the Apache httpd proxy servers for the following services: * https://apps.db.ripe.net/ * https://rdap.db.ripe.net/ * https://rest.db.ripe.net/ * https://syncupdates.db.ripe.net/ This will allow us to simplify our production environment, reducing operational work and maintenance. Be aware that URL validation will be stricter after this change. For example, the following will return a 400 Bad Request: * Empty path segments (i.e. '//') * Encoded path separators (i.e. %2F for '/') * Encoded query separator (i.e. %3F for '?') Please test your client using the TEST environment: https://www.ripe.net/manage-ips-and-asns/db/ripe-test-database or the Release Candidate environment: https://www.ripe.net/manage-ips-and-asns/db/release-notes/rc-release-candid… Regards Ed Shryane RIPE NCC

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Clear up of old issues - Whiepages
by denis walker 01 Mar '22

01 Mar '22

Colleagues The co-chairs recently had a zoom meeting with the RIPE NCC. One of the things we discussed was clearing up a number of old issues. We need to clear the deck and move on with new and perhaps more relevant issues. We will address a number of issues for the last time. In some cases the chairs will make a recommendation. As these are quite old issues, we will take silence as consensus for the chair's recommendation. The first issue is Whitepages. This is a feature from about 10+ years ago. It was intended to preserve the PERSON object in the RIPE Database and protect it from automatic deletion if it is not referenced from any operational data. It was to use the RIPE Database as a phone book for well known people in the industry who may not be resource holders. There are many other ways to provide such contact details today. It was only ever used by a handful of people. The RIPE NCC now has other ways to preserve ROLE objects if needed, for example if used by RIPE Atlas users. The chairs recommend removing this feature from the RIPE Database. If you need a ROLE object to be preserved, contact ripe-dbm(a)ripe.net to discuss. cheers denis co-chair DB-WG

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