Folks, Right, nobody, right now, is talking about banning anyone. Can we all please step back from the way this conversation is going and discuss the facts around what is happening. Your opinions on governments or groups are yours, that's fine, but the discussion is not enhanced by them becoming the focus. Please remember, as I said, that this mailing list is covered by the RIPE Community Code of Conduct which is here: https://www.ripe.net/participate/mail/ripe-mailing-list-ripe-forum-code-of-c... I would really prefer if we could ensure that everyone feels welcome to participate in discussion on this mailing list. Thanks, Brian Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG Brian Nisbet Network Operations Manager HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network 1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin D01 X8N7, Ireland +35316609040 brian.nisbet@heanet.ie www.heanet.ie Registered in Ireland, No. 275301. CRA No. 20036270

-----Original Message----- From: anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net> On Behalf Of ox Sent: Wednesday 30 May 2018 13:59 To: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] GDPR - positive effects on email abuse

On Wed, 30 May 2018 13:37:20 +0100 Malcolm Hutty <malcolm@linx.net> wrote:

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Please stop. This is not helpful.

so, what you are saying is that I should stop sending email? or, whatever my opinions are, has to only be helpful?

or if you say something, then it has to be accepted?

I am a human person, I have feelings and when my feelings are insulted, I react. I am not a particularly helpful person.

But, I do not tell other people, in public, that their opinions are rubbish.

In fact, I do not recall personally insulting anyone on this list, over many years.

I also do not compare the opinions of other people to evil people in my country.

I am tired of people demanding respect but treating other people like crap.

I am tired of wolves hiding in sheep clothing.

I am tired of being quiet.

I am tired of people twisting words, making up fake news.

Like you just did Malcolm,

Simply saying: "accusations that your political opponents abduct babies"

Without being responsible for your words.

You should apologise Malcolm, but you will not.

There is no reason why I should simply accept your word from on high.

So, ban me from this wg and this email list then. Even though I have not abused anyone.

ban me for taking offense, feeling hurt and speaking the truth.

Please do that. Show me you can? You know you want to.

...

On 30/05/2018 13:36, ox wrote:

...

On Wed, 30 May 2018 13:06:57 +0100 Malcolm Hutty <malcolm@linx.net> wrote:

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But can we please leave out accusations that your political opponents abduct babies? That surely crosses the line. The trope is, at least,

there are no accusations of any kind.

and, to be more clear, nobody said anything about abducting.

Factually: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/28/us/trump-immigrant-children- lost. html

The USA does forcefully remove babies from the arms of their mothers.

Furthermore: The US Government does "lose" 000 these children.

This is not accusations. And, mentioning the facts, as they are, undisputed, does not cross any line.

And who are 'political opponents' ?

Please do bother actually reading the argument? or ask if you did not understand it?

Simply stating that, in your opinion, there are accusations and abductions are pathetic in itself as it completely ignores or addresses the salient fact that Ronald said my opinion is 'rubbish' and that my opinion is equal to what "Fox" blasts out and "Fox" (by implication, Republicans, in America states.

It is my choice to find that offensive as by implication my opinion equates that which the USA (and Fox) is promoting.

As it disgusts me, it is an insult and it is offensive.

...

Older Than Feudalism, and very likely Older Than Dirt, and as always raising it serves no purpose other than to demonise one group of people and to smear another by association, thereby shutting down the conversation. It's not an argument, it's a transparent attempt to exclude. Please stop.

Please stop what? Speaking the truth?

Taking offense at people equating my opinions to rubbish?

Please be more clear in what you are stating Malcolm? What would you like to stop?

...

More generally, I believe this discussion would be improved if people stopped throwing around terms like "European" and "Republican" as though they are terms of abuse. Our community is, and should be, open to all.

Who said anything to the contrary?

Andre