On Set 23, 2016 Shane wrote: "But to check that abuse complaints are actually handled is quite difficult." On Sep 26, 2016 I wrote about Shane: "In fact it's a bit laborious but very very EASY." On Sep 26 Norman asked: "What is very easy? Report to whom?" Norman, to check that abuse complaints ARE ACTUALLY HANDLED is NOT quite difficult, it is very very easy. Report to whom? Let’s talk about spam: If you denounce a spammer TO HIS ISP < retransmitter, originating sender ou website host > and the spamming stop... great! Problem solved! If the spamming continues, you must to ALERT his ISP. You must to copy and paste the full header e full message, of the new spam and send to his ISP *customer ISP* But, if the spamming, same spammer and same ISP, happening for the third time, well... Have no doubt about that! This Provider does not respect their contracts, AUPs and ASPs. It does not respect those who denounce and should be treated as a criminal.

From there you have no one else to turn to. Or rather, you have but without any consequence. Complaining to RIPE... would do better complaining to Pope Francisco. The reasons are economic and absolute lack of ethics and honesty. I have already given you the reasons. Like me and Shane said the solution depends on a change in the attitude of ISPs, which has the support of governments, Registrars and media where big providers as Microsoft, Amazon, SoftlayerIBM pour tons of money on advertising *my speech not Shane*. That's why I suggested practice spam with denounces. We must continue denouncing and copying for all institutions that I have related to you. Copy for Congressman who you voted for. Copy to the media.Do not copy to the RIPE it will be thrown in the trash, it will not be sent to the "anti-abuse" group. Only civil society can pressure governments to enact laws that make crimes such abuses.

Norman, do you remember the hint I gave you? Read between the lines? I'll give you another example:

On Sep 26, 2016 Brian Nisbet wrote: I would love to hear your opinions, and those of others, and perhaps, baby-step by baby-step, WE CAN CONTINUE TO IMPROVE THINGS, even if the end result is not what we envisaged in the beginning.

To improve for whom, pale face? Things never improved. Things always changed for the worse. Abuse on the Internet has always been on the rise. The achieved levels are alarming. NEVER SO FEW DID SO MUCH EVIL TO SO MANY IN THE HISTORY OF MANKIND.

The real world, sadly, doesn't work like that.

Look, we are talking the same thing. The difference is that he does not dare to call a spade a spade. And Mr Nisbet, there is no DARK motives behind everything you do, as you wrote. You are always crystal clear... between the lines! Marilson