Fwd: Re: botnet controllers
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too. I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
I would not be so quick in judging Spamhaus to be evil or even worse, illegal. We've encountered C2s (malware control server) which are pure evil and illegal in most countries but running over VPNs. Having a VPN service provider who claims not being able to stop service for the customer who is running C2, that I would say is not legal. Therefore, it's important to make sure we take care of our own services first before we look at what others do. KR Tonu CERT-EE On 08.07.2020 21:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
If you can demonstrate that those are fake reports, then you have a base for a court claim, even in Andorra. LEA has the responsibility to investigate and find the real people behind that. El 8/7/20 20:42, "anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net en nombre de info@fos-vpn.org" <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net en nombre de info@fos-vpn.org> escribió: All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too. I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion. ********************************************** IPv4 is over Are you ready for the new Internet ? http://www.theipv6company.com The IPv6 Company This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.
and as I said to you in the email, it is great that you are running a totally free VPN service with no money or income from it, so that if the customers don't pay you then you would have no way of stopping them from accessing it. ... or are you? On 9/07/2020 4:46 am, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
Hi Info Maybe one of the reasons some Non-logging VPNs end up on blacklist sis that the Non-Looging phrase is just an excuse to not go after misuse. The rights to privacy and free speech do not mean anything goes. You can fight abuse without violating privacy. But of course that's not for free, you need abuse people that investigate and they cost money. Sadly, many of these VPNs frankly just don't care, using the lame excuse that they are protecting fundamental rights, when in fact they are just don't care or take responsibility. I don't agree with everything Spamhaus does, but I find them responsible and and always found a way way to talk to them. I was reluctant writing this, because I'm not sure this discussion will lead anywhere. It's one of these where opinions seem to already have been formed. But you start accusing people of posting anonymously. I totally agree this is bad, but then, who are you, info@fos-vpn.org? You don't seem to offer a name yourself. I find this a bit hypocritical. Best Serge On 08.07.20 20:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
-- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org
Hi, I would like to make a recommendation to all of you. The EU has opened a consultation on the Digital Service Act, a future regulation that aims to review the role of digital platforms and technoly intermediaries and establish regulations to protect the rights of users and companies that operate online wherever is required. Of course, the role of ISPs or organizations like RIPE NCC can be subject to asses. The aim of the European Commission with the consultation is to identify situations that put at risk the safety and rights of users or the rights of companies to compete in a fair market. To those of you who know that this discussion, repeated so many times in this WG, will not reach to anything, I would like to invite you to dedicate a little of your time to answering the consultation. You will find it at: https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/better-regulation/have-your-say/initiatives/12... Best, ángel Grupo Godó de Comunicación ________________________________ De: anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net> en nombre de Serge Droz via anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> Enviado: jueves, 9 de julio de 2020 8:29 Para: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> Asunto: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers Hi Info Maybe one of the reasons some Non-logging VPNs end up on blacklist sis that the Non-Looging phrase is just an excuse to not go after misuse. The rights to privacy and free speech do not mean anything goes. You can fight abuse without violating privacy. But of course that's not for free, you need abuse people that investigate and they cost money. Sadly, many of these VPNs frankly just don't care, using the lame excuse that they are protecting fundamental rights, when in fact they are just don't care or take responsibility. I don't agree with everything Spamhaus does, but I find them responsible and and always found a way way to talk to them. I was reluctant writing this, because I'm not sure this discussion will lead anywhere. It's one of these where opinions seem to already have been formed. But you start accusing people of posting anonymously. I totally agree this is bad, but then, who are you, info@fos-vpn.org? You don't seem to offer a name yourself. I find this a bit hypocritical. Best Serge On 08.07.20 20:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
-- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org
Hi ángel Thanks, good advice indeed. I second you to make your views known to the Commission. Best Serge On 09.07.20 09:16, Angel Fernandez Pineda wrote:
Hi, I would like to make a recommendation to all of you. The EU has opened a consultation on the Digital Service Act, a future regulation that aims to review the role of digital platforms and technoly intermediaries and establish regulations to protect the rights of users and companies that operate online wherever is required. Of course, the role of ISPs or organizations like RIPE NCC can be subject to asses.
The aim of the European Commission with the consultation is to identify situations that put at risk the safety and rights of users or the rights of companies to compete in a fair market.
To those of you who know that this discussion, repeated so many times in this WG, will not reach to anything, I would like to invite you to dedicate a little of your time to answering the consultation. You will find it at:
https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/better-regulation/have-your-say/initiatives/12...
Best, ángel Grupo Godó de Comunicación
------------------------------------------------------------------------ *De:* anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net> en nombre de Serge Droz via anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> *Enviado:* jueves, 9 de julio de 2020 8:29 *Para:* anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> *Asunto:* Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers Hi Info
Maybe one of the reasons some Non-logging VPNs end up on blacklist sis that the Non-Looging phrase is just an excuse to not go after misuse. The rights to privacy and free speech do not mean anything goes.
You can fight abuse without violating privacy. But of course that's not for free, you need abuse people that investigate and they cost money. Sadly, many of these VPNs frankly just don't care, using the lame excuse that they are protecting fundamental rights, when in fact they are just don't care or take responsibility.
I don't agree with everything Spamhaus does, but I find them responsible and and always found a way way to talk to them.
I was reluctant writing this, because I'm not sure this discussion will lead anywhere. It's one of these where opinions seem to already have been formed.
But you start accusing people of posting anonymously. I totally agree this is bad, but then, who are you, info@fos-vpn.org?
You don't seem to offer a name yourself. I find this a bit hypocritical.
Best Serge
On 08.07.20 20:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
-- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org
-- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org
Angel, Thank you for this, a very useful prompt! Brian Brian Nisbet Service Operations Manager HEAnet CLG, Ireland's National Education and Research Network 1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin D01 X8N7, Ireland +35316609040 brian.nisbet@heanet.ie www.heanet.ie Registered in Ireland, No. 275301. CRA No. 20036270 ________________________________ From: anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net> on behalf of Angel Fernandez Pineda <anfernandez@grupogodo.com> Sent: Thursday 9 July 2020 08:16 To: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers CAUTION[External]: This email originated from outside of the organisation. Do not click on links or open the attachments unless you recognise the sender and know the content is safe. Hi, I would like to make a recommendation to all of you. The EU has opened a consultation on the Digital Service Act, a future regulation that aims to review the role of digital platforms and technoly intermediaries and establish regulations to protect the rights of users and companies that operate online wherever is required. Of course, the role of ISPs or organizations like RIPE NCC can be subject to asses. The aim of the European Commission with the consultation is to identify situations that put at risk the safety and rights of users or the rights of companies to compete in a fair market. To those of you who know that this discussion, repeated so many times in this WG, will not reach to anything, I would like to invite you to dedicate a little of your time to answering the consultation. You will find it at: https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/better-regulation/have-your-say/initiatives/12417-Digital-Services-Act-deepening-the-Internal-Market-and-clarifying-responsibilities-for-digital-services/public-consultation<https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fec.europa.eu%2Finfo%2Flaw%2Fbetter-regulation%2Fhave-your-say%2Finitiatives%2F12417-Digital-Services-Act-deepening-the-Internal-Market-and-clarifying-responsibilities-for-digital-services%2Fpublic-consultation&data=02%7C01%7C%7C7bf6cb706d5e48b22dc008d823d80370%7Ccd9e8269dfb648e082538b7baf8d3391%7C0%7C0%7C637298758391658981&sdata=LacRZpFsgQqCcAOQ%2Bzhu64d0ob463OO9IC7MJeXOAMQ%3D&reserved=0> Best, ángel Grupo Godó de Comunicación ________________________________ De: anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net> en nombre de Serge Droz via anti-abuse-wg <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> Enviado: jueves, 9 de julio de 2020 8:29 Para: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net <anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> Asunto: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] Fwd: Re: botnet controllers Hi Info Maybe one of the reasons some Non-logging VPNs end up on blacklist sis that the Non-Looging phrase is just an excuse to not go after misuse. The rights to privacy and free speech do not mean anything goes. You can fight abuse without violating privacy. But of course that's not for free, you need abuse people that investigate and they cost money. Sadly, many of these VPNs frankly just don't care, using the lame excuse that they are protecting fundamental rights, when in fact they are just don't care or take responsibility. I don't agree with everything Spamhaus does, but I find them responsible and and always found a way way to talk to them. I was reluctant writing this, because I'm not sure this discussion will lead anywhere. It's one of these where opinions seem to already have been formed. But you start accusing people of posting anonymously. I totally agree this is bad, but then, who are you, info@fos-vpn.org? You don't seem to offer a name yourself. I find this a bit hypocritical. Best Serge On 08.07.20 20:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote:
All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and our upstreams. Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used for abusive activities, too.
I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the list of SBL entries which he also posted here. Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else would be sneaky in my opinion.
-- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org<https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.first.org%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C7bf6cb706d5e48b22dc008d823d80370%7Ccd9e8269dfb648e082538b7baf8d3391%7C0%7C0%7C637298758391658981&sdata=4n5ae2kX7r4qSW5BmJuMUKaHLTbetjhaeFodXh%2FLQb8%3D&reserved=0>
+1 on all points That someone who won't even disclose who they are has the gall to demand that Spamhaus or anyone else should is hilarious and disturbing. -- Mr Michele Neylon Blacknight Solutions Hosting, Colocation & Domains https://www.blacknight.com https://blacknight.blog / http://ceo.hosting/ Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072 Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090 ------------------------------- Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park, Sleaty Road, Graiguecullen, Carlow, R93 X265,Ireland Company No.: 370845 On 09/07/2020, 07:30, "anti-abuse-wg on behalf of Serge Droz via anti-abuse-wg" <anti-abuse-wg-bounces@ripe.net on behalf of anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net> wrote: Hi Info Maybe one of the reasons some Non-logging VPNs end up on blacklist sis that the Non-Looging phrase is just an excuse to not go after misuse. The rights to privacy and free speech do not mean anything goes. You can fight abuse without violating privacy. But of course that's not for free, you need abuse people that investigate and they cost money. Sadly, many of these VPNs frankly just don't care, using the lame excuse that they are protecting fundamental rights, when in fact they are just don't care or take responsibility. I don't agree with everything Spamhaus does, but I find them responsible and and always found a way way to talk to them. I was reluctant writing this, because I'm not sure this discussion will lead anywhere. It's one of these where opinions seem to already have been formed. But you start accusing people of posting anonymously. I totally agree this is bad, but then, who are you, info@fos-vpn.org? You don't seem to offer a name yourself. I find this a bit hypocritical. Best Serge On 08.07.20 20:46, info@fos-vpn.org wrote: > All I would like from Spamhaus is to stop publishing fake SBL records in > order to discredit us and to use that to put pressure both upon us and > our upstreams. > Non-logging VPN services are as legal within the EU as Exit Nodes of the > Tor Network (which have massive abuse entries in various data bases, > especially the larger ones) and public WiFi Hotspots, which can be used > for abusive activities, too. > > I don't know who "PP" is (probably the same person which posts under the > nickname "Petras Simeon" on Twitter and on various boards), but he > contacted us and our upstream providers without telling his name, just > using this email address: phishphucker@storey.ovh and sending us the > list of SBL entries which he also posted here. > Don't know if he's working for Spamhaus or not, but before attacking > others publicly, people should reveal their true identity, anything else > would be sneaky in my opinion. > -- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org
participants (8)
-
Angel Fernandez Pineda -
Brian Nisbet -
info＠fos-vpn.org -
JORDI PALET MARTINEZ -
Michele Neylon - Blacknight -
PP -
Serge Droz -
Tõnu Tammer