Hello List I've been, mostly passive, on this list for quite a while. I must say we really excel in terms of abusing each other. And I agree with Ronald, we seem to fail coming forward with even partial solutions to prevent abuse. I am disappointed by the tone on this list. One can, and should disagree on topics, but one should not loose the common goal, reduce abuse in our case. I fear we are doing just that. Maybe the striving for a perfect solution, that has no side effects is not the right approach. Criminals don't mind side effects, and maybe rather than avoiding them we should try to control and minimize them. While I'm not the right person to determine what topics are appropriate for the list, I don't see any harm in asking people to maybe consider viable candidates for board positions. We can discuss the tone. This group repeatedly pointed out the importance of a bottom up, democratic governance structure for RIPE. I'd argue, that a good selection of candidates for such a position is the basis for this. I would hope for the abuse WG to become a little more pragmatic and positive thinking when trying to come up with solutions to fight abuse. "Divide and conquer" is a concept criminals thrive on too. Having said that, I wish everyone good health and and a hopefully enjoyable weekend. Best Serge -- Dr. Serge Droz Chair of the FIRST Board of Directors https://www.first.org