Vesna sent me a request to join this group and with your meeting coming up, I would like to put some last minute issues in: XSServer, a German virtual private server / dedicated server hosting provider, is starting to be the new king when it comes to ignored abuse complaints. A lot of their IP ranges are being used for spam, including email and the new comment spam on websites / forums (mainly Wordpress). The simple solution taken by webmasters and system administrators are to create a list of offending IPs to have for comparison purposes, check a potential IP against that and use that IP to block the spam from going through. That doesn't really work in the long term. Examples of offending IPs are: 109.230.216.225 109.230.220.34 109.230.217.166 109.230.220.95 I could find more but I just searched 109.230 in my email client and found these. I have noticed also that a lot of RIPE IPs also have invalid contact information or no abuse / admin information whatsoever on them which I believe is against your rules / guidelines. Thank you and thank you for Vesna for recommending this mailing list for me. I just imagine a day we rely on blacklists and rely more on providers fixing the problems themselves, rather than having any incompetent government intervene to cause more problems to "fix the problem" -- --C "The dumber people think you are, the more surprised they're going to be when you kill them." - Sir William Clayton