- anti-abuse-wg - mailman.ripe.net

Re: [anti-abuse-wg] [db-wg] objection to RIPE policy proposal
by Marilson 04 Mar '16

04 Mar '16

Hello I am also impressed and concerned with the old, inopportune and improper posture of the gentlemen Randy Bush and Gert Doering. Denis, it is gratifying to hear someone concerned about the future of the Internet and with the exponential increase in the abuse. Greed, not wanting to plagiarize Gordon Gekko, reigns absolute and moves the wheels of the global economy. The agenda is: cheat as much as you can, just try not to get caught. HSBC and Volkswagen are the portrait of this posture unethical where the end, profit, justifies the means. You all have the opportunity to do the right thing. How do you want to be remembered? Or you start a remediation process of such abuses or will be done by rulers (governments) pressured by the world's population. Thanks Marilson

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Cleanup work for "abuse-mailbox:" in certain ORGANISATION objects, following policy 2011-06
by Tim Bruijnzeels 04 Mar '16

04 Mar '16

Dear working group, As you know, the RIPE NCC completed the work for the 2011-06 policy on 15 February, and "abuse-c:" is now added to all organisations that hold resources allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC. Going forward we propose to: - Remove "abuse-mailbox:" for all ORGANISATION objects that *have* "abuse-c:" in a one-off operation - Introduce a business rule to prevent adding "abuse-mailbox:" to ORGANISATION objects, urging people to use "abuse-c:" instead Please note that the proposal above does not force anyone to use "abuse-c:", it just enforces that "abuse-c:" is used instead of "abuse-mailbox:". Having both attributes on an ORGANISATION object is extremely confusing, and currently updating "abuse-mailbox:" does not work in the LIR Portal organisation object editor. We therefore believe that the cleanup is needed, and we hope that this will not be controversial. We would like to ask the working group for the mandate to do the cleanup proposed above. Originally the intent was to clean up "abuse-mailbox:" on all objects (except in abuse-c roles) and possibly IRT objects. However, we are fully aware that more controversy exists here. There is a lot of discussion about whether "abuse-c:" can be mandatory for organisations holding legacy resources (2016-01). Questions are being raised about the data model. We are following these discussions with interest and we believe that this part of the originally proposed cleanup should be put on hold until we have a more clear direction from those discussions. Kind regards, Tim Bruijnzeels Assistant Manager Software Engineering RIPE NCC Database Group

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Biggest problem today: See attached file
by turgut kalfaoğlu 04 Mar '16

04 Mar '16

As the manager of a busy Linux server, the biggest threat to my users is coming from virus-carrying emails. Unfortunately virus scanners are often unable to keep up with them, and I get several a day. They either appear as an invoice to be paid "see attached .doc file, see attached .pdf file", or as a link "click here to see your detailed telecom invoice". The regular spam is down to a minimum these days, if one uses all available tools, which I am. Regards, Turgut Kalfaoglu turgut(a)trearn.bitnet :)

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Re: [anti-abuse-wg] [db-wg] objection to RIPE policy proposal 2016-01
by Gert Doering 03 Mar '16

03 Mar '16

Hi, On Thu, Mar 03, 2016 at 12:56:05PM +0200, andre(a)ox.co.za wrote: > it is actually very simple: > > any rigorously correct resource allocation registry data must > include accurate abuse records. No. It needs to contain accurate records of who has been delegated responsibility for that (admin-c / org). abuse-c is a way to ease finding the *right* contacts instead of always having to write paper mail to the company CEO - and that makes sense, but it's a convenience to operators (as is tech-c), and in no means required for the function as registry. Which might conincide with the fact that the paperwork you sign when opening a LIR has no field for abuse-c... Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279

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RIPE NCC to set abuse-c for remaining organisation with ASNs or other resources allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC
by Tim Bruijnzeels 19 Feb '16

19 Feb '16

Dear working groups, As you know all organisations that have internet number resources allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC need to have an abuse-c attribute according to policy 2011-06. The following implementation plan was communicated for this policy: https://labs.ripe.net/Members/kranjbar/implementation-details-of-policy-201… Phase 1 of this plan was completed in December 2013, setting up abuse-c for then existing LIRs. Phase 2 of this plan was completed for organisations holding sponsored PI resources in November 2014. However, since then LIRs and end-users have been responsible for ensuring that an abuse-c exists for their organisation. In practice it has proven difficult to enforce this, since abuse-c is not a mandatory attribute in the RIPE DB schema, and as a result new cases where organisations do not have an abuse contact have been created. There is an important change in the implementation we would like to do – based on our experiences thus far – which would like the community's mandate on. We propose to use the end-user organisation's email address instead of the sponsoring LIR email address. We believe there are valid reasons for this change, but of course if this suggested change is controversial we would encourage discussing it in the anti-abuse working group. Ideally, we need to have a decision on this by early January so that we can prepare the work. 1) Prevent NEW cases We want to ensure that no new cases will be created as follows: = Since 1 March, the new member application form already provides much better integration with the RIPE Database - because of this an abuse contact is now created whenever a new LIR is activated - it can be modified the LIR, e.g. using web-updates, but not removed = We are currently adapting the new create organisation webupdates form to include abuse-c by default allowing the user to: - reference an existing abuse-c role object, or - enter an email address to create an abuse-c role for the organisation (using the same maintainer) = We are also adapting the edit organisation webupdates form to always suggest adding an abuse-c contact if it's not present = We plan to extend the new request forms: - check that an end-user organisation has abuse-c before it can be used - if not, refer to the edit form for the organisation where it will be easy to add reference an existing abuse contact, or create a new object 2) Resolve remaining EXISTING cases Originally the idea for phase 2 was to use the sponsoring LIR's email address in case the end-user organisation was unresponsive to requests to set their own abuse contact. However, since then policy 2012-08 has been implemented and nowadays the sponsoring LIR, and its abuse contact, can be found through the sponsoring-org attribute. Also, the RIPE NCC found that using the sponsoring organisation's email address leads to a number of issues: - end-users have no incentive to set their own abuse-c, rather then letting abuse questions go to their sponsor, so the majority remains unresponsive - in case an end-user has resources from more than one sponsor it is ambiguous which sponsor's email should be used - many LIRs were unpleasantly surprised by finding their email address in the abuse-c of the organisation they sponsor - in case LIRs no longer wish to sponsor resources, or when they are returned, existing references to their email in the end-user abuse-c are not cleaned up We would therefore like to propose a change to the implementation plan when addressing the remaining cases. Today, in case no abuse contact is set, users of the database will resort to using the organisation's default email. Therefore, adding a dedicated abuse-c role object using this email address, doesn't cause any noticeable new effects on organisations. It may well be the correct email address to use for an organisation, and no action would be required. However, it *enables* an organisation to use a different email address for abuse questions if appropriate. We would like to email remaining LIRs, and end-user organisations and sponsoring LIRs on Monday 1 February, giving them until Monday 15 February to set their abuse contact. We realise that this means we would have another delay, but we believe that it would be unwise to do this change over the end of year holiday period, and to ensure that we can give proper support to questions we want to avoid doing this at the same time as the start of the year invoicing. Please let us know what you think. Kind regards, Tim Bruijnzeels Assistant Manager Software Engineering RIPE NCC Database Group

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Reminder: 2016-01 New Policy Proposal (Include Legacy Internet Resource Holders in the Abuse-c Policy)
by Brian Nisbet 19 Feb '16

19 Feb '16

Colleagues, We're now a week away from the end of the initial discussion phase on 2016-01 and things have been a little quiet here of late. The Chairs would greatly appreciate more opinions and/or discussion of the policy and/or some of the specific suggested approaches. You can find the (very short) policy text here: https://www.ripe.net/participate/policies/proposals/2016-01 and you can find the specific approaches in the recent mails to the list. Thanks, Brian Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG -- Brian Nisbet, Network Operations Manager HEAnet Limited, Ireland's Education and Research Network 1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin 1 Registered in Ireland, no 275301 tel: +35316609040 fax: +35316603666 web: http://www.heanet.ie/

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Abuse Contact Data Sets Document Published
by Brian Nisbet 11 Feb '16

11 Feb '16

Colleagues, Thank you for the feedback and conversation around the Abuse Contact Data Sets document. A lot of this has been incorporated, along with a few other tweaks, into the final version of the document which has now been published as RIPE-658 and can be found here: https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-658 Of course there will be other iterations of this document as things change. Thanks also to the three authors, L. Aaron Kaplan, Mirjam Kühne and Christian Teuschel. Brian Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG -- Brian Nisbet, Network Operations Manager HEAnet Limited, Ireland's Education and Research Network 1st Floor, 5 George's Dock, IFSC, Dublin 1 Registered in Ireland, no 275301 tel: +35316609040 fax: +35316603666 web: http://www.heanet.ie/

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Updated Document: Abuse Contact Data Sets
by Brian Nisbet 10 Feb '16

10 Feb '16

Colleagues, The group working on this document (L. Aaron Kaplan, Mirjam Kühne, Christian Teuschel) have produced a new draft. This draft contains a number of updates, based on feedback from the community. The main changes are: - clarified terminology such as abuse handler, security incident, registrant, national CERT, etc. - clarified problem statement - removed specific mentioning of name-based services in the problem statement - used "European" examples - added API details for Nation CSIRT DB - elaborated on conclusion and next steps This document was sent to me earlier in the week, but for various reasons I didn't manage to forward it on to you all until now. With the TF-CSIRT meeting happening next week it would be great if we could gather any further feedback before the end of this week, but I realise that is quite a short term period, for which I apologise. So I'm not proposing a hard cut-off by end of day on Friday, but I think it would be extremely useful if people could try to post to the list before then. This would hopefully allow the authors to go to the TF-CSIRT meeting with a very nearly final draft and then complete it shortly afterwards. Certainly I would propose no more than a working week to receive other feedback, so we'd be looking at the end of Wednesday 27th. Thanks, Brian Co-Chair, RIPE AA-WG

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Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2016-01 New Policy Proposal (Include Legacy Internet Resource Holders in the Abuse-c Policy)
by Marco Schmidt 02 Feb '16

02 Feb '16

Hi Piotr, We’re happy to outline some high-level approaches for how we might meet the requirements of the proposal. Please note that details of the actual implementation and potential limitations will need further study and will be covered in the impact analysis. We will seek guidance from the RIPE community on which particular approach it would like us to take — whether this ends up being a variation on one of the approaches mentioned below, or something different altogether. With this in mind, we would like to share the following information to support the WG’s discussion. The RIPE Database currently contains ~70,200 inetnum objects and ~700 aut-num objects with the status LEGACY. Of these, around 11,900 have an organisation object referenced, with around 3,900 of these organisation objects having an abuse-c attribute in place. This means that around 17% of the resource objects have an organisation object and around 5.5% have a reference to an abuse contact. One possible approach could be to add the abuse-c attribute to existing organisation objects. This could be done in a similar way to how it was done for resources that were allocated or assigned by the RIPE NCC. Resources without an organisation object would not have an abuse contact. The mandatory database update that Erik mentioned could be another possible approach. Whenever a resource with the status LEGACY is updated, it must have a reference to an organisation object with the abuse-c attribute to perform this update. Resources that are not updated will not get an abuse contact. A third approach would add abuse-c references to all organisation objects held by legacy holders. The RIPE NCC would need to contact these holders of 67,000 objects, of which 59,000 have no organisation object. Taking into account our experience from implementing 2007-01, “Direct Internet Resource Assignments to End Users from the RIPE NCC”, we would expect a significant amount of manual work with this approach. The RIPE NCC is currently unable to enforce updates on legacy resources. We hope this helps with your discussion of the proposal. Kind regards Marco Schmidt Policy Development Officer RIPE NCC On Thu, Jan 28, 2016 at 18:49:41 +0100, Piotr Strzyzewski wrote: > On Thu, Jan 28, 2016 at 10:06:50AM +0100, Marco Schmidt wrote: > > Marco > > > A new RIPE Policy proposal, "Include Legacy Internet Resource > Holders in > > the Abuse-c Policy", is now available for discussion. > > > > The goal of this proposal is to extend RIPE Document ripe-563, "Abuse > > Contact Management in the RIPE Database", to Legacy Internet Resource > > Holders. > > > > You can find the full proposal at: > > > > https://www.ripe.net/participate/policies/proposals/2016-01 > > > > We encourage you to review this proposal and send your comments to > > <anti-abuse-wg at ripe.net> before 26 February 2016. > > Would you be so kind and publish possible approaches to deal with the > requirements of this proposal. It will be a benefit for the members of > this WG to see how NCC perceive this proposal. > > Thanks in advance, > Piotr > > -- > gucio -> Piotr Strzyżewski > E-mail: Piotr.Strzyzewski at polsl.pl

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2016-01 New Policy Proposal (Include Legacy Internet Resource Holders in the Abuse-c Policy)
by Marco Schmidt 31 Jan '16

31 Jan '16

Dear colleagues, A new RIPE Policy proposal, "Include Legacy Internet Resource Holders in the Abuse-c Policy", is now available for discussion. The goal of this proposal is to extend RIPE Document ripe-563, "Abuse Contact Management in the RIPE Database", to Legacy Internet Resource Holders. You can find the full proposal at: https://www.ripe.net/participate/policies/proposals/2016-01 We encourage you to review this proposal and send your comments to <anti-abuse-wg(a)ripe.net> before 26 February 2016. Regards Marco Schmidt Policy Development Officer RIPE NCC

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